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Bielsa - shortlist for FIFA coach of the year

northnorfolkwolf

northnorfolkwolf

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I expect Bielsa's watching Mourinho's approach to his game on the bus back and thinking that's what I should have done. He's living on his reputation. He took a year longer to get out of the Champs than Nuno and he'll not finish 7th this year. And Nuno speaks English. I know which manager I'd have!
 
D

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northnorfolkwolf said:
I expect Bielsa's watching Mourinho's approach to his game on the bus back and thinking that's what I should have done. He's living on his reputation. He took a year longer to get out of the Champs than Nuno and he'll not finish 7th this year. And Nuno speaks English. I know which manager I'd have!
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Even though nuno is more defensive and rigid?
 
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Andy

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Plus Nuno was ten minutes from an FA Cup final in his first premier league season. Bielsa lost heavily to Crawley
 
Vicious Sid

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hans dieter flick is a joke name surely, even by german standards, so he can flick off.
klopps teeth are blindingly white and i can't afford a trained labrador so he can join flicky
lopetegui turned us down so he's out
zin zed wins enough as it is

so step forward mad marco ......

no reaction, can't understand a word of english, so here you are nuno ...........
 
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SuperGran

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what an absolute genius Bielsa is, the football they played today and the way they pressed and attacked in waves was simply breath taking.

Ignore the fact they lost 3-0 to Crawley Town. It doesn't matter.

Just give manager of the year to Bielsa now
 
WickedWolfie

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northnorfolkwolf said:
I expect Bielsa's watching Mourinho's approach to his game on the bus back and thinking that's what I should have done. He's living on his reputation. He took a year longer to get out of the Champs than Nuno and he'll not finish 7th this year. And Nuno speaks English. I know which manager I'd have!
Click to expand...
Bielsa speaks English. For some reason though he won't do interviews in it.
 
Ned

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A quick look at Bielsa’s list of trophies and you find: a championship title with Leeds, a few leagues in South America, an Olympic gold medal with Argentina and a runners up medal in the Spanish cup.

That is literally everything of note.

Graham Taylor has had a better managerial career.
 
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WeAreTheWolvesII

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I do fear that many of you don't actually want to listen, but I'll briefly explain what the fuss is about.

Firstly, the trophies. Bielsa doesn't manage the best teams in the league, so this is a strange thing to level at him. He has won in South America, but every European club are nowhere near the elite. Maybe the top, top players don't respond to his demanding methods, maybe he just wants to be different. Either way, he manages clubs that aren't good enough to win trophies.

So, yes, he loses a few finals. Athletic Bilbao lost a Copa Del Rey to Pep's Barcelona, that's nothing to be ridiculed for. They lost a Europa League final to Atletico Madrid, after beating Fergie's United among others, to get to that stage.

This is overachieving. They shouldn't have been in with a sniff of being there. It would be like someone criticising Nuno if Wolves had got to the FA Cup final and lost to City. What would we say to someone who said Nuno was a bottler? I'd say, on what planet should we be beating Man City to a trophy.

Also, Nuno has won nothing. And, he has been with Porto. What does that make him according to your logic?

Bielsa transformed and overachieved with Chile, and he did very well with Marseille. For balance, he was very bad with Lille.

Then, Leeds. He inherited a pretty average Championship side. Again, reaching the play-offs was overachieving when he took over, even if they threw it away at the end. They then win the league.

The bigger point with Bielsa is the way they play.

Surely, you all acknowledge it's a lot easier to be successful by defending? That's NOT to say it's easy. It's just easier to organise a team to sit 10 behind the ball and break at pace. He takes it to the opposition and attacks.

This Leeds team is in the bottom three or four if you looked at them player for player. Who is good? Many ridiculed Bamford. Ayling and Dallas have been lower league players their whole life. Meslier is an unproven kid. Klich was bombed out by previous Championship managers. Yes, they've spent a few quid on some players, but this is a Leeds side player for player that should probably just about stay up.

