Things I care about more than eSports:

[YouGottaRaulWithIt]

i was just thinking do profits from the esports and the record label actually show in the wwfc accounts or do they show in fosun accounts ? if we dont get the profit from them then surely we will never become more profitable and its just about brand awareness and will have very little help towards us moving forward

sorry if i am being naive

I had a quick look at our accounts for last year. Our turnover was:

League distribution £141.6m
Broadcasting rights £27.7m
Sponsorship & advertising £15.5m
Commercial £7.8m
Other £1.2m
Gate receipts £144k

Total £194m

Key points, gate receipts were down from £12.7m in 2020; league distribution was up from £72.4m; commercial was down from £10.5m.

It doesn't breakdown any further, but I guess esports could be classed as commercial. BUT, our accounts can only recognise revenue derived from activities in the UK AND I believe esports is Fosun sports not football, so won't show here.

I may be wrong. I am not an accountant. Pleased to hear from anyone who knows more about this.

 

[Wolf in the sun]

I had a quick look at our accounts for last year. Our turnover was:

League distribution £141.6m
Broadcasting rights £27.7m
Sponsorship & advertising £15.5m
Commercial £7.8m
Other £1.2m
Gate receipts £144k

Total £194m

Key points, gate receipts were down from £12.7m in 2020; league distribution was up from £72.4m; commercial was down from £10.5m.

It doesn't breakdown any further, but I guess esports could be classed as commercial. BUT, our accounts can only recognise revenue derived from activities in the UK AND I believe esports is Fosun sports not football, so won't show here.

I may be wrong. I am not an accountant. Pleased to hear from anyone who knows more about this.

ok thank you for having a look in to it...would be good to know

 

[Oldgoldilox]

I have a 15 year old son so I understand to a certain degree how money can be made from e-sports by virtue of the fact that money for "new skins" or "packs" has been leaking out of my account for several years now. I also fully support and understand why the club would go in this direction, Fosun was built on innovation and entrepreneurship and they have developed an incredibly diverse portfolio of businesses to spread risk as all good entrepreneurs should. Shi is following the corporate model as he has no doubt been directed to do.

What I understand far better though is numbers and revenue, and in not having transparency on what the club is making from eSports and/or Wolves Records, makes me sceptical as to their worth to the club. And is it the football club that benefits? Are these subsidiaries to Wolverhampton Wanderers 1986 Ltd or Fosun Sports Group, if the latter how does the club directly benefit financially? And we don't know for sure but I strongly suspect that income from these activities does not currently even match the £4m or so that we eventually lost from dropping from 8th to 10th on the last day of the season. As I say I'm all for exploring these and other potential streams, but they should surely be supplemental not core to the clubs growth plan. Had we kicked on from the point where we were Europa League quarter finalists and invested sensibly in the squad, the income from better league finishes, more European football, decent cup runs, maybe even a trophy by now, would have done far more to raise the profile of the club and it's brand globally and locally.

I don't think its unreasonable to believe that any of the above would have been possible had we addressed the blindingly obvious weaknesses in the squad. Admittedly we did need to invest in wing backs with Doherty moving on and Jonny's injury but it really wasn't the time to blow £34m on a 17 year old kid (Im a big fan of FS too by the way and believe he has genuine potential), when we needed to address the spine of the team. As it is we're in a position two years on where our better players are looking past their best, players in their prime look set to move on to develop their careers elsewhere leaving us with a sizeable rebuilding job. And the club's strategy for growth seems set on music & gaming and developing youth, which again I absolutely applaud but again should at this stage be supplemental to squad development.

Pfft, got a lot off me chest there!

 

[Timberwolf]

For me it is because esports and the brand are terms used by Shi as a deflection from the real issues facing Wolves.

"Don't look at the lack of investment in the team, look at the great work we are doing on the Internet to develop the brand, and esports will generate cash to help finance the club".

It's lies and *******s, perpetuated by our own cheerleaders. When I see players bought and picked because they can generate some clicks on a Korean website then something is wrong.

I want my Football team back.

Which football team is that then, the perennial Championship team or the double dip League one team?

I get you don’t seem to like the club’s commercial direction but your emotive over-reactive “I want my football team back” is just pure hyperbole.
Utter nonsense!

 

[Timberwolf]

Re your first seven words: evidence of that assertion please.

Somebody once mentioned it on Molineux Mix…?!?!

 

[Contrarian]

Didn't football itself start out in a similar way to esports? Just a game where initially, hardly anybody watched, it was for the enjoyment of those taking part. Seems strange to me to dismiss esports as "not proper sport" when spectator sport itself is just entertainment? (though thanks to the Mix, I am realising, as a non-local, that the club does mean something a lot deeper to the locals than it does to us far away casuals, even when we've been supporters for decades).

And I really need to sort my glasses out as I keep reading it as "Jeff is more interested in escorts these days".

 

[Contrarian]

Its all well and good finding different sources of new "fans" but when we serve the type of boring, uninspiring and losing football we've been playing recently, I would say we've probably lost potential new fans as quickly as winning them. The product just hasnt generally been good enough to gain us new fans this and last season I'm afraid.

That is a fair point. Though the boring football in the PL has surely brought us more supporters than the exciting football we played with Kightly/Jarvis etc in getting promotion from the Championship?

