Time for changes.

[chignalwolf]

I think as this diving, cheating bad VAR decisions, poor Referees, has gone now past the point of being funny and will destroy our national sport. If it hasn't already. As one of the founder members and the club that every fan in English football rely on to lead from the front, I am starting a petition to say enough is enough.

We all seem to have a big gripe with this so lets stop it now, Once we get going I will put this on another clubs forum i uses so if anyone else wants to go ahead,
i wouldnt know how to do those poll things so this will have to do, or perhaps some clever mod could help lol

Your Choice is

1.Its time to stop this before it kills the game,

2. leave it as it is,

 

[Ginger Chimp]

1

 

[SingYourHeartsOut]

Live football for fans (remember?) VAR an absolute disaster.

TV football for neutrals, VAR a bit of a mess but ultimately probably better.

Guess which will win.

 

[chignalwolf]

Live football for fans (remember?) VAR an absolute disaster.

TV football for neutrals, VAR a bit of a mess but ultimately probably better.

Guess which will win.

so are you voting for .2. then, if the fans don't do something nobody will.

 

[SA Wolf]

Live football for fans (remember?) VAR an absolute disaster.

TV football for neutrals, VAR a bit of a mess but ultimately probably better.

Guess which will win.

Even for 'TV neutrals' like me, VAR is a shower of ****. Don't presume!

 

[bilstonwolf]

1

 

[SingYourHeartsOut]

so are you voting for .2. then, if the fans don't do something nobody will.

No absolutely not. It's ****, the offside part is particularly ****. I just don't expect it to change.

 

[OLDGOLD]

If it a choice from 1 and 2, I will go with 0....
Wind the clock back 20 years except for concussion protocols etc which should stay.

 

[John de Wolf's hairdryer]

If it a choice from 1 and 2, I will go with 0....
Wind the clock back 20 years except for concussion protocols etc which should stay.

Wind the clock back to before the EPL and Rupert Murdoch turning 'soccer' into a commodity to drive subscriptions and advertising for his media juggernaut in my view.

 

[chignalwolf]

No absolutely not. It's ****, the offside part is particularly ****. I just don't expect it to change.

OK I thought so, I don't expect it to change BUT if we don't try to get our game back who will, but we do hold the key, if the fans don't pay the piper there would be no music,

Keep VAR .but have people who actually know what they are talking about, especially people with no past history with football, clubs, or players.
Change this off side rule back to how it was.
If a player is proved to have dived even after the game an automatic 3 match ban,

 

[bigbadwolftoo]

1

I hope it isn't too late.

 

[WS10Wolf]

I’ve always been in the camp of giving VAR time to be tweaked and for match going supporters to get used to it.

However I’m now of the opinion that it should either be scrapped totally, or binned off until the referees aren’t all incompetent and can actually use it the way it was intended.

 

[WW1963]

People used to say that the only way to make changes in football was by voting with your feet. Well, not a single foot has been able to walk into a ground for a year.

Nothing has changed.

Really, the only way to change football is to stop subscribing to bloody SKY, BT and whoever else funds this clown show that we loosely call football.

A year without SKY et al receiving a penny would change things. Wages would have to come right down to the national average and transfer fees would be nominal.

The rewards for success are so ridiculously high that players (even our own) will cheat in order to climb the ladder of glory.

#stopfundingsky

 

[chignalwolf]

People used to say that the only way to make changes in football was by voting with your feet. Well, not a single foot has been able to walk into a ground for a year.

Nothing has changed.

Really, the only way to change football is to stop subscribing to bloody SKY, BT and whoever else funds this clown show that we loosely call football.

A year without SKY et al receiving a penny would change things. Wages would have to come right down to the national average and transfer fees would be nominal.

The rewards for success are so ridiculously high that players (even our own) will cheat in order to climb the ladder of glory.

#stopfundingsky

Spot on WW1963. Thats exactly where the trouble lye's ,
I think Murdock's cronies has football by the neck now. they said it would happen,

 

[chignalwolf]

Well this went down quicker than a Grealish triple somersault .LOL,
Perhaps Mr Sepp Blatter will join the campaign for fairer rules,

​

 

[SteveBullsKnee]

The biggest problems in football are so easily resolved but they wont be as the problems are caused by the people at the top.

