Bloated Squad

[Oldgold Wolfcub]

Yes we may have a big squad but Stale will need time to evaluate the squad and decide who to keep for the long haul. Also if players are on a long term contract and no one wants them they will stay.
At the same time he must keep one eye on promotion so I would not be surprised if a number of our squad went on loan. This will enable them to gain experience and for us to trim the wage bill at the same time.
The important task for Stale is to see which players he thinks he can raise their game in order to make an impression in the prem. This will be made more difficult if all our underachieving backroom staff stay. Stale needs to improve all areas of this club and it is asking too much to do it on his own with the handicap of the present staff.
Personally I am looking forward to seeing certain players performing in a different way and this will involve a massive change in thinking as opposed to the old regime. I dont think it should take Stale long to suss out which players will adapt but although then the squad can be trimmed we dont want to give players away at low prices.

 

[Greeno]

Yes we may have a big squad but Stale will need time to evaluate the squad and decide who to keep for the long haul. Also if players are on a long term contract and no one wants them they will stay.
At the same time he must keep one eye on promotion so I would not be surprised if a number of our squad went on loan. This will enable them to gain experience and for us to trim the wage bill at the same time.
The important task for Stale is to see which players he thinks he can raise their game in order to make an impression in the prem. This will be made more difficult if all our underachieving backroom staff stay. Stale needs to improve all areas of this club and it is asking too much to do it on his own with the handicap of the present staff.
Personally I am looking forward to seeing certain players performing in a different way and this will involve a massive change in thinking as opposed to the old regime. I dont think it should take Stale long to suss out which players will adapt but although then the squad can be trimmed we dont want to give players away at low prices.

Have to agree with all of this.. and we need to carefully consider who is moved on and no make the same mistakes as we have done in our previous 'squad cleansing' escapades with players that end up passing us on the way up ... Bennett, Surman etc...

They could have easily been retained.

 

[Craddockinho]

I would say we have a current first team squad of 36 (only included players with League One experience upwards):

Goalkeepers 3 (Hennessey, De Vries, Ikeme)
Defenders 12 (Foley, Zubar, Doherty, Stearman, Berra, Johnson, Batth, Craddock, Mouyokolo, Elokobi, Ward, Reckford)
Midfielders 13 (Kightly, Hammill, Mendez-Laing, Edwards, Henry, Davis, O’Hara, Milijas, Jonsson, Guedioura, Hunt, Jarvis, Forde)
Forwards 8 (Doyle, Fletcher, Ebanks-Blake, Vokes, Sigurdarson, Griffiths, Nouble, Cassidy)
Anyone i've missed?

 

[Wolves in Limerick]

If that list were to be reduced, then I think the following would be those to go: Ikeme (good goalkeeper even at our current level, had an exceptional run at Middlesborough last season but injury prone. Also reasonably young and could raise some money from his transfer), Johnson, Jody, George, Jonsson and Hunt. Despite the comments of fans on here, suggesting Jonsson could go may be unfair as it is not always our most balanced fans that have come on here slagging him off. I expect that at least two of our big names will move on. Such a cull reduces the panel by 8 players though on any of the above SS may have a different opinion.

 

[RJs Tankard]

Some of you on here live in a different world, we're in the championship now there's probably 20 teami in this league that would love a defence of foley, Johnson, berra and ward. They'll be fine for next season. Yes they struggled in the premier at times against the likes of van persie, rooney etc and a lesser extent dempsey, holt etc but the best we'll come up against next year is the likes of Marlon king, Matt Phillips so they'll be fine. Players i'd want moving on George, Edwards! Milijas, vokes, zubar, hunt.

So you're saying that "people are living in a different world" for naming some players that you feel we should keep - but then you say you'd like to get rid of Zubar (who was better than Foley last season - the player you say we should keep).

Foley hasn't done anything over the past 18 months - he looks a different player to the player that was exceptional 3/4 years ago and was rated by many of one of the best right-backs in the country.

How times change. Last season, he looked like one of the worst in the country.

I agree with Milijas, Vokes and Hunt though.

George, in my opinion, can't go until we sign another "proper" left back. Ward was poor last season - and it didn't help that his position was unchallenged (particularly when George went out on loan). Ward needs some competition for his place to make him work for it. Whilst Ward knows he can put in less effort and still be guaranteed a game, then he'll continue to do so. George may not be much better, but at least whilst he's around, he's there to put some pressure on Ward for his place. To be honest, i'd rather have George in the side than Ward anyway.

Its baffling why we have so many right backs at the club - yet we've been left very very thin at left back.

