VAR

[Very Proud (AKA Still Proud)]

At some point a team will walk off the pitch, it really needs that kind of action to spark a proper protest.

 

[Monketron]

Italian VAR decision.

This goal was ruled offside, presumably because the VAR officials missed the Juve player who played them all onside by 5 yards!

Michele di Deano?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1569086065234911233

3 players and a manager got sent off because of the goal too then it gets wrongly disallowed, absolutely amazing scenes.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1569068092445134851

 

[Bradmore Wolf]

3 players and a manager got sent off because of the goal too then it gets wrongly disallowed, absolutely amazing scenes.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1569068092445134851

Amazing! Why do you say wrongly disallowrd though? Clearly offside and in the middle of goal ' surely affecting play

 

[Monketron]

Amazing! Why do you say wrongly disallowrd though? Clearly offside and in the middle of goal ' surely affecting play

Check the post I replied to. There was a player on the near side playing them all on-side but VAR somehow missed him cos they were so focused on the players in the box. Huge mistake.

 

[WeAreTheWolvesII]

Amazing! Why do you say wrongly disallowrd though? Clearly offside and in the middle of goal ' surely affecting play

There was actually a player near the corner kick taker out of picture that was playing him onside but those running VAR missed that and drew the line from the incorrect player.

 

[WeAreTheWolvesII]

The Juventus example (it's hard to feel any sympathy for them by the way) is once again pure incompetence from a human.

VAR gets taken away from what it is. A chance to see a replay of an action to make a more informed decision. It clearly should work and if it isn't, the blame needs to be placed on those who are not making it work.

I think the overall negativity it receives is purely down to fans not really remembering how bad it was.

If Wolves lost to Man City in the 90th minute to an offside goal on Saturday there would be outrage. Some on here would have you believe the response would be 'ah well, congrats City, at least their fans got to celebrate'

Give fans three weeks of no VAR and they would be demanding it comes back. I know people will argue this point but I genuinely believe that would be the case.

It's a fact that more correct decisions are now made. The emotion excuse is what most cling to now but in reality it doesn't change a thing, people still celebrate despite what they say on here, you can't help it.

 

[Bradmore Wolf]

Check the post I replied to. There was a player on the near side playing them all on-side but VAR somehow missed him cos they were so focused on the players in the box. Huge mistake.

Ahh I see- apologies

 

[OoohRobbieRobbie]

Amazing! Why do you say wrongly disallowrd though? Clearly offside and in the middle of goal ' surely affecting play

Sorry, sorry - forget the fact that the other angle shows that player near the corner flag playing everyone on for a moment - even without that knowledge, Bonucci is not even REMOTLEY affecting play. There is one simple way to figure that out. Watch the replay now, and look for a single reaction form (most importantly) the Salernitana goalkeeper, then from any other defender.

Not to mention the fact that the speed and accuracy of the header from Milik was the only thing ANY SINGLE PERSON IN THAT ENTIRE STADIUM including the 23 people on the pitch, were looking at.

 

[WolfLing]

Sheesh.

Just goes back to the point that VAR has done nothing to remove the issue of contentious decisions. At least before VAR officials had the excuse that they were making decisions when the action was live.

No one questions the goal-line tech, as it is completely automated, so you have no Lee Mason-types dropping massive clangers.

Until we can completely automate offside calls, they should scrap it off.

 

[Watfordfc]

Apparently they didn’t see the angle that shows it !

What is the point if they aren’t getting all of the footage ?

 

[Oh When the Wolves]

It has to go. There’s no other answer

Absolute insane they can’t get it right when most fans can get each decision right

 

[bod101]

wouldn't it have also been a penalty then for the player almost having his shirt pulled off?

 

[S G Wolves]

Has Lee mason been removed from profressional sport after the errors last weekend?

Nope just got a pay rise and promotion

 

[Frank Lincoln]

The Juventus example (it's hard to feel any sympathy for them by the way) is once again pure incompetence from a human.

VAR gets taken away from what it is. A chance to see a replay of an action to make a more informed decision. It clearly should work and if it isn't, the blame needs to be placed on those who are not making it work.

I think the overall negativity it receives is purely down to fans not really remembering how bad it was.

If Wolves lost to Man City in the 90th minute to an offside goal on Saturday there would be outrage. Some on here would have you believe the response would be 'ah well, congrats City, at least their fans got to celebrate'

Give fans three weeks of no VAR and they would be demanding it comes back. I know people will argue this point but I genuinely believe that would be the case.

