Stadium Plans

[giantwolf]

Thought they chopped bottom corner block off the Steve Bull to allow for emergency service vehs.

… yes accommodating emergency vehicles as the stand is closer

 

[Jay Jay de Wolf]

I've got this hypothetical question and thought if bob the builder (Steve Morgan) would have been here still or kept a share in WWFC.
Would he have finished his redevelopment plans of 3 phases for Molineux and built it by now and especially throughout the lock downs periods?

Remember Sir Jack having an agreement with SM when he handed over the club to him for £10. That SM would guarantee Sir Jack he would put £30,000 spending into players. Why didn't SM ask Fosun to guarantee him that the redevelopment of Molinuex would take place within 10 years?

 

[WickedWolfie]

I've got this hypothetical question and thought if bob the builder (Steve Morgan) would have been here still or kept a share in WWFC.
Would he have finished his redevelopment plans of 3 phases for Molineux and built it by now and especially throughout the lock downs periods?

Remember Sir Jack having an agreement with SM when he handed over the club to him for £10. That SM would guarantee Sir Jack he would put £30,000 spending into players. Why didn't SM ask Fosun to guarantee him that the redevelopment of Molinuex would take place within 10 years?

Perhaps Sir Jack was happy with the ground that he'd built?

 

[Padraig]

Burnley now go on the list of “teams with bigger big screens than us”, which includes other illustrious clubs such as Walsall and Watford.

In fact Turf Moor inside was pretty tidy, it’s clearly had some money spent on it.

If the club won’t spend a penny on general stadium upkeep (broken TVs in the concourse, even a lick of paint) or match day experience improvements (screens), there’s no way we’re getting any new seats. There’s still bare foundations outside the Graham Hughes ffs. Where the pop-up shop used to be. Been there over a year with heras fencing around it.

Tells you all you need to know about the ownership’s commitment/willingness to invest. And that cheeky ***** Vincent will still try and jack the prices up.

 

[TFWanderers]

I spoke to the Architect who designed the SJH stands , many years ago about expansion. He told me both the South Bank and Billy Wright were both designed to “bolt on” another tier and highering the roof. The club actually showed a model of the proposed infill of the south bank corners but failure on the pitch mothballed that idea. The “goalpost” supports on the north bank prevented any expansion and the Steve Bull is pre- cast concrete not steel, so cannot be expanded in the same way.

Is there a reason why the Bully was made of pre-cast concrete? Was it the norm at the time?

I know it was very much a 60's building method using concrete but as we saw with the Molineux Sports Centre, it really doesn't take much to start cracking and then it eventually needs to be demolished.

 

[Sussex Wolf]

Is there a reason why the Bully was made of pre-cast concrete? Was it the norm at the time?

I know it was very much a 60's building method using concrete but as we saw with the Molineux Sports Centre, it really doesn't take much to start cracking and then it eventually needs to be demolished.

It was the norm in the late seventies when it was designed and built.

Concrete can last a very long time, as the Romans proved…

A brief history of concrete: from 10,000BC to 3D printed houses

The Romans used concrete in everything from bath houses to the Colosseum. Our modern concrete structures will never last as long

www.theguardian.com

 

[Bill S Preston Esq.]

Disagree with that. Good view from all stans

You've never been in the Bully lower?

 

[Alex Rae The Substitute]

You've never been in the Bully lower?

TBF to the Bully lower if you’re on the back few rows towards the middle of the pitch I actually think it’s a very good view down there.

The front few rows not so much…

 

[whitnash wolf ex.dewsbury]

Can`t find a reference but I`m sure I remember when SJH built the North Bank it was said because
the roof was goal post supported it would be easy to replace.
In fact the only reference I can find is in Simon Inglis`s fine book Football Grounds of Britain
where he says to cantilever the roof would have cost an extra £50,000 when money was tight
but the roof could easily be redesigned
later statements have said the goal post supports meant the roof was not easy to replace

 

[beppe7619]

Is there a reason why the Bully was made of pre-cast concrete? Was it the norm at the time?

