McClean

[Big Saft Kid]

I have been reading the posts on James McClean (again!) with interest. A few words of background to put my views in context. My father was Irish and I have lived in Ireland since 1973. My father 's uncle died in the First World Word War and he himself volunteered for the RAF (despite his father having been in the IRA in the War of Independence) and served in Bomber Command as a rear gunner in Lancasters, completing 32 missions- a pretty impressive feat of survival!
After the war he rejoined the RAF and served for many years but ultimately came back here to live. I followed shortly afterwards. At a time when wearing the poppy was not the cleverest of ideas here- and poppies hard to find- I often wore one; my father sometimes wore one. When he died the British Legion in Ireland sent a wreath and representatives to his funeral, which we very much appreciated. I still put a few bob in the British Legion collection boxes, which are a bit easier to find now. However, I don't wear a poppy any more, though I may again at some stage. Mostly this is because I have been put off by the poppy police. It should be something you want to do, not something that that is forced on everyone. It seemed to have started something over a decade ago when suddenly everyone on TV was wearing one and then it spread to football jerseys. I find it distinctly odd to see a complete team of foreign players wearing poppied jerseys. It takes away any symbolism or any deeper meaning from wearing them.
I am still grateful to the RAF for my father's years there and to the British Legion for their kindness. However, I firmly believe James McClean is entitled to his opinion on this and actually admire his courage in standing by his principles in not wearing the jersey. Yes, he earns his living in England, but a workman is worthy of his wages; they are not conditional on his allegiances. He is not a terrorist or a member of the IRA: if he were so or vociferously supported them then I would have a different view. He comes from Creggan in Derry and has considerable loyalty to his home place and for that he does deserve respect. He is also not the best footballer around, but I know that, certainly when he plays for Ireland (which does indicate his broader loyalties I guess), no one works harder or puts more of themselves into the game. I go to most of the Ireland games and I have moved from thinking him not worth his place to realising that he is an influential player on the pitch, particularly when the team has to dig in hard to stay in the game. Surprisingly he can inspire other players and the crowd. However, my post is not about his footballing skills but more about the complexities of poppy wearing. It is not mandatory, neither should it ever be. One day I will wear one again with pride for my father, but not until it is no longer de rigeur but is something that is done willingly and from the heart by those who wish to wear them for their own reasons.

Brilliant thoughtful post from someone whose family was in the thick of it, putting to shame some of the brain-dead knee-jerk chauvinists who have paraded their ignorance on this thread.

 

[luckyjim]

Interesting you say that because although everybody knows about the attempt to blow up parliament, most of the population has no idea that it was based in the pan-European catholic v protestant conflict of the time. I find it odd that such a major theme in UK politics is hardly taught in schools. Hussshhhh! ;-)

At least it would put Brexit in a more historical context; that England's/Britain's/the UK's interaction with Europe on the basis of its geographical proximity (creating a unique Anglophone political culture) has waxed and waned over the centuries and is nothing remarkable. Perhaps the statist EU is merely another manifestation of Catholic Absolutism and that the attitudes of the English/British towards how they're governed has always been different to Europeans. I think the marriage of Ethelred the Unready has a lot to answer for.

 

[Coshamwolves]

McClean needs to read up on the actual events of that day. That probably wouldn't change his stance though, as he knows he`s lauded for doing this. So much ignorance.
I`m a NI Vet.. Iam also Catholic and wear the Poppy, like so many of my colleagues.
Feel free to delete this post Mods.

 

[reanswolf]

I know there is such a sad, bad history between Great Britain and Ireland.

But I also know that although we are each proud of, and patriotic to our respective nations, we actually have so much in common and get on so well with each other.

 

[Deleted member 5962]

I know there is such a sad, bad history between Great Britain and Ireland.

But I also know that although we are each proud of, and patriotic to our respective nations, we actually have so much in common and get on so well with each other.