1) Corruption in football - Blatter and Platini are prime examples of why it doesnt go away. Stop giving world cups and major tournaments to the country that puts the most in your back pocket
2) A break away super league - Easy, tell any club even thinking of it or evidence of talks behind closed doors, suspend them from ALL competition.
3) Diving - Empower referees to actually send players off for it. The first game abandoned as not enough players on the pitch would be the end of it
4) VAR. This in my opinion was just brought in for the TV channels, to keep you hooked and watching. Its the wrong sport for it. Its not tennis or Cricket where its a yes/no answer.

 

[Superted]

I have no issue with the principle of using available technology to try and make the right decisions. The problem is the implementation of it has been total nonsense.

What they should have done was have a root and branch review of the decisions made and any "unintended consequences" and looked at all the problems they've had and then write a comprehensive set of rules to suit the technology. Allowing for common sense and a MARGIN FOR ERROR. Those lines the use for offside **** me off no end because they treat them as absolute and I'm sorry, when you superimpose a line over a still frame from a standard video feed then blow it up until it's all pixellated and you can't tell precisely when the ball was played as it was in between two frames then there's no way you can treat it as 100% accurate.

I don't understand why they haven't gone to super slow-mo for this if that's how they want to use it.

Instead they've just bolted on changes on top of changes to existing laws, sent clarifications and tweaked procedures to try and solve the issues.

I just don't understand how it can be that difficult. If Rugby officials can make the right decisions with all that's going on in rucks, mauls, scrums etc. then I fail to see how football officials can make it so god damn difficult for themselves.

 

[chignalwolf]

Agree with all that, its always been such a simple game, but i suppose the top bods have to create work to justify their obscene wages and perks,
the hardest rule in football back in the day was explaining to her indoors the off side rule, Imaging explaining it now lol.

 

[chignalwolf]

The biggest problems in football are so easily resolved but they wont be as the problems are caused by the people at the top.

1) Corruption in football - Blatter and Platini are prime examples of why it doesnt go away. Stop giving world cups and major tournaments to the country that puts the most in your back pocket
2) A break away super league - Easy, tell any club even thinking of it or evidence of talks behind closed doors, suspend them from ALL competition.
3) Diving - Empower referees to actually send players off for it. The first game abandoned as not enough players on the pitch would be the end of it
4) VAR. This in my opinion was just brought in for the TV channels, to keep you hooked and watching. Its the wrong sport for it. Its not tennis or Cricket where its a yes/no answer.

Agree and very well put, greed and power is killing our game,

 

[wallace]

Agree with all that, its always been such a simple game, but i suppose the top bods have to create work to justify their obscene wages and perks,
the hardest rule in football back in the day was explaining to her indoors the off side rule, Imaging explaining it now lol.

Do you remember when excitement and emotions was what football was about, now its rows of cameras and men in black running it all as we try to work out if a slight touch occurred and a penalty is to be awarded or a player is millimetres offside. it hasn't improved the game as an enjoyable instantaneous reaction sport and has become an americanised model. The decisions havent improved as there is just the same controvesy when the judges pronounce their awards. Tv viewers can look at incidents unfold but on the ground as a spectator the magic has been watered down as nobody knows whats going on while everybody in the ground waits for the unreal effect on the pleasure of a goal being scored.
Vote 1 as a football supporter, the idiots are taking charge of the asylum.

 

[SA Wolf]

The genie is out of the bottle; it's not going back in. VAR is here to stay; we just need to find a way and a process that is least-poor for the clubs, players and fans.
Technology in cricket has enhanced the product, ensuring much fairer results and decisions. This is through better systems and processes. It also shows just how many decisions were probably incorrect in the past. The same will eventually happen in football; we just have to live with the shower of **** we have at the moment and that's the difficulty.