I know it was very much a 60's building method using concrete but as we saw with the Molineux Sports Centre, it really doesn't take much to start cracking and then it eventually needs to be demolished.

The market multi storey car park was built with concrete and collapsed in the late 90s lucky there was no injuries

 

[Lupus ad Penn]

The use of concrete wasn’t the problem with the collapsed car park in Piper’s Row. Some of the top floor collapsed due to issues with corrosion of the metal inside the construction due to pooling of rain water and use of salt in icy weather. None of these issues should effect the Steve Bull, as it is fully weather proofed by the roof and external walls and cladding.

 

[Oldgoldilox]

Ive often thought recently that the mild hysteria around the Steve Bull "sinking" and about to be "condemned" was born of the Pipers Row collapse.

Having done the new Tottenham stadium tour recently, its is certainly true what others have said, the facilities at Molineux are 30 years out of date, we dont know what's in the mind of the management at the moment but they have said that it involves co-operation with the council, University and Asda . I guess the issue is when you involve three other parties you're tripling the amount of governance required to get things moving and with one party's decision probably dependent on another's with that comes a similar lengthening of time to conclude and move. Throw in a pandemic, raw material and commodity costs going through the roof, cost of living crisis for the punters who would buy the additional seats and you have to conclude that now is probably not the best time to push the button on stadium expansion. Two years time minimum I reckon before we get any news on that.

 

[Mile End Wanderer]

If they demolished the Steve Bull stand could they go closer to the pitch but dig down so we could have a low lower tier and curve it around to the north and south bank like Wembley??? Then put some boxes and do an upper level the further we also go back it could be a huge stand could make it the perfect one sided bowl

 

[beppe7619]

Ive often thought recently that the mild hysteria around the Steve Bull "sinking" and about to be "condemned" was born of the Pipers Row collapse.

Having done the new Tottenham stadium tour recently, its is certainly true what others have said, the facilities at Molineux are 30 years out of date, we dont know what's in the mind of the management at the moment but they have said that it involves co-operation with the council, University and Asda . I guess the issue is when you involve three other parties you're tripling the amount of governance required to get things moving and with one party's decision probably dependent on another's with that comes a similar lengthening of time to conclude and move. Throw in a pandemic, raw material and commodity costs going through the roof, cost of living crisis for the punters who would buy the additional seats and you have to conclude that now is probably not the best time to push the button on stadium expansion. Two years time minimum I reckon before we get any news on that.

I think after the collapse concrete buildings had to be inspected and I think it stemmed from this

 

[Achilles Last Stand]

This could be horsepoo... but I remember reading somewhere during the time of the Molineux rebuilding phase that either Fifa or Uefa had some new recommendations for NEW stadiums, to reserve more space for the pitch for future needs. Practically meaning that the pitch sizes could be altered, to accomodate for bigger pitches.

 

[Achilles Last Stand]

Should be ok in the upper tier, certainly for the first half anyway.

Going down, going down, going down!

 

[Minimalist]

This could be horsepoo... but I remember reading somewhere during the time of the Molineux rebuilding phase that either Fifa or Uefa had some new recommendations for NEW stadiums, to reserve more space for the pitch for future needs. Practically meaning that the pitch sizes could be altered, to accomodate for bigger pitches.

Could be true, and I think they have indeed moved towards a standard size of pitch from what used to be a very variable set of max and min width and length.
However I’d doubt that affected us much as we used to have a bigger than average size pitch. Think MM had it shrunk a bit when he won promotion.

 

[Dragonwolf]

TBF to the Bully lower if you’re on the back few rows towards the middle of the pitch I actually think it’s a very good view down there.

The front few rows not so much…

Having sat in there last night i can confirm this

 

[Coshamwolves]

Ive often thought recently that the mild hysteria around the Steve Bull "sinking" and about to be "condemned" was born of the Pipers Row collapse.

