Mason Greenwood to leave Man U

[lostwolf]

Leaving aside discussions on the actual behaviour as that is for another forum section, what is the concensus of opinion on another club taking him on? What if Wolves were to consider it? Can he continue his career?
Duncan (sorry, David) Goodwillie is probably a parallel... clubs have thought they could employ him but then withdrawn once hit by public opinion.

I'd be horrified if we employed the 'orrible little ****. If it had all just been alleged, and there were no tapes of behaviour that for me transgressed boundaries of decent behaviour, and then he was not found guilty, then I'd say let him play. But although there might not have been evidence of criminality, there's ample evidence he's a ****.

I suspect he'll have to go abroad to continue his career (he's a brilliant player) where there wasn't the same media coverage.

 

[Superted]

Leaving aside discussions on the actual behaviour as that is for another forum section, what is the concensus of opinion on another club taking him on? What if Wolves were to consider it? Can he continue his career?
Duncan (sorry, David) Goodwillie is probably a parallel... clubs have thought they could employ him but then withdrawn once hit by public opinion.

The difference with Goodwillie is that a court has concluded that on the balance of probability, he did rape his alleged victim, even though he has not actually been convicted of rape.

Greenwood ultimately faced no charges in court so nobody has proven that he's actually done anything and the CPS didn't feel they could prove it either. Not to mention that as far as I understand it the alleged victim is his partner and the mother of his child.

I wouldn't want Greenwood here in any case but there is a very important distinction between the two cases.

 

[ombyman]

I reckon a club where the fans are pretty much on board with the manager or owners completely. Brighton?

No chance we could sign him. People have a tantrum because we changed the mascot suit.

Interesting perspective. Are you moaning that we wont sign such a player, having a pop at the fans, or having a pop at the owners, or any combo of those three?

 

[Alex Rae The Substitute]

Very hard for United to claim to be a family/ equality focused club and keep him on their books.

Yes he wasn’t found guilty of anything, but, the evidence of how he deemed it acceptable to treat his partner is there for all to see. The fact she has stayed with him doesn’t really matter either in my opinion. The club just can’t be seen to be accepting of that type behavior.

 

[ombyman]

Would it be different? Like Benjamin Mendy?

It's very hard for any of 'us' to know any truth. There will be so much spin and media Influence.
Apparantly golden boy Jack slept with the women who accused Mendy on the same evening at the same party?! What kind of party was it, what really happened, who knows.
On an unrelated note, that cheeky chappy Kyle Walker had a lockdown prostitute orgy but it was all ok as he was feeling low at the time.
There will be bad eggs and there will be 'lads'. Its probably easier they all avoid such activity...but not all of them will

 

[SuziQ]

A lot of people seem to be confused and keep saying he's been found not guilty when the charges were dropped as his partner wouldn't testify and any case the CPS had relied on her giving evidence in court.

I am glad they've seen sense and he won't play for them again. I also wouldn't want him anywhere near Wolves.

 

[Sketchead]

It’s not hard to do the right thing even when millions of pounds are involved. Baffling it took so long.

Anyone saying ‘well she’s forgiven him and dropped the charges’ as some sort of justification for saying we should look at signing him or everyone should be OK with him needs to have a word with themselves. Maybe looks into traits of perpetrators and victims of domestic abuse, Kasabian, or something like that.

If you think differently, ask your wife/girlfriend/daughter for their thoughts.

He should be starting number nine for Man Utd and first backup for England at major tournaments now but what a clown. See you later!

 

[rg4352]

It’s not hard to do the right thing even when millions of pounds are involved. Baffling it took so long.

Anyone saying ‘well she’s forgiven him and dropped the charges’ as some sort of justification for saying we should look at signing him or everyone should be OK with him needs to have a word with themselves. Maybe looks into traits of perpetrators and victims of domestic abuse, Kasabian, or something like that.

If you think differently, ask your wife/girlfriend/daughter for their thoughts.

He should be starting number nine for Man Utd and first backup for England at major tournaments now but what a clown. See you later!

Well said, had concerns it would never get to court at how her dad reacted to it all, red flags all over the place, but I digress, have always said wolves till I die, but if we were even considering mason greenwood that would be the straw that broke the camels back for me

 

[Mutchy]

Again, stick to the football side of the situation please, or I’ll just give up and move the thread.

 

[SellyWolf]

Interesting to read different people’s views, but if Wolves were to sign him then I would actively stop supporting the club until that decision was reversed. No questions, not even a difficult decision.

 

[SuperGran]

He’ll go abroad or to Forest I reckon.

