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Bust up

Hoganstolemywife

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I've changed my tune a little in light of this bust up being confirmed. A club can't function if the players don't trust the manager. He clearly deserves more time because he's done a 7/10 job (even if our xG doesnt tally with our position), but if the players and he don't get on, there isn't much more to say. You can't get an entirely new team.
 

jrpb-3

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Not sure you're correct.

20/21 season.

22 deficits, 21 points gained (W4 D9 L9) (source: Transfermkt) - best in the league.

This season, 3 points gained - worst in the league.

Something seriously wrong somewhere.
could well be what I was remembering was from season before or only part the season as those stats do show a lot of comebacks
 

WickedWolfie

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he had lost the ball and tried to engineer a foul. but he is no Jota who was/is expert at it. instead his attemopt at trying to win a foul backfired. if it was a genuine 1 on 1 i would have no problem but it wasnt
That is an interesting, no unique even, take on the incident. It is possible that you have marvellous football insight and saw something that everyone, including all of the expert pundits, missed. It is rather more likely that your theory is utter rubbish.
 

WickedWolfie

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If its true and there's been a bust up there are 3 solutions.

1. Everyone kisses and makes up - unlikely
2. Bruno goes - short term results improve, long term when things dip it happens again
3. Players go - shows the group that they don't hold the power but if the replacements aren't right then could slide down the table next season
If there has been a bust up virtually no outcome is positive.
 

WickedWolfie

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We know you don't like the bloke (for what ever reason) but let's be clear he clearly isn't thick.... He is a Premier League manager who has won a major trophy for Benfica and had many years in coaching...While you may disagree with things he does it is far from fair and is disrespectful to call him thick..
I don't dislike him, l'm just not convinced by him in a head coach role. Actually you are right, my wording was inappropriate. What l should have said is that he lacks self-awareness.
 

Martin Riggs

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I have sympathy for both parties if this is true. Bruno clearly wanted to play with a more attacking style, which we saw in the first 3 games but just doesn't have the defence to do it and wasn't backed by the owners, so I get his frustration. I also get the frustration of the players who don't want to defend for 90 minutes in the majority of the other 35 games.

Fosun need to sort themselves out, it's a shambles at the moment after a very promising start. They built some really solid foundations in their first 3 years but are in danger of letting it all crumble away.
 

WickedWolfie

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Minimum I expect is 100% effort and that wasn't there by all them yesterday. There were plenty of examples throughout the match.

That is not good enough.

What defence do people have for that?
I agree and none.
 

WickedWolfie

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Can't agree entirely with that, first half I paid particular attention to what Silva and Hwang were doing, they continually made runs into space but those behind them either dawdling on the ball or simply not even looking forward to play the pass. They were clear open options but the mentality isn't there to make those passes.
That is a fair comment. In Nuno's early years we mixed things up, looking to play the early ball on occasion (just as Brighton did to us yesterday). It's been a long time since we did that.
 

WickedWolfie

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I think had goals against more closely aligned with xG against (i.e. if Jose Sa wasn't such a revelation), we'd be much closer to last season's position. Did I read right that, barring Villa Park, not only have we lost every game we've gone behind in, we've not even scored a goal? That is a revolting statistic, seeing as we were the comeback kings two years ago.
Absolutely
 

WickedWolfie

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I want to know who makes the Wolves subs..
Someone claimed last week that Bruno doesn't make the changes on good authority.

Cannot remember who made that claim.
If it isn't Lage (and l don't believe that) it sure as hell isn't Jeff if the Mix is to believed - there is no way that he'd substitute Fabio particularly in two games where he'd arguably been our best player at the time.
 

WickedWolfie

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Coady is always calling for the ball and increasingly gets it as players opt for the safe option. It makes us so easy to play against, it’s the opposite of the Blitzkrieg approach with Jota and Raul breaking fast.
Reflects a lack of confidence perhaps. If Coady is the only one making himself available.....
 

jrpb-3

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If its true and there's been a bust up there are 3 solutions.