Having done the new Tottenham stadium tour recently, its is certainly true what others have said, the facilities at Molineux are 30 years out of date, we dont know what's in the mind of the management at the moment but they have said that it involves co-operation with the council, University and Asda . I guess the issue is when you involve three other parties you're tripling the amount of governance required to get things moving and with one party's decision probably dependent on another's with that comes a similar lengthening of time to conclude and move. Throw in a pandemic, raw material and commodity costs going through the roof, cost of living crisis for the punters who would buy the additional seats and you have to conclude that now is probably not the best time to push the button on stadium expansion. Two years time minimum I reckon before we get any news on that.

Agree with all that and once any future redevelopment came under the Molineux Northern Quarter regeneration scheme it`s all got much more complex.

 

[beppe7619]

Agree with all that and once any future redevelopment came under the Molineux Northern Quarter regeneration scheme it`s all got much more complex.

Or do the council just want it as the university quarter. I was looking around outside molineux yesterday and the amount of buildings that have been built on the site you wonder if the council wants the ground over there. They could of geared everything up for football around the area multi story car parks access roads to the ground for away coaches from the back of the Steve bull.

 

[AndyY]

I'll never understand the logic in creating such vast spaces between the stands and the pitch. I just don't get why?

Wasn’t it because the SB stand was built behind the original stand and then the old stand was knocked down in front of it

 

[lets all have a disco]

I think after the collapse concrete buildings had to be inspected and I think it stemmed from this

It also brought in a lot of regulations with the steel reinforcements in the concrete....rules n regulations etc..... traceability of the steel...........so if there was a problem with steel reinforcements in the concrete, as in the car park you could find out where the steel had been used in other constructions.....it's the game I'm in..

If there is a problem with concrete pillars in the new uni building, behind the Steve bull stand, I could tell ya where all the steel was made in china etc etc....but don't blame me if the Steve bull stand sinks....but blame for the uni building.....

 

[beppe7619]

It also brought in a lot of regulations with the steel reinforcements in the concrete....rules n regulations etc..... traceability of the steel...........so if there was a problem with steel reinforcements in the concrete, as in the car park you could find out where the steel had been used in other constructions.....it's the game I'm in..

If there is a problem with concrete pillars in the new uni building, behind the Steve bull stand, I could tell ya where all the steel was made in china etc etc....but don't blame me if the Steve bull stand sinks....but blame for the uni building.....

A lot of council flat building have concrete ceilings and the cracks in there are really bad

 

[lets all have a disco]

A lot of council flat building have concrete ceilings and the cracks in there are really bad

Concrete cracks all the time....we do the steel reinforcements pre pouring...once they start pouring the concrete, thats their problem.......as long the steel matches up with drawings wem done ....

 

[Wolvessince63]

Wasn’t it because the SB stand was built behind the original stand and then the old stand was knocked down in front of it

Yes that’s correct

 

[Wolvessince63]

 

[Wolvessince63]

The above picture is the old Molineux Street which shows the John Ireland stand being built behind the Molineux Street stand.

 

[beppe7619]

The above picture is the old Molineux Street which shows the John Ireland stand being built behind the Molineux Street stand.

The trolley bus use to run down molineux street. I found old clips of the mp knocking on peoples houses asking them there thoughts on moving to make way for the Steve bull stand

 

[Oakhamwolf]

Wasn’t it because the SB stand was built behind the original stand and then the old stand was knocked down in front of it

Due to the state of the ground after the Taylor report, the Molineux was the first post Taylor report new build. The original report stated ambulances had to be able to drive fully around the perimeter of the pitch, and the architects took this (and a bit more to ensure they covered there arses) into account. I remember seeing an interview with Sir Jack, as the Billy Wright stand neared completion, and the front hoarding to the site were coming down, and he was not happy with the distances of the two side stands to the pitch, and even wanted to know what the builders could do to change it Lol. Obviously nothing was the answer. It was great when first built, as it was a sh*thole before, unfortunately we have paid the price of those early regs, as they were more relaxed on subsequent new builds.