 

[Loefah]

Again, stick to the football side of the situation please, or I’ll just give up and move the thread.

Deleting a post with a transcript that's out there for everyone to see as a reminder of why he shouldn't be able to play again? Ridiculous.

 

[thetwistedsock]

Common sense prevailed. Perhaps he has changed and will be a good father and husband.

I will be surprised to see him play for a team in the UK because the story will follow him, rightly so.

As has been said he will probably have to play abroad. His burgeoning England national side career is surely over.

 

[LetTheBullLoose]

Appreciate the comments about actual behavior, but this should really be what drives the level of public opinion and 'outrage'!

For example, if Wolves wanted to sign Goodwillie, I'd be massively against it. There wasn't enough evidence to convict him from a legal perspective, but it has been proven in a civil court that on the balance of probabilities, he is a rapist.

I can't imagine his victim has forgiven Goodwillie, or that her life will ever be the same, so on that basis, he can rot.

Greenwood had all charges dropped. The 'outrage' associated with Greenwood's case is purely down to what was released on Social Media. He has admitted that he has made mistakes, but we will never know exactly what happened, or the context of those Social Media posts.

The fact that Greenwood is now engaged to Harriet Robson and has a child with her suggests she has forgiven whatever went on. If she has forgiven him, maybe that's enough to realise they are past what happened so publicly? Is that enough for others to forgive what has happened too?

If he has legally done nothing wrong and his victim has forgiven him, surely that's enough to say, fair enough, just get on with it?!

No. No. No. He should not have the privilege of playing professional football, in the eyes of millions, based on what came out, social media driven or not. Speak to survivors of domestic abuse if you need any further convincing.

 

[arctic rime]

Piece of filth

 

[lostwolf]

I think part of the problem is he doesn't seem to have shown any contrition. Like if he came out and apologised and said he was taking counselling and behavioural courses, that he was a changed man looking for a second chance etc maybe you could see a way back for him.

The United statement seems to exonerate him, when we all know dropping charges isn't the same as not guilty

If he showed contrition that would maybe mean a bit. But if he said he was getting counselling and behavioural support I'd laugh; such an American approach to one's issues... if you don't want to do something (that's not an addiction) then just don't do it. The lad's a wrong'un who thought he was above reproach, he's been found out, and he's hopefully done on these shores. I wouldn't want some sort of ban for something that's not illegal, but I do want clubs to say - this lad's no good and we don't want him.

The reality though is that it's all about optics. These clubs don't really care about people's behaviour unless it reflects badly on them.

 

[Wolf 82]

i am usually all for second chances, but not in a capitalistic game like football where kids idolise their goal scorers more than any.. what message does it send.

 

[Sussex Wolf]

Again, stick to the football side of the situation please, or I’ll just give up and move the thread.

This is a tricky one Mutchy, as you obviously realised when you opened the thread. The subject is mainly about what he is alleged to have done off the pitch, not on it.

 

[Mutchy]

This is a tricky one Mutchy, as you obviously realised when you opened the thread. The subject is mainly about what he is alleged to have done off the pitch, not on it.

No, there’s a thread in the news forum section to discuss the allegations.
This one is football related, as per the questions I posed earlier about whether or not he can still have a career in the game, and how would we feel if our own club showed interest in signing him.

 

[theweave]

Someone will take him, their fans will be up in arms then he'll score goals and all will be forgotten. Look at Newcastle, fans morals go out of the window when they are winning games

 

[tonto]

No, there’s a thread in the news forum section to discuss the allegations.
This one is football related, as per the questions I posed earlier about whether or not he can still have a career in the game, and how would we feel if our own club showed interest in signing him.

The answer to that for me is a big fat NO does not deserve to ever play professional football ever again genuine SCUM

 

[Sussex Wolf]

No, there’s a thread in the news forum section to discuss the allegations.
This one is football related, as per the questions I posed earlier about whether or not he can still have a career in the game, and how would we feel if our own club showed interest in signing him.

That’s fair enough. But many posters rarely if ever venture over to the dark side so probably didn’t know it’s there!

 

[Asthmatic Wolf]

Appreciate the comments about actual behavior, but this should really be what drives the level of public opinion and 'outrage'!

For example, if Wolves wanted to sign Goodwillie, I'd be massively against it. There wasn't enough evidence to convict him from a legal perspective, but it has been proven in a civil court that on the balance of probabilities, he is a rapist.

I can't imagine his victim has forgiven Goodwillie, or that her life will ever be the same, so on that basis, he can rot.