 

[Tring Wolf]

I'd be happy if we ended up with a squad of around 22-25 players. Something along the lines of:

Goalkeepers
Hennessey, De Vries, McCarey

Defenders
Foley, Doherty, Berra, Batth, Ward, Stearman, Craddock, New CB, New LB

Midfielders
Kightly, Jarvis, Henry, Guedioura, Edwards, Forde, O'Hara or Milijas, New CM

Attackers
Fletcher, Sigurdarson, Ebanks-Blake, Vokes, Nouble

The rest probably need to move on for the sake of their careers or I wouldn't be too concerned about if we sold.

 

[Tring Wolf]

So you're saying that "people are living in a different world" for naming some players that you feel we should keep - but then you say you'd like to get rid of Zubar (who was better than Foley last season - the player you say we should keep).

Foley hasn't done anything over the past 18 months - he looks a different player to the player that was exceptional 3/4 years ago and was rated by many of one of the best right-backs in the country.

How times change. Last season, he looked like one of the worst in the country.

I agree with Milijas, Vokes and Hunt though.

George, in my opinion, can't go until we sign another "proper" left back. Ward was poor last season - and it didn't help that his position was unchallenged (particularly when George went out on loan). Ward needs some competition for his place to make him work for it. Whilst Ward knows he can put in less effort and still be guaranteed a game, then he'll continue to do so.

Its baffling why we have so many right backs at the club - yet we've very very thin at left back.

I agree that Foley was poor last season but Zubar was one of the very few players who I actually thought was even worse. The only game I can remember where he played well was Newcastle away. He was particularly terrible against Stoke and Fulham and an absolute liability against Man Utd.

To be fair to both of them, they both struggled massively with injuries (and in Foley's case being played out of position) but if I had a choice between the two, it would always be Foley...even based on last season.

 

[Jameswwfc]

Tankard personally i'd keep foley over zubar, zubar is probably on 20k a week where i think it could be used better else where and i've never really rated zubar if i'm honest 1 good game in 10.

 

[RJs Tankard]

Yeah you're right about Zubar from a salary point of view - and he's not a great player either. However, looking at Foleys form over the past couple of seasons, it looks like we may have seen his best days too.

I'd like to be proven wrong because Foley at his best is a valuable player - but I reckon that if he doesn't rediscover his old form in the Championship, then he perhaps needs to be moved on - along with Zubar.

 

[Barnet Wolves]

The 2 CHs have to go, they're $$$$ and have been for 3 seasons. Also, the Craddock bull$$$$ has to end, he's a good man but he is old and $$$$. Zubar and Foley are about as $$$$ as each other and either one can go and we wouldn't notice it. The middle of our midfield was fantastically $$$$ so arguing about Edwards or Milijas is like arguing about what's worse a shot to the front of the head or the back of the head, they're both equally $$$$, let's get $$$$ing real for a change. Ward is $$$$ too. Doyle is $$$$ and lazy to boot, Vokes isn't even a $$$$ing footballer so he can $$$$ off too.

There ya go, settled. SS does not need more time to evaluate the squad, our team reeks to high heaven and it's time we broke up the team and put to rest the lie that Mick's young and hungry approach was a success. It wasn't, there is no legacy aside from leaving us with a bloated pile of $$$$ to clear up. We're in the second tier of English football for a reason, we're $$$$ and will continue to be unless we reinvent the way we play.

If you can't see it then you also can't see England are $$$$ and there are clear reasons for us being crap at that level.

 

[Golden Arrow]

The 2 CHs have to go, they're $$$$ and have been for 3 seasons. Also, the Craddock bull$$$$ has to end, he's a good man but he is old and $$$$. Zubar and Foley are about as $$$$ as each other and either one can go and we wouldn't notice it. The middle of our midfield was fantastically $$$$ so arguing about Edwards or Milijas is like arguing about what's worse a shot to the front of the head or the back of the head, they're both equally $$$$, let's get $$$$ing real for a change. Ward is $$$$ too. Doyle is $$$$ and lazy to boot, Vokes isn't even a $$$$ing footballer so he can $$$$ off too.

There ya go, settled. SS does not need more time to evaluate the squad, our team reeks to high heaven and it's time we broke up the team and put to rest the lie that Mick's young and hungry approach was a success. It wasn't, there is no legacy aside from leaving us with a bloated pile of $$$$ to clear up. We're in the second tier of English football for a reason, we're $$$$ and will continue to be unless we reinvent the way we play.

If you can't see it then you also can't see England are $$$$ and there are clear reasons for us being crap at that level.