Anyway, with all that, he creates a team that is great to watch with the attacking football they play. There's no sitting back, defending like mad. It's all-out, exciting football trying to win.

And, it's against the norm. Very few managers in the world, with clearly inferior resources, are willing to take the game to the opposition. It's bold and brave, which is why it's unique.

Obviously, today was a shambles, and he disrespected the cup despite bigging it up before. I found it very funny and was glad Leeds lost. I'd also love it if they went down, but that doesn't mean I'll be blinkered to Bielsa who has done a fine job at Leeds with his results and style.

Oh, and I don't think he should've been shortlisted for Coach of the Year either, but his reputation is deserved.
 
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D

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WeAreTheWolvesII said:
I do fear that many of you don't actually want to listen, but I'll briefly explain what the fuss is about.

Firstly, the trophies. Bielsa doesn't manage the best teams in the league, so this is a strange thing to level at him. He has won in South America, but every European club are nowhere near the elite. Maybe the top, top players don't respond to his demanding methods, maybe he just wants to be different. Either way, he manages clubs that aren't good enough to win trophies.

So, yes, he loses a few finals. Athletic Bilbao lost a Copa Del Rey to Pep's Barcelona, that's nothing to be ridiculed for. They lost a Europa League final to Atletico Madrid, after beating Fergie's United among others, to get to that stage.

This is overachieving. They shouldn't have been in with a sniff of being there. It would be like someone criticising Nuno if Wolves had got to the FA Cup final and lost to City. What would we say to someone who said Nuno was a bottler? I'd say, on what planet should we be beating Man City to a trophy.

Also, Nuno has won nothing. And, he has been with Porto. What does that make him according to your logic?

Bielsa transformed and overachieved with Chile, and he did very well with Marseille. For balance, he was very bad with Lille.

Then, Leeds. He inherited a pretty average Championship side. Again, reaching the play-offs was overachieving when he took over, even if they threw it away at the end. They then win the league.

The bigger point with Bielsa is the way they play.

Surely, you all acknowledge it's a lot easier to be successful by defending? That's NOT to say it's easy. It's just easier to organise a team to sit 10 behind the ball and break at pace. He takes it to the opposition and attacks.

This Leeds team is in the bottom three or four if you looked at them player for player. Who is good? You all ridiculed Bamford. Ayling and Dallas have been lower league players their whole life. Meslier is an unproven kid. Klich was bombed out by previous Championship managers. Yes, they've spent a few quid on some players, but this is a Leeds side player for player that should probably just about stay up.

Anyway, with all that, he creates a team that is great to watch with the attacking football they play. There's no sitting back, defending like mad. It's all-out, exciting football trying to win.

And, it's against the norm. Very few managers in the world, with clearly inferior resources, are willing to take the game to the opposition. It's bold and brave, which is why it's unique.

Obviously, today was a shambles, and he disrespected the cup despite bigging it up before. I found it very funny and was glad Leeds lost. I'd also love it if they went down, but that doesn't mean I'll be blinkered to Bielsa who has done a fine job at Leeds with his results and style.

Oh, and I don't think he should've been shortlisted for Coach of the Year either, but his reputation is deserved.
Click to expand...

Please point out where I have ridiculed bamford?
 
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WeAreTheWolvesII said:
I do fear that many of you don't actually want to listen, but I'll briefly explain what the fuss is about.

Firstly, the trophies. Bielsa doesn't manage the best teams in the league, so this is a strange thing to level at him. He has won in South America, but every European club are nowhere near the elite. Maybe the top, top players don't respond to his demanding methods, maybe he just wants to be different. Either way, he manages clubs that aren't good enough to win trophies.

So, yes, he loses a few finals. Athletic Bilbao lost a Copa Del Rey to Pep's Barcelona, that's nothing to be ridiculed for. They lost a Europa League final to Atletico Madrid, after beating Fergie's United among others, to get to that stage.

