Steve Bull stand

[Jonzy54]

Just playing devil's advocate but how would you feel if the vast majority of the Fletcher and Jarvis money was ringfenced to enable the rebuild to take place at the end of the season?The stand will have to be rebuilt eventually and the money will still have to be found at that later date.
By all means give Stale a slice of the cake but should we allow him to wheel and deal a bit to get real value for money or just give him a hefty slice at the expense of going ahead with the stand? I accept the loss of revenue all round makes it a very fine ballancing act but I am sure it has crossed the minds of the powers that be.
Thoughts?

 

[Golden_Wolf]

I thought the money for the Steve Bull stand was "ring-fenced" and doesn't effect the transfer budget?

 

[WasStefan]

If we spend £10million of the money (a collossel amount in the Chump) and use the rest to somewhat fund the SB redevelopment IF we go up then I'd be happy with that.

Very big IFs though.

 

[Jonzy54]

I thought the money for the Steve Bull stand was "ring-fenced" and doesn't effect the transfer budget?

They channelled the money they had into Compton

 

[Essex Wolf]

I thought the money for the Steve Bull stand was "ring-fenced" and doesn't effect the transfer budget?

As I understood it also but with Morgan moving the goal posts, no pun intended, and things not panning out as he says nothing surprises me.

 

[North West Wanderer]

£5m - £6m tops on players, keep the rest for use wherever.

 

[bridgnorthwolf]

All in all, by selling players this summer, we will have recouped around £30 million in transfer fees I should say.

We've signed a Nouble on a free, Sigurdarson for just over £2.4 million, a couple of youngsters for nominal fees and a couple of season long loans. I think we should get one or two more season-long loans in and a couple of permanent signings. Again, it depends on exactly who leaves. But we will spend sub-£10 million, but on players from overseas which would have cost a hell of a lot more had they been signed from this country (nice one Stale), which is more than enough for the Championship. I'm sure our business will be far better than any other club in this division.

And no one with any sense would want us to blow the majority of £30 million on transfers in the Championship.

I would be overjoyed if the Steve Bull stand was bulldozed at the end of the season.

 

[North West Wanderer]

I thought the money for the Steve Bull stand was "ring-fenced" and doesn't effect the transfer budget?

that's what I thought, but no doubt a certain someone will be here pretty soon to tell us otherwise.

 

[puntswolf]

Doesnt matter if he spends it on the stand.

Morgan knows there is no point having a big stand if you haven't got a successful team to fill it.

But no he is just going to build it to look pretty and then build loads of houses!

 

[Haggstone]

I thought the money for the Steve Bull stand was "ring-fenced" and doesn't effect the transfer budget?

No, it was the North Bank funding that was 'ring fenced' funding for the SB would come from future cash flow (player sales, TV money, gate receipts etc) and bank loans.

 

[we8wba]

its not good business to plough all 24-25m into the playing squad, look how easily we've wasted this kind of money in the past

i'd be fairly happy if they put 5m towards stadium 5m into the club bankroll, 4m deals now and 10m when we promoted

 

[Macman]

I agree totally. Even if we don't go up we should rebuild the SB and South Bank as originally planned. I've said before, they should not have started the project if they never intended finishing it. If we are in the Championship next season, then that would be a good time to rebuild as we can house the fans from there elsewhere (I'm guessing the capacity would be 21,000 ish?) as the current SB hold 9,500.

Give Stale decent funds to get a Centre half, jarvo replacement etc - then put the rest into the redevelopment - which, long term, SHOULD give Wolves more financial clout in the future.

Standing outside the stadium between the BW and South Bank, looking across to the North Bank, is when you realise how daunting the stand looks. Imagine that continued around? Molineux would look incredible - but at the moment, that North Bank 'crank' is crying out to be continued...

 

[WasStefan]

Doesnt matter if he spends it on the stand.

Morgan knows there is no point having a big stand if you haven't got a successful team to fill it.