Don't beat around the bush Barnet Wolves

 

[Oldgold Wolfcub]

The 2 CHs have to go, they're $$$$ and have been for 3 seasons. Also, the Craddock bull$$$$ has to end, he's a good man but he is old and $$$$. Zubar and Foley are about as $$$$ as each other and either one can go and we wouldn't notice it. The middle of our midfield was fantastically $$$$ so arguing about Edwards or Milijas is like arguing about what's worse a shot to the front of the head or the back of the head, they're both equally $$$$, let's get $$$$ing real for a change. Ward is $$$$ too. Doyle is $$$$ and lazy to boot, Vokes isn't even a $$$$ing footballer so he can $$$$ off too.

There ya go, settled. SS does not need more time to evaluate the squad, our team reeks to high heaven and it's time we broke up the team and put to rest the lie that Mick's young and hungry approach was a success. It wasn't, there is no legacy aside from leaving us with a bloated pile of $$$$ to clear up. We're in the second tier of English football for a reason, we're $$$$ and will continue to be unless we reinvent the way we play.

If you can't see it then you also can't see England are $$$$ and there are clear reasons for us being crap at that level.

Maybe so but what we have been left with is still a thousand times better than Jones took down. Most of the players you mention are capable of far more than they have showed last season.

 

[WalsallWolf]

The 2 CHs have to go, they're $$$$ and have been for 3 seasons. Also, the Craddock bull$$$$ has to end, he's a good man but he is old and $$$$. Zubar and Foley are about as $$$$ as each other and either one can go and we wouldn't notice it. The middle of our midfield was fantastically $$$$ so arguing about Edwards or Milijas is like arguing about what's worse a shot to the front of the head or the back of the head, they're both equally $$$$, let's get $$$$ing real for a change. Ward is $$$$ too. Doyle is $$$$ and lazy to boot, Vokes isn't even a $$$$ing footballer so he can $$$$ off too.

There ya go, settled. SS does not need more time to evaluate the squad, our team reeks to high heaven and it's time we broke up the team and put to rest the lie that Mick's young and hungry approach was a success. It wasn't, there is no legacy aside from leaving us with a bloated pile of $$$$ to clear up. We're in the second tier of English football for a reason, we're $$$$ and will continue to be unless we reinvent the way we play.

If you can't see it then you also can't see England are $$$$ and there are clear reasons for us being crap at that level.

Any cliff notes?

As $$$$ as they were, 7 of those 10 players you mentioned got us up 3 years ago.

On another note has anyone read this? http://www.birminghammail.net/birmi...o-leave-club-by-chris-iwelumo-97319-31286822/

Rightly or wrongly this has really got up my skin. Shut the $$$$ up Chris! He has basically gone through all of our squad and touted them for moves!

 

[Oldgold Wolfcub]

Any cliff notes?

As $$$$ as they were, 7 of those 10 players you mentioned got us up 3 years ago.

On another note has anyone read this? http://www.birminghammail.net/birmi...o-leave-club-by-chris-iwelumo-97319-31286822/

Rightly or wrongly this has really got up my skin. Shut the $$$$ up Chris! He has basically gone through all of our squad and touted them for moves!

I am glad you have voiced this. Even though I know its a lot of nonsense it has irritated me that he has said this in public. It is disrespectful to a former club and has lessened my opinion of him.

 

[we8wba]

to much love for foley imo who hasnt done anything since promoted year

fine people saying well x y z got us promoted last time, the league progresses year after year and at the time many of our players confidence were sky high now look at say ebanks who probably at all time low etc....

we need fresh blood than the "old guard" if we want to get promoted

 

[JOSWolf]

I'd be happy if we ended up with a squad of around 22-25 players. Something along the lines of:

Goalkeepers
Hennessey, De Vries, McCarey

Defenders
Foley, Doherty, Berra, Batth, Ward, Stearman, Craddock, New CB, New LB

Midfielders
Kightly, Jarvis, Henry, Guedioura, Edwards, Forde, O'Hara or Milijas, New CM

Attackers
Fletcher, Sigurdarson, Ebanks-Blake, Vokes, Nouble

The rest probably need to move on for the sake of their careers or I wouldn't be too concerned about if we sold.

I think we will have a bigger squad than this. We will need a bigger squad. The championship is along hard slog. We will also need more back up for the wingers than just Forde as we know how injury prone Kites is.
I can also see Vokes leaving and we will also have Ikeme still here and the likes of Cassidy and maybe Mendez Laing and Reckord, Gorman and Price trying to push for places.