Wouldn't be surprised if finishing 17th in the Prem every season, is still a bigger money spinner than running away with the Championship scoring hatfuls, then getting relegated - the "Norwich Model".

Basically, I'm not sure that people care that much about the style of football, as much as it's "winning" football.

 

[Bill S Preston Esq.]

Not sure they're into escorts just yet but it might please a few if they were!

Personally I think if Fosun sold Wolves, they'd want to retain that emblem. Also think they'd keep the other ventures that are under it

Said it a while back that we could be in a very strange situation where in essence, the badge we own, ends up owning us

Can't see this. The New Orleans Saints once tried to copyright "Who Dat?" - A chant created by fans that the Saints started putting on merchandise. They wanted to stop unaffiliated entities from putting it on unofficial merchandise, they failed.

Our logo(s) would remain the property of the football club, should it ever go to court imho.

 

[Adrian_Monk]

Things I care less about:
The Khardhashians (sp?)
Emmerdale.
Wasps potentially becoming extinct

 

[Eastyorksyeltz]

Things I care less about:
The Khardhashians (sp?)
Emmerdale.
Wasps potentially becoming extinct

The rugby team or the insects?

 

[WickedWolfie]

Can't see this. The New Orleans Saints once tried to copyright "Who Dat?" - A chant created by fans that the Saints started putting on merchandise. They wanted to stop unaffiliated entities from putting it on unofficial merchandise, they failed.

Our logo(s) would remain the property of the football club, should it ever go to court imho.

Re your last para l agree subject to the rather significant caveat that the rights aren't legally transferred for a suitable consideration.

You could seek to argue that was (legal) asset stripping. Not sure how far that you'd get.

 

[Abbobrom]

Please excuse my ignorance, but could someone explain to me what eSports are?

 

[Adrian_Monk]

The rugby team or the insects?

Both

 

[YouGottaRaulWithIt]

Which football team is that then, the perennial Championship team or the double dip League one team?

I get you don’t seem to like the club’s commercial direction but your emotive over-reactive “I want my football team back” is just pure hyperbole.
Utter nonsense!

I am sorry. My irrational outburst should have been accompanied by a 'stamp foot' emoji.

The reason I had such a strop was because I was angry that all the talk was about games and music and fashion and nothing about strengthening a team that has been playing badly for a while now.

I don't mind that he wants to diversify into other things, but it was being sold to us that it would generate significant revenue to help the club close the gap on the big 6. It won't.

We get the majority of turnover from broadcasting and gate receipts. I don't think these ventures will make much money, but even if they do, it won't come back to the club, because they are separate companies.

If we go down it will be because we are selling our best players and replacing them with ones that are just not good enough.

Anyway, I made my point. You don't agree. Fair enough. Neither of us can do anything about it.

 

[Ian C]

I've got to admit, I don't know what it is and I'm happy to remain ignorant to the fact.

 

[Beer Wolf]

West Brom

 

[itsmee]

Cheese (or the holes in some types of cheese)

 

[Hot Fuss]

I had a quick look at our accounts for last year. Our turnover was:

League distribution £141.6m
Broadcasting rights £27.7m
Sponsorship & advertising £15.5m
Commercial £7.8m
Other £1.2m
Gate receipts £144k

Total £194m

Key points, gate receipts were down from £12.7m in 2020; league distribution was up from £72.4m; commercial was down from £10.5m.

It doesn't breakdown any further, but I guess esports could be classed as commercial. BUT, our accounts can only recognise revenue derived from activities in the UK AND I believe esports is Fosun sports not football, so won't show here.

I may be wrong. I am not an accountant. Pleased to hear from anyone who knows more about this.

So esports revenue wouldn’t help Wolverhampton Wanderers football Club with FFP?

 

[VancouverWolf]

So esports revenue wouldn’t help Wolverhampton Wanderers football Club with FFP?

If I understand it correctly, it would help with FFP rules……but when are the esports, our clothing line and the music ever going to make enough money to make a significant difference? 2 years?…5 years?…….longer?

Does anybody have any info on this, please?

 

[cannockwolves]

I have not read every post so don't know if many have put the positive side to e-sports. Personally, I know stuff all about it. But with a gaming market of $218bn someone is going to make some serious wedge - I hope that is Fosun.

Here is a newly published Ted talk on e-sports, which gives a bit more perspective. I can understand why Fosun are investing in it.

 

[Mark Rankines Lovechild]

Reading some of the above posts from people who better understand esports, it seems that we are currently way down in the pecking order and the hierarchy is already established. In footballing terms we have entered in the conference, has small support currently, and we are hoping to progress to the Prem to make serious money.

If it is indeed possible it sounds like a project that will take years before they are successful or we are interesting enough for someone to wanting to sponsor us / give advertising deals to?

 

[Deleted member 8455jwf]

Which football team is that then, the perennial Championship team or the double dip League one team?

I get you don’t seem to like the club’s commercial direction but your emotive over-reactive “I want my football team back” is just pure hyperbole.
Utter nonsense!

He's just desperate to jump on the populist bandwagon that yearns for the past.

Just wants people running the club who understand the fans, like we had back in the good old days with *checks notes* Jez Moxey