But no he is just going to build it to look pretty and then build loads of houses!

Is he going to build these houses on the pinch?

Get real. The mans a businessman, that's why people like me and you live normal lives earning modest amounts.

 

[wolvesjoe]

Just playing devil's advocate but how would you feel if the vast majority of the Fletcher and Jarvis money was ringfenced to enable the rebuild to take place at the end of the season?The stand will have to be rebuilt eventually and the money will still have to be found at that later date.
By all means give Stale a slice of the cake but should we allow him to wheel and deal a bit to get real value for money or just give him a hefty slice at the expense of going ahead with the stand? I accept the loss of revenue all round makes it a very fine ballancing act but I am sure it has crossed the minds of the powers that be.
Thoughts?

Cross their minds?? I should say so.

The club is well on its way to fulfilling its overall strategy since February this year. Funds are in for the next stage of the ground rebuild, and a new manager is on his way to clearing up the horrendous mess playing and coaching wise that years of McCarthy's dreadful management created. McCarthy's saving grace was his ability in the transfer market, buying young promising players, which has allowed for this cashing in off assets.

Some glitches however. Wolves are probably still struggling to reach their target figure sales wise. The figures for Jarvis and Fletcher are borderline acceptable, but Wolves still need to raise more money if Solbakken is going to have the funds he needs to put the finishing touches on a promotion side. The money should really come from Morgan, but lets leave that one aside.

Second, far deeper glitch in the whole strategy will be the transient, shorttermist results. Solbakken may well work his magic with the team and the transfer market. But if he and the players are not rewarded financially, and if they dont see a realistic prospect of Wolves becoming a top half Premiership club,then they understandably will be off. Wolves may get their ground rebuilt, but the overall strategy is still trying to defy the laws of gravity in Premier football.

 

[WasStefan]

I can't believe I just wasted 2 minutes of my life reading this rubbish

Cross their minds?? I should say so.

The club is well on its way to fulfilling its overall strategy since February this year. Funds are in for the next stage of the ground rebuild, and a new manager is on his way to clearing up the horrendous mess playing and coaching wise that years of McCarthy's dreadful management created. McCarthy's saving grace was his ability in the transfer market, buying young promising players, which has allowed for this cashing in off assets.

Some glitches however. Wolves are probably still struggling to reach their target figure sales wise. The figures for Jarvis and Fletcher are borderline acceptable, but Wolves still need to raise more money if Solbakken is going to have the funds he needs to put the finishing touches on a promotion side. The money should really come from Morgan, but lets leave that one aside.

Second, far deeper glitch in the whole strategy will be the transient, shorttermist results. Solbakken may well work his magic with the team and the transfer market. But if he and the players are not rewarded financially, and if they dont see a realistic prospect of Wolves becoming a top half Premiership club,then they understandably will be off. Wolves may get their ground rebuilt, but the overall strategy still is trying to defy the laws of gravity in Premier football.

 

[puntswolf]

Is he going to build these houses on the pinch?

Get real. The mans a businessman, that's why people like me and you live normal lives earning modest amounts.

Sense the sarcasm.

 

[WasStefan]

Sense the sarcasm.

Sarcasm is almost impossible to portray in plain text, did you know?

 

[Top_Wolf]

Don't be Naive people !! Morgan has not shown us the "war chest" he promised we've bought only one player and loaned 2.. they are running it as a business first and a football club second remember (we will never go bankrupt tho) so yes a majority of the funds generated will go to the new stand... (part of me thinks they wanted us to be relegated to cash in if I'm honest)... well people we have 8 days til end of transfer window so i will reserve full judgement until then !!

 

[Jonzy54]

Doesnt matter if he spends it on the stand.

Morgan knows there is no point having a big stand if you haven't got a successful team to fill it.

But no he is just going to build it to look pretty and then build loads of houses!