 

[JOSWolf]

I am glad you have voiced this. Even though I know its a lot of nonsense it has irritated me that he has said this in public. It is disrespectful to a former club and has lessened my opinion of him.

The local media seem almost desperate for us to lose all of our best players.
Iwelumo should keep his beak shut!

 

[cannockwolves]

Love Zubar's passion and commitment but for me:

1. Foley is a better right-back who is far more comfortable in possession.
2. We have a highly promising youngster in Doherty as back-up (together with Stearman who can also play there).
3. Zubar would have a relatively decent resale value (£1.5-£2m) enabling funds to be directed to other areas where we are not as strongly covered.
4. I'd imagine he is a relatively high wage earner so again we could free up funds for other areas which need addressing more urgently.

spot on mate, I would also add Mouyokolo is due to be fit in a few months and my Hull supporting mate raves about just how good he was paying at right back.

 

[Oxford_Wolf]

+ Moyokolo.

I can't see us moving on 10-15 senior players thi summer. We still need strength in depth and if we do sell Fletch and Jarvis we'll have enough money to not need to worry about wages.

I hope that come August our side will still contain: DeVries, Moyokolo (who has never been given a chance), Baath, Zubar, Hamill, Kightly, Guediora, Milias, SEB, Sigurtson and a new left back.
The depth provided by the likes of Elokobi, Berra, Foley, Vokes, Nouble and Davis should be enough for a top 6 finish if not automatic promotion.

We should definitely be looking to move on Jarvis and Fletcher (for the pay day), O'Hara and Johnson (As they don't want to be here), Edwards and Stearman (as they are not good enough) and I could give or take Henry, Ward, Jonsson and Hunt (at the right price).

 

[yateleywolf]

The 2 CHs have to go, they're $$$$ and have been for 3 seasons. Also, the Craddock bull$$$$ has to end, he's a good man but he is old and $$$$. Zubar and Foley are about as $$$$ as each other and either one can go and we wouldn't notice it. The middle of our midfield was fantastically $$$$ so arguing about Edwards or Milijas is like arguing about what's worse a shot to the front of the head or the back of the head, they're both equally $$$$, let's get $$$$ing real for a change. Ward is $$$$ too. Doyle is $$$$ and lazy to boot, Vokes isn't even a $$$$ing footballer so he can $$$$ off too.

There ya go, settled. SS does not need more time to evaluate the squad, our team reeks to high heaven and it's time we broke up the team and put to rest the lie that Mick's young and hungry approach was a success. It wasn't, there is no legacy aside from leaving us with a bloated pile of $$$$ to clear up. We're in the second tier of English football for a reason, we're $$$$ and will continue to be unless we reinvent the way we play.

If you can't see it then you also can't see England are $$$$ and there are clear reasons for us being crap at that level.

Quality post Barnet i share your frustration but not sure whole-sale changes would be the best idea now. I`m really surprised that the club allowed so many players to run-down their contracts as i can`t see us getting good returns on those players SS want`s to move on.

 

[cannockwolves]

The 2 CHs have to go, they're $$$$ and have been for 3 seasons. Also, the Craddock bull$$$$ has to end, he's a good man but he is old and $$$$. Zubar and Foley are about as $$$$ as each other and either one can go and we wouldn't notice it. The middle of our midfield was fantastically $$$$ so arguing about Edwards or Milijas is like arguing about what's worse a shot to the front of the head or the back of the head, they're both equally $$$$, let's get $$$$ing real for a change. Ward is $$$$ too. Doyle is $$$$ and lazy to boot, Vokes isn't even a $$$$ing footballer so he can $$$$ off too.

There ya go, settled. SS does not need more time to evaluate the squad, our team reeks to high heaven and it's time we broke up the team and put to rest the lie that Mick's young and hungry approach was a success. It wasn't, there is no legacy aside from leaving us with a bloated pile of $$$$ to clear up. We're in the second tier of English football for a reason, we're $$$$ and will continue to be unless we reinvent the way we play.

If you can't see it then you also can't see England are $$$$ and there are clear reasons for us being crap at that level.

I am laughing so much I can't breath, in fact I have just read this out to a few people and there are three of us crying with laughter – so funny

I know what you mean about the sentiments, but of cause it’s all relevant. As premier league footballers I would agree with what you say, but as championship players most are capable of making a run for the play offs at least.

Thanks for the laugh, I really needed that, but I don’t think we could or should get rid of everyone you mentioned

 

[Barnet Wolves]

Glad to be of service lads. I was too scared of the backlash to mention Henry so left him out of my menstural tirade.