This is overachieving. They shouldn't have been in with a sniff of being there. It would be like someone criticising Nuno if Wolves had got to the FA Cup final and lost to City. What would we say to someone who said Nuno was a bottler? I'd say, on what planet should we be beating Man City to a trophy.

Also, Nuno has won nothing. And, he has been with Porto. What does that make him according to your logic?

Bielsa transformed and overachieved with Chile, and he did very well with Marseille. For balance, he was very bad with Lille.

Then, Leeds. He inherited a pretty average Championship side. Again, reaching the play-offs was overachieving when he took over, even if they threw it away at the end. They then win the league.

The bigger point with Bielsa is the way they play.

Surely, you all acknowledge it's a lot easier to be successful by defending? That's NOT to say it's easy. It's just easier to organise a team to sit 10 behind the ball and break at pace. He takes it to the opposition and attacks.

This Leeds team is in the bottom three or four if you looked at them player for player. Who is good? Many ridiculed Bamford. Ayling and Dallas have been lower league players their whole life. Meslier is an unproven kid. Klich was bombed out by previous Championship managers. Yes, they've spent a few quid on some players, but this is a Leeds side player for player that should probably just about stay up.

Anyway, with all that, he creates a team that is great to watch with the attacking football they play. There's no sitting back, defending like mad. It's all-out, exciting football trying to win.

And, it's against the norm. Very few managers in the world, with clearly inferior resources, are willing to take the game to the opposition. It's bold and brave, which is why it's unique.

Obviously, today was a shambles, and he disrespected the cup despite bigging it up before. I found it very funny and was glad Leeds lost. I'd also love it if they went down, but that doesn't mean I'll be blinkered to Bielsa who has done a fine job at Leeds with his results and style.

Oh, and I don't think he should've been shortlisted for Coach of the Year either, but his reputation is deserved.
Click to expand...
I don’t think it makes him ‘Great’ though
 
Ned

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WeAreTheWolvesII said:
I do fear that many of you don't actually want to listen, but I'll briefly explain what the fuss is about.

Firstly, the trophies. Bielsa doesn't manage the best teams in the league, so this is a strange thing to level at him. He has won in South America, but every European club are nowhere near the elite. Maybe the top, top players don't respond to his demanding methods, maybe he just wants to be different. Either way, he manages clubs that aren't good enough to win trophies.

So, yes, he loses a few finals. Athletic Bilbao lost a Copa Del Rey to Pep's Barcelona, that's nothing to be ridiculed for. They lost a Europa League final to Atletico Madrid, after beating Fergie's United among others, to get to that stage.

This is overachieving. They shouldn't have been in with a sniff of being there. It would be like someone criticising Nuno if Wolves had got to the FA Cup final and lost to City. What would we say to someone who said Nuno was a bottler? I'd say, on what planet should we be beating Man City to a trophy.

Also, Nuno has won nothing. And, he has been with Porto. What does that make him according to your logic?

Bielsa transformed and overachieved with Chile, and he did very well with Marseille. For balance, he was very bad with Lille.

Then, Leeds. He inherited a pretty average Championship side. Again, reaching the play-offs was overachieving when he took over, even if they threw it away at the end. They then win the league.

The bigger point with Bielsa is the way they play.

Surely, you all acknowledge it's a lot easier to be successful by defending? That's NOT to say it's easy. It's just easier to organise a team to sit 10 behind the ball and break at pace. He takes it to the opposition and attacks.

This Leeds team is in the bottom three or four if you looked at them player for player. Who is good? Many ridiculed Bamford. Ayling and Dallas have been lower league players their whole life. Meslier is an unproven kid. Klich was bombed out by previous Championship managers. Yes, they've spent a few quid on some players, but this is a Leeds side player for player that should probably just about stay up.

Anyway, with all that, he creates a team that is great to watch with the attacking football they play. There's no sitting back, defending like mad. It's all-out, exciting football trying to win.

And, it's against the norm. Very few managers in the world, with clearly inferior resources, are willing to take the game to the opposition. It's bold and brave, which is why it's unique.