It's a fact that more correct decisions are now made. The emotion excuse is what most cling to now but in reality it doesn't change a thing, people still celebrate despite what they say on here, you can't help it.

If VAR was scrapped tomorrow, I can assure you that I would not ever demand its return. It is an abomination that has ruined the game.

 

[WickedWolfie]

If VAR was scrapped tomorrow, I can assure you that I would not ever demand its return. It is an abomination that has ruined the game.

Bloody fencesitter - say what you really think!!!

 

[King Henry VIII]

It's a fact that more correct decisions are now made.

Do you have a source for this? If so I'd be very interested in it.

Also, I would say the "user experience" is quite important in professional football. The sport only exists in it's professional form due to supporters being willing to pay to watch.

The vast majority of its current funding comes from TV revenue, sponsorship, and match day attendance. Mess with things too much so that the cost is not outweighed by the positives of "the product" and you may find yourself in a downward spiral that is extremely difficult to recover from (see Netflix et al).

 

[WeAreTheWolvesII]

Do you have a source for this? If so I'd be very interested in it.

Also, I would say the "user experience" is quite important in professional football. The sport only exists in it's professional form due to supporters being willing to pay to watch.

The vast majority of its current funding comes from TV revenue, sponsorship, and match day attendance. Mess with things too much so that the cost is not outweighed by the positives of "the product" and you may find yourself in a downward spiral that is extremely difficult to recover from (see Netflix et al).

Has VAR worked? Statistics behind worldwide use show positives

Since its first use in England in January, the benefits of VAR have been a hot topic of debate. Will it work? Is it even worth it? Or do we just need to be more patient?

www.skysports.com

This is from a few years ago but I would say it's the same. (Gone from 93% to 98.8% correct call according to that) To be fair, a large increase in correct decisions will come from offsides, but nonetheless, with VAR we are getting more right decisions.

I agree the user experience is important but many moaned before VAR. In fact, I think the vast majority were in favour of VAR before it was introduced, of course will be hard to get people to admit that now.
Remember people at the time said it would stop the talking points down the pubs haha!!

 

[Me Babbies]

at least its not just our VAR that's incompetent

 

[King Henry VIII]

Has VAR worked? Statistics behind worldwide use show positives

Since its first use in England in January, the benefits of VAR have been a hot topic of debate. Will it work? Is it even worth it? Or do we just need to be more patient?

www.skysports.com

This is from a few years ago but I would say it's the same. (Gone from 93% to 98.8% correct call according to that) To be fair, a large increase in correct decisions will come from offsides, but nonetheless, with VAR we are getting more right decisions.

I agree the user experience is important but many moaned before VAR. In fact, I think the vast majority were in favour of VAR before it was introduced, of course will be hard to get people to admit that now.
Remember people at the time said it would stop the talking points down the pubs haha!!

Cheers. I'd not seen that before. A fairly interesting read but it seems to be a regurgitation of IFABs own media package on VAR as shared at the 132nd general meeting.

It seems the data has come from an independent study by KU Leuven, but I can't find the actual paper anywhere online. I'd be interested to know some more detail about how they assessed the accuracy improvements. Maybe they ended up with the same tedious arguments about whether a pixel in an armpit is farther ahead than an oppo player's big toe that we've been bothered with these past few years and considered it a success.

I also found it interesting that IFAB stated that the philosophy was: minimum interference - maximum benefit. Do you feel they have achieved that?

It seems the study was based on 972 games across several different leagues. This could skew things massively as I imagine the speed and nature of the game will be quite different in the Qatari and Saudi leagues than it will in the Premier League of Serie A and so the amount and type of reviews could vary massively.

I can't speak for the use of VAR across other leagues, but in the Premier League it feels like the implementation is especially poor; in particular VAR and on pitch reviews.

Personally, I've never been in favour of VAR as to me it just shifts the problem of our officiating back one further later removed. Now, instead of all the moaning about the poor decision on the pitch we are morning about the poor decision on a portakabin somewhere. I also do agree that it does impact on the supporters experience, event if it may only be negligible on average.

However, if anyone can produce an updated study to show that it has improved overall officiating, particularly in one of the top leagues, to a significant degree (such as the 5% gain in the 2018 study) I could be convinced of its value.

 

[Oh When the Wolves]

The most frustrating things are

- fans in the stadium not knowing what’s going on

- the delay.