Do you sit in the Steve Bull,because I do and the facilities are awful.The stand went up in 1979 ,it is outmoded,and is a mere shell on the concourse.It needs replacing not just to create an edifice that looks pretty.

 

[Danwolf]

I would rather the Steve Bull was rebuilt sooner rather than later so as long as Ståle gets some funds to improve the squad I dont mind if some of the money is used on the stand.

 

[SimplyTheWolves]

No, it was the North Bank funding that was 'ring fenced' funding for the SB would come from future cash flow (player sales, TV money, gate receipts etc) and bank loans.

That was the impression I was under Haggstone.

 

[puntswolf]

Sarcasm is almost impossible to portray in plain text, did you know?

Well as the first point I made I was supporting Morgan I thought it was quite obvious. Never mind.

 

[wolvesjoe]

I can't believe I just wasted 2 minutes of my life reading this rubbish

Not quite sure of the hostility? You are free to debate what is written, but not to hand out random insults.

Everything I have argued has come true so far. The Steve Bull rebuild will also be announced in due course as predicted also. More players will be moved out to further recapitalise the club.

Its all fine now, but the underlying lack of realism needs attention. Good, young talented managers are like gold dust, and Solbakken will be head hunted desperately if he is successful here. He will need full backing by the board if they want to hang onto him.

Unlike some, I try not to get too bound up with the day to day developments in looking at the club, or only insofar as they show the overall direction the club is heading in.

 

[Surrey Wolf]

SB needs rebuilding, it really does look horrible

 

[puntswolf]

Do you sit in the Steve Bull,because I do and the facilities are awful.The stand went up in 1979 ,it is outmoded,and is a mere shell on the concourse.It needs replacing not just to create an edifice that looks pretty.

I agree.

As I said, Morgan isn't building this stand for the sake of it. He knows there is no point having a fancy stand without a successful team to fill it. Hence why
Money will still be spent on playing squad regardless. The same amount as if we weren't building it.

 

[WasStefan]

Not quite sure of the hostility? You are free to debate what is written, but not to hand out random insults.

Everything I have argued has come true so far. The Steve Bull rebuild will also be announced in due course as predicted also. More players will be moved out to further recapitalise the club.

Its all fine now, but the underlying lack of realism needs attention. Good, young talented managers are like gold dust, and Solbakken will be head hunted desperately if he is successful here. He will need full backing by the board if they want to hang onto him.

Unlike some, I try not to get too bound up with the day to day developments in looking at the club, or only insofar as they show the overall direction the club is heading in.

Fair enough. I would come up with a reasoned reply but can't be bothered, using phone for typing is annoying and I'd probably end up throwing it out the window.

 

[Essex Wolf]

Don't be Naive people !! Morgan has not shown us the "war chest" he promised we've bought only one player and loaned 2.. they are running it as a business first and a football club second remember (we will never go bankrupt tho) so yes a majority of the funds generated will go to the new stand... (part of me thinks they wanted us to be relegated to cash in if I'm honest)... well people we have 8 days til end of transfer window so i will reserve full judgement until then !!

I too often wonder if relegation was something Morgan wanted.

People may question why such a thing may be on his mind but with player sales the club stand to bring in best part of £30M whilst saving a fortune on wages.

Parachute payments for 3 seasons and with the hierarchy lousy attitude towards ambition it may just suit to be a well run mid table championship club going nowhere.

 

[WasStefan]

I too often wonder if relegation was something Morgan wanted.

People may question why such a thing may be on his mind but with player sales the club stand to bring in best part of £30M whilst saving a fortune on wages.

Parachute payments for 3 seasons and with the hierarchy lousy attitude towards ambition it may just suit to be a well run mid table championship club going nowhere.

How do you work that out? After parachute payments, reinvesting in the squad and salary drops for current players we'd still be a few million down.

Makes no sense whatsoever.

 

[puntswolf]

We make more money in the PL.

Why people think we would WANT to get relegated. Unbelievable.