On a lighter note, I do appreciate the irony of English people expecting me to be an alcoholic when they find out I'm actually Irish, when I'm sat there thinking the same of them...

 

[Deleted member 3573J]

First of all, thank you for serving in the armed forces.
Secondly, no intent to insult anyone and I did start off by saying he has a right to his opinions.
However I do find it ironic that someone can live in and make a very good living from a country that they have no respect for.

He represents West Brom, he's not representing Britain or playing for the British army so hasn't disrespected anyone. We have a choice if we buy a poppy or not off a seller in town or the supermarket, this is him having his choice.

The poppy embroidered on the shirt that's come in during recent years is absolute nonsense anyway and makes a mockery of the poppy symbol, the players walk into the dressing room, shirts already hanging up, I bet there's a large percentage of them who don't even notice them on the shirt at first. If someone chooses to wear a poppy, it can be a paper one, the new fancy metal one or a home made one as big as their head, then good for them, they've made a conscious decision to buy it and display it on their top. Putting on a shirt with a poppy sewn in is not doing that.

At least McClean has actually thought about it and given his reason, in comparison last year Hector Bellerin wore a poppy on a call of duty t-shirt while promoting the game. I wouldn't blame him entirely, perhaps it was already on the t-shirt but it showed that little thought is put into displaying them a lot of the time.

 

[Wolvesfcneil]

Lol what?

"Lest we forget" "we will remember them"

But McClean should get over Bloody Sunday because it happened before he was born?

We are trying to get over the past troubles people like McClean on both sides keep it going what about the la mon house hotel bombing the Omagh bombing things happened to a lot of people most of us are trying to move on people like him wont let us and don't forget if your english he hates you with all his passion believe me so think twice about defending someone who glorifies terrorism

 

[Wolvesfcneil]

Its such a sensitive subject inevitably, but there was no excuse for British imperialism really, I personally think we should give Northern Ireland back to Ireland, Gibraltar back to Spain, and maybe the Falklands back to Argentina. But of course that affects thousands of people loyal to the Crown who will feel differently. And also that stance might upset our own servicemen who have lost friends fighting for those causes.

But sometimes you just have to look at right and wrong in a cold light of day.
We shouldn't really be there.

But that's why I'm not a politician making important decisions -/

The Irish dont want us back or cant afford us back most Catholics i know dont want it its inner city ghettos that go on about it and border towns not ordinary hard working people most of us just want to live in peace and look after are familes and do your really think any of us want to pay 100 euro every time we visit a and e i doubt it

 

[Wolvesfcneil]

Some people get me wrong i dont care if he wears a thousand poppies or none its his beliefs i hate the guy is just a horrible person period

 

[ricki herberts moustache]

Same thread every year

Is their any point discussing this?

You're right, there's no point so I'm off back to the cellic thread to have a ruckus

 

[Mugwump]

While i dont have an issue with anyone who does or doesnt wear a poppy, i find his attitude annoying to the whole situation. How are people ever going to move forward by clinging onto the past.

 

[Vietnam Wolf]

I find the bloke objectionable.

Anyone who doesn't believe he does all this to seek attention needs to check the footage when he turned his back when the National Anthem was played during a WBA friendly game.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...-much-he-should-leave-the-Premier-League.html

 

[Wagstaffe Was Magic]

While i dont have an issue with anyone who does or doesnt wear a poppy, i find his attitude annoying to the whole situation. How are people ever going to move forward by clinging onto the past.

You don't agree with the Remembrance concept?

 

[Mugwump]

I do, totally agree with it, but i think you can still respect and honor whats gone before without it having a negative impact on whats to come in the future.

Like i said, its Mcleans choice what he does, same as its my choice or your choice what we do. I understand his point of view, but i'm not convinced what he is trying to achieve by it and dont agree with him doing it. The poppy represents far more than just what happened in January 1972.

 

[TurboTaco91]

Its poppy fascism forcing him to wear it. He's voiced his opinions every year as to why he won't wear it.