 

[YouGottaRaulWithIt]

The genie is out of the bottle; it's not going back in. VAR is here to stay; we just need to find a way and a process that is least-poor for the clubs, players and fans.
Technology in cricket has enhanced the product, ensuring much fairer results and decisions. This is through better systems and processes. It also shows just how many decisions were probably incorrect in the past. The same will eventually happen in football; we just have to live with the shower of **** we have at the moment and that's the difficulty.

Very true. Both Rugby and cricket use the technogy to make the game better.

Difference is there are no American/Saudi owners looking to make millions out of the game and no corrupt uefa creating the environment for that to happen.

 

[bilstonwolf]

The genie is out of the bottle; it's not going back in. VAR is here to stay; we just need to find a way and a process that is least-poor for the clubs, players and fans.
Technology in cricket has enhanced the product, ensuring much fairer results and decisions. This is through better systems and processes. It also shows just how many decisions were probably incorrect in the past. The same will eventually happen in football; we just have to live with the shower of **** we have at the moment and that's the difficulty.

Cricket is more stop start though and the number of reviews are limited. Isn't the only time VAR is routinely used in cricket is for run outs?

 

[5150]

Is it VAR or is it the daft rules?
VAR is only following the ridiculous rules on handball or offside.
VAR isn't the problem.

My biggest gripe ( and its a huge one) is the constant diving.... not all contact is a foul.
Until either players stop cheating and play the game or the refs have the guts to stop giving fouls, it won't change.
Someone has to clamp down on it.

I wonder if empty stadiums is having an effect. Imagine Kane diving in front of a full North Bank... the grief he would receive would either get the ref/or the player to book him/ make him think twice about doing it again.

 

[SteveBullsKnee]

Is it VAR or is it the daft rules?
VAR is only following the ridiculous rules on handball or offside.
VAR isn't the problem.

My biggest gripe ( and its a huge one) is the constant diving.... not all contact is a foul.
Until either players stop cheating and play the game or the refs have the guts to stop giving fouls, it won't change.
Someone has to clamp down on it.

I wonder if empty stadiums is having an effect. Imagine Kane diving in front of a full North Bank... the grief he would receive would either get the ref/or the player to book him/ make him think twice about doing it again.

Your second paragraph for me is where VAR falls down completely. It seems that VAR is there to look at contact and contact only, that cant be right. Rugby and cricket are different its all based round "is he in touch, was it over the line" where with using it in football for fouls its too "grey", its a contact sport so there can always be contact doesnt necessarily mean its a foul.

 

[SA Wolf]

Cricket is more stop start though and the number of reviews are limited. Isn't the only time VAR is routinely used in cricket is for run outs?

Yes, I realise that. Just using cricket as an example of the technology being improved and modified so that it became trusted (which clearly VAR is not) and an accepted part of the game.

 

[Mile End Wanderer]

VAR WAS MESNT FOR CLEAR AND OBVIOUS ONLY.....

 

[WS10Wolf]

Yes, I realise that. Just using cricket as an example of the technology being improved and modified so that it became trusted (which clearly VAR is not) and an accepted part of the game.

Biggest difference is that the technology in cricket adapted around the rules of the sport. They’ve actually changed the rules of football to accommodate VAR, which is extraordinary when you think about it.

 

[Lupus ad Penn]

The clubs voted to bring in VAR to try and remove “clear and obvious errors”.
However the way it is used in England has just added another level of incompetence and confusion. I would get rid of it now, but it isn’t going to happen. The paymasters in Sky love it, because it gives their ”experts” something else to talk about.
When the money from the turnstiles was football’s main income, we may have had a chance in getting things changed, but football sold its soul to TV and the view of the ordinary fans is no longer as important.
Good luck with trying to repeal the chaos that is VAR!

 

[WickedWolfie]

I think as this diving, cheating bad VAR decisions, poor Referees, has gone now past the point of being funny and will destroy our national sport. If it hasn't already. As one of the founder members and the club that every fan in English football rely on to lead from the front, I am starting a petition to say enough is enough.