There is a grain of truth in what I wrote, it is a logical fallacy to claim that the team that took us up before can do it again. It's time we changed our hoofball tactics and I'm not sure we can with the likes of some of my players I nailed.

 

[WonderWolf]

The 2 CHs have to go, they're $$$$ and have been for 3 seasons. Also, the Craddock bull$$$$ has to end, he's a good man but he is old and $$$$. Zubar and Foley are about as $$$$ as each other and either one can go and we wouldn't notice it. The middle of our midfield was fantastically $$$$ so arguing about Edwards or Milijas is like arguing about what's worse a shot to the front of the head or the back of the head, they're both equally $$$$, let's get $$$$ing real for a change. Ward is $$$$ too. Doyle is $$$$ and lazy to boot, Vokes isn't even a $$$$ing footballer so he can $$$$ off too.

There ya go, settled. SS does not need more time to evaluate the squad, our team reeks to high heaven and it's time we broke up the team and put to rest the lie that Mick's young and hungry approach was a success. It wasn't, there is no legacy aside from leaving us with a bloated pile of $$$$ to clear up. We're in the second tier of English football for a reason, we're $$$$ and will continue to be unless we reinvent the way we play.

If you can't see it then you also can't see England are $$$$ and there are clear reasons for us being crap at that level.

..... That's a right pile of tough $$$$ there!....and it doesn't include the 'big $$$$' we took on that messed up our chances.

As said by Cannockwolf this squad is good enough to make a very good challenge for a quick return providing we keep our top players.

The secret is to utilise these limited players and then dump them when we return. Successful clubs look at players when purchased, make a call on their potential to be good enough, and if non, get rid.....we just end up trying/hoping again and again they will come good in some magical formation.....

The 'product' expert that is Skooby will make the necessary calls.

 

[SimplyTheWolves]

WonderWolf can you explain again (if you have done) just why you insist on calling Stale Skooby? Because I really don't see the relevance.

 

[WonderWolf]

WonderWolf can you explain again (if you have done) just why you insist on calling Stale Skooby? Because I really don't see the relevance.

Looky here - http://www.molineuxmix.co.uk/vb/showpost.php?p=1404299&postcount=36

 

[SimplyTheWolves]

Looky here - http://www.molineuxmix.co.uk/vb/showpost.php?p=1404299&postcount=36

Oh well, that explains it then, very deep and thoughtful.

Skooby snack anyone?

 

[WonderWolf]

Oh well, that explains it then, very deep and thoughtful.

Skooby snack anyone?

Me please!........it seems a bit too deep for some!

If he starts wielding his battleaxe I'm going to start calling him Skrappy...

 

[SimplyTheWolves]

Me please!........it seems a bit too deep for some!

If he starts wielding his battleaxe I'm going to start calling him Skrappy...

When all said and done WW it's up to you what you call him, if Skrappy makes you happy then go for it. After all, judging from the reaction on here that Skooby won't dooby, try it for a bit to see if it fits.

 

[OLDGOLD]

Yes some squad culling to be done. I for one would prefer to keep Zubar rather than Foley, at least at the moment as we should be looking to go forward a lot more this season.

I think some folks are unfair to Dave Edwards. Not the greatest player ever, but then who in our squad is, but, using a Mickism, at least he tried and put a shift in when called for last season unlike a lot of the others. I can forgive limited ability, but not limited effort

I would be quiet happy for Foley to leave along with Johnson and Jonson, Craddock (sentiment aside), O Hara, Hunt, Doyle, SEB ( will divide opinion this). I fully expect Jarvis and Fletch to go. I would be upset if Kites goes. I would like to see Moyo fit. I would like to see Ward or George go and a LB brought in. I would like to see Milijas and Gued given a chance pre season.

I would like to teach the world to sing....

 

[Oldgold Wolfcub]

I would like to teach the world to sing....

If you had heard me you would know what a challenge that was.

 

[Bankswolf II]

I feel quite confidently that once it's said and done and the players leave we as a team and a fanbase will move on without too much heartbreak no matter who goes

Sure a few people rave about fletcher and that would be a shame same for Jarvis but the majority of them I'm afraid are easily replaceable and most won't be missed too much

 

[SimplyTheWolves]

I feel quite confidently that once it's said and done and the players leave we as a team and a fanbase will move on without too much heartbreak no matter who goes

Sure a few people rave about fletcher and that would be a shame same for Jarvis but the majority of them I'm afraid are easily replaceable and most won't be missed too much

I agree with this and some may not agree, but at the end of the day it's a very reasonable and realistic comment. None of our players are yet legends in our eyes, so if they go they go, let's move on.