- the principle that the ref only looks after 5 minutes, if it’s considered an error

It simply has to work like rugby, ref asks to take a look at something - they get it on the big screeen where the ref watches it and makes a judgement himself, then makes a decision. Also mic the ref up for these parts of play so people can hear the justification.

There also needs to be a time limit . 30 seconds of video. Where videos are played for over this time, it’s clear a mistake isn’t obvious (or the ref is simply incompetent like the Juventus example and needs dropping for a period of time)

This would make it so much better , transparent and quicker

They should be getting to more right decisions, but it’s the pain it takes to get to the right decision that it takes away the joy of football.

It’s different in rugby or cricket where there’s a lot more tries / wickets. One goal in football can be a match , or league winning moment. For this reason, and the fact refs still make some inexcusable wrong decisions - VAR has to go . It’s making the game worse as a spectacle

 

[Contrarian]

Cheers. I'd not seen that before. A fairly interesting read but it seems to be a regurgitation of IFABs own media package on VAR as shared at the 132nd general meeting.

It seems the data has come from an independent study by KU Leuven, but I can't find the actual paper anywhere online. I'd be interested to know some more detail about how they assessed the accuracy improvements. Maybe they ended up with the same tedious arguments about whether a pixel in an armpit is farther ahead than an oppo player's big toe that we've been bothered with these past few years and considered it a success.

I also found it interesting that IFAB stated that the philosophy was: minimum interference - maximum benefit. Do you feel they have achieved that?

It seems the study was based on 972 games across several different leagues. This could skew things massively as I imagine the speed and nature of the game will be quite different in the Qatari and Saudi leagues than it will in the Premier League of Serie A and so the amount and type of reviews could vary massively.

I can't speak for the use of VAR across other leagues, but in the Premier League it feels like the implementation is especially poor; in particular VAR and on pitch reviews.

Personally, I've never been in favour of VAR as to me it just shifts the problem of our officiating back one further later removed. Now, instead of all the moaning about the poor decision on the pitch we are morning about the poor decision on a portakabin somewhere. I also do agree that it does impact on the supporters experience, event if it may only be negligible on average.

However, if anyone can produce an updated study to show that it has improved overall officiating, particularly in one of the top leagues, to a significant degree (such as the 5% gain in the 2018 study) I could be convinced of its value.

Whether a decision is correct or incorrect is still subjective, though. The study could just say that after examination, all VAR calls were 100% correct. Exactly what Peter Walton says, for example.

Any decision we think is incorrect (eg Moutinho penalty v Man City), the study could say is just biased fans whinging and clearly his arm is in an unnatural position and it's another brilliant decision by VAR.

It's the difference between a truly objective decision and a subjective one. Though they can measure offsides, there is no meter, no machine, no measurer, that can tell whether a handball or any other foul is correct or not. Tripped or a dive? Sorry, but it will *always* be a subjective decision. Whether made by an on pitch ref, VAR official or study. Always subjective and always some will say it should go one way and some the other way. Can't get rid of it and VAR is a total sham to try and pretend it can ever achieve it.

The best answer is well trained referees on pitch, with good officials on the touchline. Worked fine in the Europa league, if you recall. Other than the Sevilla goalie moving off the line for a crucial penalty- ironically something that VAR could prove, but didn't in that case, showing how useless it is.

VAR provides an illusion of objectivity that disappears to nothing, the more you look into it.

 

[JadeWolf]

Has VAR worked? Statistics behind worldwide use show positives

Since its first use in England in January, the benefits of VAR have been a hot topic of debate. Will it work? Is it even worth it? Or do we just need to be more patient?

www.skysports.com

This is from a few years ago but I would say it's the same. (Gone from 93% to 98.8% correct call according to that) To be fair, a large increase in correct decisions will come from offsides, but nonetheless, with VAR we are getting more right decisions.

I agree the user experience is important but many moaned before VAR. In fact, I think the vast majority were in favour of VAR before it was introduced, of course will be hard to get people to admit that now.
Remember people at the time said it would stop the talking points down the pubs haha!!

I’m happy to say I was in favour of VAR. It worked well at the World Cup in Russia. But that’s a totally different perspective watching on telly. As a fan in the stadium I hate VAR. I don’t particularly care how accurate it is, it is having a damaging effect on being a fan. I don’t think it’s helping the referees either, which I thought was kinda the point.