 

[Oakhamwolf]

Burnley now go on the list of “teams with bigger big screens than us”, which includes other illustrious clubs such as Walsall and Watford.

In fact Turf Moor inside was pretty tidy, it’s clearly had some money spent on it.

If the club won’t spend a penny on general stadium upkeep (broken TVs in the concourse, even a lick of paint) or match day experience improvements (screens), there’s no way we’re getting any new seats. There’s still bare foundations outside the Graham Hughes ffs. Where the pop-up shop used to be. Been there over a year with heras fencing around it.

Tells you all you need to know about the ownership’s commitment/willingness to invest. And that cheeky ***** Vincent will still try and jack the prices up.

They have made improvements ie 2 small screens, and new PA in 3 stands. However it’s always on the cheap, the PA company set up two displays, the one we have now ie single speakers suspended, or what are popping in most grounds that upgrade, a multiple array of speakers across a stand (array = 3 to 6 large speakers put together often with separate bass boxes), much better sound from a lot more speakers. We chose the cheap version for just 3 stands, and left the Stan Cullis ones alone, rather than a much better upgrade and the recommendation of professional sound engineers. I think this showed there intent from the off, do it when it’s broke or almost broke, and the cheapest cost. So many other grounds especially, promoted teams get a decent spruce up, the Molineux is crying out for it (appreciate some new seats and safe standing put in before I get pulled up)

 

[Coshamwolves]

Or do the council just want it as the university quarter. I was looking around outside molineux yesterday and the amount of buildings that have been built on the site you wonder if the council wants the ground over there. They could of geared everything up for football around the area multi story car parks access roads to the ground for away coaches from the back of the Steve bull.

That`s why i said its become much more complex

 

[SingYourHeartsOut]

Due to the state of the ground after the Taylor report, the Molineux was the first post Taylor report new build. The original report stated ambulances had to be able to drive fully around the perimeter of the pitch, and the architects took this (and a bit more to ensure they covered there arses) into account. I remember seeing an interview with Sir Jack, as the Billy Wright stand neared completion, and the front hoarding to the site were coming down, and he was not happy with the distances of the two side stands to the pitch, and even wanted to know what the builders could do to change it Lol. Obviously nothing was the answer. It was great when first built, as it was a sh*thole before, unfortunately we have paid the price of those early regs, as they were more relaxed on subsequent new builds.

With modern pitch technology I don't know how seriously we could look at dropping the pitch a few metres and putting 5 more rows at the front of each stand. That's potentially 4000 more seats and OK a big job, but surely cheaper than a complete SB rebuild to add the same?

 

[Spitfire]

With modern pitch technology I don't know how seriously we could look at dropping the pitch a few metres and putting 5 more rows at the front of each stand. That's potentially 4000 more seats and OK a big job, but surely cheaper than a complete SB rebuild to add the same?

Even if technically possible it can’t happen because the pitch would end up being too short. North and South banks are already as close to the pitch as allowed.

 

[Padraig]

They have made improvements ie 2 small screens, and new PA in 3 stands. However it’s always on the cheap, the PA company set up two displays, the one we have now ie single speakers suspended, or what are popping in most grounds that upgrade, a multiple array of speakers across a stand (array = 3 to 6 large speakers put together often with separate bass boxes), much better sound from a lot more speakers. We chose the cheap version for just 3 stands, and left the Stan Cullis ones alone, rather than a much better upgrade and the recommendation of professional sound engineers. I think this showed there intent from the off, do it when it’s broke or almost broke, and the cheapest cost. So many other grounds especially, promoted teams get a decent spruce up, the Molineux is crying out for it (appreciate some new seats and safe standing put in before I get pulled up)

Even that was done when we were in the Championship

 

[Bill S Preston Esq.]

Wasn’t it because the SB stand was built behind the original stand and then the old stand was knocked down in front of it

I can understand the necessity in doing that. I understand the poor running of the club meant that the HUGE gap remained for so long until the SJH rebuild.