 

[Haggstone]

Not quite sure of the hostility? You are free to debate what is written, but not to hand out random insults.

Everything I have argued has come true so far. The Steve Bull rebuild will also be announced in due course as predicted also. More players will be moved out to further recapitalise the club.

Its all fine now, but the underlying lack of realism needs attention. Good, young talented managers are like gold dust, and Solbakken will be head hunted desperately if he is successful here. He will need full backing by the board if they want to hang onto him.

Unlike some, I try not to get too bound up with the day to day developments in looking at the club, or only insofar as they show the overall direction the club is heading in.

Why is it the only players of worth that have been sold so far are ones that have put in transfer requests? Are you suggesting that we would have sold Flecther, Jarvis and Kightly regardless?

 

[Essex Wolf]

How do you work that out? After parachute payments, reinvesting in the squad and salary drops for current players we'd still be a few million down.

Makes no sense whatsoever.

What after taking in nigh on £30M from the sales of Fletcher, Jarvis, Vokes, Kightly and Guedioura and not forgetting the likes of Milijas, Hammill and Berra could well yet leave and bring in more money?

The players have taken a wage drop and Stale wants to reduce the squad in size to approx 23 players compared to over 30.

A massive saving on wages, millions acquired through players sales and very little paid out so far.

If the money is reinvested in the squad great but Morgan and his cronies failed last season and I don't trust the man an inch.

 

[TFWanderers]

The Steve Bull 'HAS' to come down.

It's a dump and miles away from the pitch.

 

[Mark Rankines Lovechild]

But no he is just going to build it to look pretty and then build loads of houses!

Really original, never heard the "build houses" comment before. :stupido3:

 

[WasStefan]

What after taking in nigh on £30M from the sales of Fletcher, Jarvis, Vokes, Kightly and Guedioura and not forgetting the likes of Milijas, Hammill and Berra could well yet leave and bring in more money?

The players have taken a wage drop and Stale wants to reduce the squad in size to approx 23 players compared to over 30.

A massive saving on wages, millions acquired through players sales and very little paid out so far.

If the money is reinvested in the squad great but Morgan and his cronies failed last season and I don't trust the man an inch.

http://soccerlens.com/premier-league-tv-rights/94662/

"Clubs relegated from the Premier League receive £48m in parachute payments over four years – a measure designed to compensate for the loss of Premier League revenue."

Bottom place club receives £45million for one season. Based on parachute payments decreasing on a sliding scale of £48million over four seasons.

Season 1 - 16.5million (-£45million = - £28.5million)
Season 2 - 13.5million
Season 3 - 10.5million
Season 4 - 7.5million.

Factor in player wages going down as per relegation clauses etc. Funny thing is if you take off wage cuts, we will probably save what, £5million (guesstimate, could be more) over the season? Leaving £23million roughly.

I wonder what we have that's worth £23million to plug this gap? Oh yes. Fletcher and Jarvis!

But when you factor in with this loss of ticket sales an reduced ticket prices, less advertising sales etc and we will still be down. So stop talking wet.

 

[Haggstone]

What after taking in nigh on £30M from the sales of Fletcher, Jarvis, Vokes, Kightly and Guedioura and not forgetting the likes of Milijas, Hammill and Berra could well yet leave and bring in more money?

The players have taken a wage drop and Stale wants to reduce the squad in size to approx 23 players compared to over 30.

A massive saving on wages, millions acquired through players sales and very little paid out so far.

If the money is reinvested in the squad great but Morgan and his cronies failed last season and I don't trust the man an inch.

Surely if that was the clubs intention, we could still have sold the likes of Fletcher, Jarvis Kightly etc even if we hadn't been relegated? Then we would have had £30m AND the £50m sky money or whatever the amount is these days.

I have to say the idea that getting relegated is likely to have long term financial benefit seems a little radical to me.

 

[wolvesjoe]

Why is it the only players of worth that have been sold so far are ones that have put in transfer requests? Are you suggesting that we would have sold Flecther, Jarvis and Kightly regardless?