Obviously, today was a shambles, and he disrespected the cup despite bigging it up before. I found it very funny and was glad Leeds lost. I'd also love it if they went down, but that doesn't mean I'll be blinkered to Bielsa who has done a fine job at Leeds with his results and style.

Oh, and I don't think he should've been shortlisted for Coach of the Year either, but his reputation is deserved.
Click to expand...
Good post but none of your points are deserving of somebody being called a great manager and being touted as highly as he is.

It’s not his fault and when we criticise him it’s mainly in mocking response to the universal media love in that has taken over.

Surely if his reputation is deserved, as you say, he would have had top clubs fighting over him every single time jobs come up?
 
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WeAreTheWolvesII

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Jonzy54 said:
I don’t think it makes him ‘Great’ though
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Fair enough, I do. That's because of the legacy he leaves as well. People try to copy aspects of his style, and there's denying that people like him have helped shape modern football and the more attacking, high-pressing style we generally see today.
 
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WeAreTheWolvesII

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Ned said:
Good post but none of your points are deserving of somebody being called a great manager and being touted as highly as he is.

It’s not his fault and when we criticise him it’s mainly in mocking response to the universal media love in that has taken over.

Surely if his reputation is deserved, as you say, he would have had top clubs fighting over him every single time jobs come up?
Click to expand...
Fair point, but who should be called a great manager? As I say, trophies can't be levelled at him because he should never, ever win them with the team he manages.

What's Nuno? Does Pochettino become a 'great' manager now he will inevitably win trophies with PSG? I think he is for transforming Spurs and taking them to a Champions League final(!). Yet, he won't win anything until now, but he's only winning because he has the best team by a mile in France.

I'm sure he has had offers (there was talk Messi told Barca to appoint him before Koeman), but he is pretty weird/unique. He doesn't seem to chase glory or even the biggest paid jobs. Like, why Leeds? He's odd in that sense.
 
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WeAreTheWolvesII said:
Fair point, but who should be called a great manager? As I say, trophies can't be levelled at him because he should never, ever win them with the team he manages.

What's Nuno? Does Pochettino become a 'great' manager now he will inevitably win trophies with PSG? I think he is for transforming Spurs and taking them to a Champions League final(!). Yet, he won't win anything until now, but he's only winning because he has the best team by a mile in France.

I'm sure he has had offers (there was talk Messi told Barca to appoint him before Koeman), but he is pretty weird/unique. He doesn't seem to chase glory or even the biggest paid jobs. Like, why Leeds? He's odd in that sense.
Click to expand...

Make your point about why nuno isn't good and be done it with it please. Trying to goad people will take time. Just get it over and done with
 
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WeAreTheWolvesII

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Pwolf said:
Make your point about why nuno isn't good and be done it with it please. Trying to goad people will take time. Just get it over and done with
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Weird response.

It's actually sticking up for managers who haven't won anything, like Nuno, saying greatness shouldn't only be judged on trophies.
 
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WeAreTheWolvesII said:
Weird response.
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What's with the nuno is great comment continually? A great for wolves probably yes. But i doubt any wolves fan thinks he's a great to level that saf, Jose, pep are and you are trying to make bielsa is
 
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WeAreTheWolvesII said:
Fair point, but who should be called a great manager? As I say, trophies can't be levelled at him because he should never, ever win them with the team he manages.

What's Nuno? Does Pochettino become a 'great' manager now he will inevitably win trophies with PSG? I think he is for transforming Spurs and taking them to a Champions League final(!). Yet, he won't win anything until now, but he's only winning because he has the best team by a mile in France.

I'm sure he has had offers (there was talk Messi told Barca to appoint him before Koeman), but he is pretty weird/unique. He doesn't seem to chase glory or even the biggest paid jobs. Like, why Leeds? He's odd in that sense.
Click to expand...
It will always be subjective but if you look at the ‘Great ‘ Managers since the year 2000 alone I wonder how many would put him in their top 10 or top 20 for that matter ?
 
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