What I find odd is the massive gaps (even if much smaller than the original John Ireland stand gap) utilised in the SJH rebuild. Although this may have been to do with regulations at the time.

 

[Sussex Wolf]

With modern pitch technology I don't know how seriously we could look at dropping the pitch a few metres and putting 5 more rows at the front of each stand. That's potentially 4000 more seats and OK a big job, but surely cheaper than a complete SB rebuild to add the same?

The new NB made it impossible without rebuilding either the North or South Bank. I remember Morgan saying at some point that they considered it when looking at different options to expand Molineux but decided against it for reasons I forget or he didn’t explain.

 

[beppe7619]

The new NB made it impossible without rebuilding either the North or South Bank. I remember Morgan saying at some point that they considered it when looking at different options to expand Molineux but decided against it for reasons I forget or he didn’t explain.

The north bank roof was the issue as it was a different design to the south bank making it difficult to expand which seems odd as Liverpool have built stands behind the take the old roof down

 

[Sussex Wolf]

I can understand the necessity in doing that. I understand the poor running of the club meant that the HUGE gap remained for so long until the SJH rebuild.

What I find odd is the massive gaps (even if much smaller than the original John Ireland stand gap) utilised in the SJH rebuild. Although this may have been to do with regulations at the time.

It’s an interesting question. SJH could have built his three stands such that the pitch was moved as close to the Steve Bull as regulations allowed, and then lined up the new North and South Banks to match, and the BW equally close on the other side. I can only imagine that they built those three stands where they are because they were required to, perhaps to allow better access around the touch lines in the event of an emergency? If so, the regulations must have changed in the intervening period to allow Morgan to push up his North Bank, and for other clubs to have new stands closer to the pitch.

 

[TFWanderers]

It’s an interesting question. SJH could have built his three stands such that the pitch was moved as close to the Steve Bull as regulations allowed, and then lined up the new North and South Banks to match, and the BW equally close on the other side. I can only imagine that they built those three stands where they are because they were required to, perhaps to allow better access around the touch lines in the event of an emergency? If so, the regulations must have changed in the intervening period to allow Morgan to push up his North Bank, and for other clubs to have new stands closer to the pitch.

Think of the stadiums that were built not long after Molineux.

The Reebok
Riverside
Britannia
Old Trafford refurb.
Villa Park refurb
The Hawthorns refurb
The New Den
The City Ground

I can't think of many of those stadiums where you could drive an ambulance round the pitch.

Not disputing the legislation as I have read it myself somewhere too. It must have been scrapped pretty soon after Molineux was completed in 93.

 

[TFWanderers]

They have made improvements ie 2 small screens, and new PA in 3 stands. However it’s always on the cheap, the PA company set up two displays, the one we have now ie single speakers suspended, or what are popping in most grounds that upgrade, a multiple array of speakers across a stand (array = 3 to 6 large speakers put together often with separate bass boxes), much better sound from a lot more speakers. We chose the cheap version for just 3 stands, and left the Stan Cullis ones alone, rather than a much better upgrade and the recommendation of professional sound engineers. I think this showed there intent from the off, do it when it’s broke or almost broke, and the cheapest cost. So many other grounds especially, promoted teams get a decent spruce up, the Molineux is crying out for it (appreciate some new seats and safe standing put in before I get pulled up)

I don't recall the exterior of Molineux having a spruce up since 2003. Jack had it completely refurbed on promotion to the PL.

Since then we've had the big banners added to the Billy Wright, the arrival of the new North Bank and a new shade of seat fitted in the Steve Bull lower. LED advertising boards, a new sound system and the big screens reintroduced but.....

The exterior is looking tired. The roof supports are going lighter and greener as the years roll by. Or looking at the Bully's roof, rustier. Morgan didn't bother sprucing it up as he had plans to rebuild it.

I'm not sure the current ownership do. New paint would go a long way.