Greenwood had all charges dropped. The 'outrage' associated with Greenwood's case is purely down to what was released on Social Media. He has admitted that he has made mistakes, but we will never know exactly what happened, or the context of those Social Media posts.

The fact that Greenwood is now engaged to Harriet Robson and has a child with her suggests she has forgiven whatever went on. If she has forgiven him, maybe that's enough to realise they are past what happened so publicly? Is that enough for others to forgive what has happened too?

If he has legally done nothing wrong and his victim has forgiven him, surely that's enough to say, fair enough, just get on with it?!

Because unless she is a liar, he beat and either raped or attempted to rape her.

So ‘just get on with it’ doesn’t really wash.

 

[lostwolf]

It's very hard for any of 'us' to know any truth. There will be so much spin and media Influence.
Apparantly golden boy Jack slept with the women who accused Mendy on the same evening at the same party?! What kind of party was it, what really happened, who knows.
On an unrelated note, that cheeky chappy Kyle Walker had a lockdown prostitute orgy but it was all ok as he was feeling low at the time.
There will be bad eggs and there will be 'lads'. Its probably easier they all avoid such activity...but not all of them will

There are points of similarity and points of massive and fundamentally important difference there. If Greesy had sex with the same women, but in his case it was consenting, then it's completely different, regardless of any puritanical ideas about sex. Again, we might have ideas about prostitution but a man sleeping with a prostitute (who may be argued to have chosen to sell relationships with her body; with the obvious caveat that it might not really be a choice for various horrible reasons) is qualitatively different to a man forcing himself on a woman.

The nuance here is incredibly important. It distinguishes between actions we might not approve of and others that society has (rightly imo) deemed immoral (e.g. being promiscuous or paying for sex vs forcing sex... the difference for the women is of course massive). Greenwood and Mendy weren't just sewing their oats, it is alleged.

 

[Oldgold Wolfcub]

David not Duncan

No he is obviously thinking of Duncan Badchopper.

 

[Monketron]

There will be a queue of clubs in for him, which is extremely depressing. I just hope Wolves are not one of them. I have a feeling he'll end up in Italy or something.

 

[lostwolf]

No, there’s a thread in the news forum section to discuss the allegations.
This one is football related, as per the questions I posed earlier about whether or not he can still have a career in the game, and how would we feel if our own club showed interest in signing him.

You and the other mods do a wonderful job of making sure this is one of if not the best club forums out there. I cringe at the ****e posted on most other club's forums when I read them before we play them, and if you want that free-for-all then there are other forums for ya. However... it's really difficult to disentangle the rights and wrongs of what Greenwood did and/or is alleged of doing and how we would feel if we signed him. I wonder whether 'moderation' needs moderation in this case?

Just to repeat what I've said already, from the transcripts of what he said to his missus, if he was ever on field for us I'd give him hell. He's a misogynist, a term that gets bounded about very lightly these days, but in this case I think it apposite.

 

[AndyY]

Common sense prevailed. Perhaps he has changed and will be a good father and husband.

I will be surprised to see him play for a team in the UK because the story will follow him, rightly so.

As has been said he will probably have to play abroad. His burgeoning England national side career is surely over.

Plenty of evidence around that domestic violence is rarely ever an isolated case.
Would we be ok, if he played for Wolves? Even if he scored 20 goals a season? Absolutely 100% NO
Would you want him to be going out with your daughter/ sister? I am pretty sure, NO!

 

[Willywolf]

Thing is, Lee Hughes was released from prison and came back into football, Ched Evans the same. No doubt somebody will give Greenwood a chance. He comes across as a vile and expectant little *****. That said, he’s also very immature with a huge public persona at a very young age. Some can handle it, some can’t, and some are just a wrong un. Not for me to decide, but somebody will get a decent striker if they’re willing to ignore him being a bit of a ****.

 

[Mutchy]

You and the other mods dona wonderful job of making sure this is one of if not the best club forums out there. I cringe at the ****e posted on most other club's forums, and if you want that free for all then there are other forums for ya. However... it's really difficult to disentangle the rights and wrongs of what Greenwood did and/or is alleged of doing and how we would feel if we signed him. I wonder whether 'moderation' needs moderation in this case?

Just to repeat what I've said already, from the transcripts of what he said to his missus, if he was ever on field for us I'd give him hell.

Thank you. From the point of this thread I guess it’s a case of looking at the career situation of someone carrying this kind of baggage with them.