We all seem to have a big gripe with this so lets stop it now, Once we get going I will put this on another clubs forum i uses so if anyone else wants to go ahead,
i wouldnt know how to do those poll things so this will have to do, or perhaps some clever mod could help lol

Your Choice is

1.Its time to stop this before it kills the game,

2. leave it as it is,

Two problems:
1. No one does more than paying lip-service to the fans.
2. VAR is not solely an English thing (although many of the problems seem to be) which means that you need pressure worldwide to have any impact.

 

[WickedWolfie]

The biggest problems in football are so easily resolved but they wont be as the problems are caused by the people at the top.

1) Corruption in football - Blatter and Platini are prime examples of why it doesnt go away. Stop giving world cups and major tournaments to the country that puts the most in your back pocket
2) A break away super league - Easy, tell any club even thinking of it or evidence of talks behind closed doors, suspend them from ALL competition.
3) Diving - Empower referees to actually send players off for it. The first game abandoned as not enough players on the pitch would be the end of it
4) VAR. This in my opinion was just brought in for the TV channels, to keep you hooked and watching. Its the wrong sport for it. Its not tennis or Cricket where its a yes/no answer.

Re your point 2 good luck with that one in Court.

 

[chignalwolf]

Two problems:
1. No one does more than paying lip-service to the fans.
2. VAR is not solely an English thing (although many of the problems seem to be) which means that you need pressure worldwide to have any impact.

Wicked have you forgot, Wolverhampton is the centre of World Football, its got to start here, the World is holding its breath on the outcome of this vote, (that's if a mod gets round to adding a poll of course,) As your the man in the know on here, can you bend a mods or admins ear mate,

Also there's a lad on here from Scotland, that's as World wide as i know, lol

 

[WickedWolfie]

Wicked have you forgot, Wolverhampton is the centre of World Football, its got to start here, the World is holding its breath on the outcome of this vote, (that's if a mod gets round to adding a poll of course,) As your the man in the know on here, can you bend a mods or admins ear mate,

Can't you add one yourself? If not try @bod101, @Mutchy, @Netherton Wolf (sure that one escapes me)....

 

[chignalwolf]

Can't you add one yourself? If not try @bod101, @Mutchy, @Netherton Wolf (sure that one escapes me)....

Cheers Wicked, not sure how mate, i think it should have been done from the start of the thread,
Also the actual wording of each vote needs getting right, or perhaps i can count them on my abacus

 

[SteveBullsKnee]

Re your point 2 good luck with that one in Court.

The court for arbitration in sport should help. Ultimately all the club's play in viable leagues so they need reminding if they leave they are out for good. I personally feel a super League would be a disaster for these clubs clambering for it.

 

[bod101]

Cheers Wicked, not sure how mate, i think it should have been done from the start of the thread,
Also the actual wording of each vote needs getting right, or perhaps i can count them on my abacus

Added a poll for you.

 

[chignalwolf]

Added a poll for you.

your an absolute star, thanks for that, you can now say you helped change World Football, nice one

 

[Sheriff Woody]

The use of the technology and the lack of clarity for the supporters and viewing public is the biggest frustration.

The clandestine conversations between the on field Stevie Wonder and the VAR Ray Charles whilst Stevie is shooing away players and holding his finger to his ear are pathetic and not designed to be open and honest with the crowd or viewing public.

Genuinely don't think VAR will be successful until the onfield ref and VAR are completely independent and aren't part of the same little boys club.

Surely the FA must have seen how other sports use it. In fact below is an example of how it is used in A-League football.

Aussie VAR

 

[Polish Wolf]

I'd say get rid of the thing until it becomes more technology, less human driven. I mean, you can probably detect an offside without drawing stupid lines looking like in Windows paint. Contact or handball in the area: it can also be detected by technology. Get the referee on the field to look at the monitor if the incident is detected and he decides whether it was enough to give a penalty for.

That said... the goal line technology worked perfectly (no complaints whatsoever) until that incident in Sheff Utd vs Villa, so you can probably screw up even if it's as it can be.

 

[SteveBullsKnee]

We just dont use VAR properly for me. It seems insane to me that they have a screen pitch side and the referee doesnt go and look at every single decision that goes to VAR. If you look at it from a physical level he can see as much as the VAR official along with an extra viewpoint (his own on the pitch).