Absolutely. Clubs signal that they will sell players all the time to other clubs. Wolves' three top saleable assets were Fletcher, Jarvis and Hennessey, and I am sure everyone knew they were available at the right price. Hennessey of course became injured so that one will have to wait.

Working this out is simply a case of understanding Wolves' overall financial strategy. Morgan has made it clear that he does not want to put his own money in, so has therefore to raise funds through the business. Without the revenue streams of the Premier, that has to be done through asset sales,which is what has happened. The ground rebuild is central to Wolves' longterm ambitions, (and Morgan's own prestige I would argue), so it has to get done. There werent any alternatives, once Morgan ruled out further capital from his own wealth.

My concern is simply that Wolves fans understand the strategy. Once that is done, then it becomes possible to see how realistic it might or might not be.

 

[dingle01902]

Just doing the math on capacity v attendance and with a 32000 capacity currently, the Barnsley game attendance was 24000 and a bit. That was with thousands of free tickets given away. Lets say 3000 for arguments sake, so the attendance should have been circa 21000. That leaves 11000 empty seats.
The SB currently holds around 9000.

If they relocated all of the SB now and started demolition there would still be 2000 spare seats for walk ups. Also, when we are promoted at the end of the season the lower tier would be ready for use in the prem.

Id say push the button now using half of the player windfall, reinvest the rest in the team over this and the next transfer window, and fund the remainder of the SB development either from aforementiond bank loans or prem tv money.

 

[Bull Army]

The Steve Bull 'HAS' to come down.

It's a dump and miles away from the pitch.

You should have been there in the 80s. One one occasion I took binoculars, and that is not a joke.

 

[Essex Wolf]

We make more money in the PL.

Why people think we would WANT to get relegated. Unbelievable.

What exactly did Morgan do to try and stop the rot last season?

The sacking of McCarthy was rediculous and should have been done before last season started, after Wolves had struggled two season on the trot. Having kept him on he then sacks him at a stupid point of the season and after a farcical sequence of events, where I don't believe for a second the club had any intention of finding a replacement, they give the job to a man that has to be of the worst, most incompetent and negative managers I've ever seen in charge of the Wolves. Quite how the man is still involved at the club in any way shape or form is a mystery.

The PL is an expensive place to be and if a club really wants to stay there it needs to invest in quality players. Quite clearly the players McCarthy signed were not up to the job and far better needed. Whether his funds were restricted we may never know but certainly there was not enough quality and what little quality there was is now being sold of for massive profits.

As regards money taken in over 4 years via the parachute payments, well it's over 4 years. The £30M taken in is in the here and now, or best part of and is mostly up front and can be added to those payments.

It's just a feeling I have and if Morgan wanted Wolves to be in the PL he should have done a bloody site more than he did.

 

[wolvesjoe]

Just doing the math on capacity v attendance and with a 32000 capacity currently, the Barnsley game attendance was 24000 and a bit. That was with thousands of free tickets given away. Lets say 3000 for arguments sake, so the attendance should have been circa 21000. That leaves 11000 empty seats.
The SB currently holds around 9000.

If they relocated all of the SB now and started demolition there would still be 2000 spare seats for walk ups. Also, when we are promoted at the end of the season the lower tier would be ready for use in the prem.

Id say push the button now using half of the player windfall, reinvest the rest in the team over this and the next transfer window, and fund the remainder of the SB development either from aforementiond bank loans or prem tv money.

I sort of agree with that. Just get it done and over with. However it would disrupt this season, to have major demolition going on, and the ground to once again be unfinished.

Wolves also need to rebuild their support base, as a matter of urgency. There needs to be a concerted effort this season to get as many new fans and lapsed fans going to the games. All sorts of incentives need to be put in place. I suspect that will be a priority, rather than bring forward the demolition of the STeve Bull by 9 months.