 

[thetwistedsock]

Plenty of evidence around that domestic violence is rarely ever an isolated case.
Would we be ok, if he played for Wolves? Even if he scored 20 goals a season? Absolutely 100% NO
Would you want him to be going out with your daughter/ sister? I am pretty sure, NO!

Completely agree. People are people though.

 

[WickedWolfie]

Thing is, Lee Hughes was released from prison and came back into football, Ched Evans the same. No doubt somebody will give Greenwood a chance. He comes across as a vile and expectant little *****. That said, he’s also very immature with a huge public persona at a very young age. Some can handle it, some can’t, and some are just a wrong un. Not for me to decide, but somebody will get a decent striker if they’re willing to ignore him being a bit of a ****.

Ched Evans was very different. He was actually cleared on appeal.

 

[Wonder Boyo]

Chef Evans was very different. He was actually cleared on appeal.

Was he accused of poisoning their food?

 

[WickedWolfie]

Was he accused of poisoning their food?

Love it! Bloody predictive text lol....

 

[Wonder Boyo]

Love it! Bloody predictive text lol....

That predictive really made me laugh for some reason. Probably because I've been watching The Bear on Disney, a drama about a restaurant in which everyone calls each other chef!

 

[LetTheBullLoose]

Thing is, Lee Hughes was released from prison and came back into football, Ched Evans the same. No doubt somebody will give Greenwood a chance. He comes across as a vile and expectant little *****. That said, he’s also very immature with a huge public persona at a very young age. Some can handle it, some can’t, and some are just a wrong un. Not for me to decide, but somebody will get a decent striker if they’re willing to ignore him being a bit of a ****.

I hope you never, in a similar situation, have to say to a female member of your family, “ ignore him, he’s just being a bit of a ****”. Shocking take.

 

[Frank Lincoln]

I think his future lies abroad. I can’t see an English club taking the risk of signing him. I also wonder whether he will be considered for selection by England. There is just too much baggage that goes with him.

 

[Moira Stewart]

Again, stick to the football side of the situation please, or I’ll just give up and move the thread.

With respect, you started this thread and it is impossible to discuss this from a footballing point of view without any context of the reason he's been suspended and will likely never kick a ball in the PL again. The guy hasn't kicked a football for more than 18 months, the whole Mason Greenwood saga is nothing about football, the only relevance is as a footballer he's obviously a role model and then as a good footballer at that he's an asset to United if he plays but the rest of the story is more important than any footballer kicking a ball.

The statement Man Utd made today was quite pathetic, essentially they wanted to keep him on and they tested the water and realised it was impossible. Jonathan Liew wrote a very good article on this when it seemed the feeling was he would return.

Mason Greenwood and what will really decide if he plays for Manchester United again | Jonathan Liew

The club are consulting players in their women’s team before making a decision but the market, as always, is likely the key

www.theguardian.com

In the wider context Utd talked about in regards to the leaked media content was so strong they could and would have released it to clear his name as they have stated. The fact they haven't speaks volumes and if he were to have any kind of career again in this country you'd think that would have to be released to prove his innocence.

Also Greenwood mentioned in his statement he was found not guilty, which was never the case, the 'alleged victim' as United cowardly described her as dropped the case so a jury never had the opportunity to make an opinion on his guilt. I am sure he would be welcomed with open arms in Saudi with his attitude towards women, seems like the perfect match, either there or Newcastle.

 

[Oldvic161]

His alleged accuser, his girlfriend and now mother of his child obviously has forgiven him, not one of us know him personally, apart from a short exert from a longer tape and him playing on a football pitch. I’m pretty sure there’s little chance of him ever doing what he’s been accused of doing again. He is a young niaive man who needed stronger role models around him, sadly United didn’t have them in this instance. People have talked about role models, what better way to show that than by coming out, saying you regret everything you’ve done, working to show that behaviour is not acceptable and rehabilitating yourself in public. As it is, he’s already been shunned by most people, so there’s no chance of that happening in this country. Becoming a father will also change him and mature him.
This will hang over him forever, he has to live with that, he’s lost what he worked hard for since the age of 6, I’m not full of hate for him, if the alleged victim is happy to bring up a family with him that’s their business not mine. He will have a career somewhere.

 

[berwickwolf]

Yeah I get that, we've all been idiots and stupid when young
But sometimes you see sheer misogynistic power, brutality, and there has to be a line we don't cross, surely.
Nobody is perfect and mostly, there but for the grace of God..
But not with everything. And in my opinion, the tapes were horrendous
They are all our daughters. I saw that at the end of an article about so called Prince Andrew. Takes it from the play by Miller, all our sons.
It's true.