1. Everyone kisses and makes up - unlikely
2. Bruno goes - short term results improve, long term when things dip it happens again
3. Players go - shows the group that they don't hold the power but if the replacements aren't right then could slide down the table next season
should do what Brian Clough said he would do if there was a disagreement. Sit down and have a good discussion with the player(s) and then decide to agree that he was right. :)
 

Ponty

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Reflects a lack of confidence perhaps. If Coady is the only one making himself available.....
Coady’s position means he’s nearly always available. The movement from other players is poor and has got worse as our midfield and wide players so rarely attempt a threaded pass. Silva always shows but even he must get frustrated when run after run is ignored. Semedo is the worst offender, breaks down the line then stops, looks up briefly then invariably plays the ball backwards killing all the momentum he had gained.
 

WickedWolfie

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should do what Brian Clough said he would do if there was a disagreement. Sit down and have a good discussion with the player(s) and then decide to agree that he was right. :)
I think Clough (and Fergie) were among the last of a dying breed.
 

Manic88

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Ha, brilliant, I must be an armchair fan? Well your uninformed opinion of me doesn't change the facts either. I checked, we were never below 14th, we gained 17 points in the first 1/3 of the season and 28 in the other 2/3. That's not great, but still not relegation form. I'm not saying it was a good watch (like you presumably on lockdown TV), but the idea that we've done much better this season simply isn't true. We've had some good performances and some good results, but not many of either.

Well I was giving you an excuse - if you want to tell me you watched every minute and just know bobbins about football fair enough.

We got 3 points when Adama toe punted the winner off the bar then the keeper - that doesn’t change the fact we were awful that game it just means we were lucky. If you don’t understand the difference fair play but the world must be a confusing place for you.
 

jrpb-3

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I think Clough (and Fergie) were among the last of a dying breed.
certainly the dynamics between players and managers have changed significantly in recent years ( some for the better some for the worse I guess)
 

Manic88

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If its true and there's been a bust up there are 3 solutions.

1. Everyone kisses and makes up - unlikely
2. Bruno goes - short term results improve, long term when things dip it happens again
3. Players go - shows the group that they don't hold the power but if the replacements aren't right then could slide down the table next season

I said last season only options 2 or 3 could fix the mess we were in.

I don’t think we have the funds for option 3 so that could be curtains for Bruno
 

WickedWolfie

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certainly the dynamics between players and managers have changed significantly in recent years ( some for the better some for the worse I guess)
There are, at least in the PL, very few managers now. They are called head coach for a reason - they just don't have the amount of control and latitude of the old time managers.
 

Manic88

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There are, at least in the PL, very few managers now. They are called head coach for a reason - they just don't have the amount of control and latitude of the old time managers.

Clough & Fergie knew they were more valuable than any one player.

Quite a few of our squad earn more than Bruno.

For all the blah blah blah if someone is paid more than you it’s because they’re rarer & more valued, that makes it very hard for a manager to win this kind of battle.
 

Wall heath Wanderer

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At the end of the day, training ground bust/disagreeing with tactics or not liking the gaffer doesn't excuse anyone being paid by the club from doing their best to win a game of football.
The players need to realise that they get paid stupid amounts of money to represent the fans too, and that whilst we will take losses we will not accept a lacklustre performance intentionally made to make a point (if that is what has occurred).
Player power needs to be curtailed throughout the game, ship out the bad apples and rebuild during the summer is the way to go. We just need fosun to show some backbone and financial support.
 

CologneWolf

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Having accused other folk of the same in the past l suppose that it was inevitable that it would happen happen to me at some point.
You are actually in the clear here. This was for Rhos.

Don’t get me wrong having an agenda is perfectly fine. The klaxon only goes off when the accusation of an agenda is levelled

And yes, for any one wondering I am quite aware that I am a ********.
 
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WickedWolfie

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You are actually in the clear here. This was for Rhos.

Don’t get me wrong having an agenda is perfectly fine. The klaxon only goes off when the accusation of an agenda is levelled

And yes, for any one wondering I am quite aware that I am a d**khead.
Sorry. I meant that l had used the "a" word (and got your image as a result, lol) towards others so expressing views which some would not agree with was always likely to end up as it did.
 

kidder_wolf_II

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It’s all about to go pear shaped for us, isn’t it?

That depends on Fosun

Firstly I believe Bruno has been stitched up and not backed by Shi in the windows and the players are downing tools just like they did last season as they don’t agree with the negative tactics. Are Nuno and Bruno just genuinely negative or just playing it safe with the squad of players they have is up for debate.

However regardless of how Childish certain players are acting over training methods I think we need a manager who can instantly earn the players respect and has no issues with shipping out any big names who fail to fall in line
 
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