Talisca

[Wolf in Liverpool]

The work permit (hopefully)

But surely the FA don't issue work permits.

 

[goldeneyed]

Apart from the size of the fee which seems to be grossly inflated what worries me about this Talisca business is that any stay with us for a season would, according to some reports, be just a stepping stone to a bigger club. I don't care how good he is or isn't, if that is the real story he is not going to be viewed with much favour by fans and the general impression that the club is being mainly used to mature Benefica's /Mendes's young talents for the market or for simply a return to Benefica itself sits very uncomfortably with me, to put it mildly. The club should be very careful on this. If they are mainly working on the basis of bringing in short term mercenaries on season long loans I cannot see how this can build into the formation of a long term successful team. One or two loans fine but we need some long term signings like Bodvarsson who actually sound like they want to build a career with Wolves not use Wolves conveniently for a year in order to get a move to a bigger club. All this could backfire badly imv even if these mercenaries offer better skills on the field in the short term.

 

[Deleted member 3518]

Apart from the size of the fee which seems to be grossly inflated what worries me about this Talisca business is that any stay with us for a season would, according to some reports, be just a stepping stone to a bigger club. I don't care how good he is or isn't, if that is the real story he is not going to be viewed with much favour by fans and the general impression that the club is being mainly used to mature Benefica's /Mendes's young talents for the market or for simply a return to Benefica itself sits very uncomfortably with me, to put it mildly. The club should be very careful on this. If they are mainly working on the basis of bringing in short term mercenaries on season long loans I cannot see how this can build into the formation of a long term successful team. One or two loans fine but we need some long term signings like Bodvarsson who actually sound like they want to build a career with Wolves not use Wolves conveniently for a year in order to get a move to a bigger club. All this could backfire badly imv even if these mercenaries offer better skills on the field in the short term.

This in Edgy's spades!!

 

[rincewind]

While I understand the worry about being used as a stepping stone it's being overblown I feel. Does anyone think that say Bodvarson would give it a second thought if a premiership club came in for him (if we don't get promoted)? All young players will see Wolves or for that matter West Brom or Swansea or Stoke as a stepping stone to the top clubs.

 

[Oldgold Wolfcub]

I am the new Heron
I am the new Heron

Alright keep your heron.

 

[Ponty]

Apart from the size of the fee which seems to be grossly inflated what worries me about this Talisca business is that any stay with us for a season would, according to some reports, be just a stepping stone to a bigger club. I don't care how good he is or isn't, if that is the real story he is not going to be viewed with much favour by fans and the general impression that the club is being mainly used to mature Benefica's /Mendes's young talents for the market or for simply a return to Benefica itself sits very uncomfortably with me, to put it mildly. The club should be very careful on this. If they are mainly working on the basis of bringing in short term mercenaries on season long loans I cannot see how this can build into the formation of a long term successful team. One or two loans fine but we need some long term signings like Bodvarsson who actually sound like they want to build a career with Wolves not use Wolves conveniently for a year in order to get a move to a bigger club. All this could backfire badly imv even if these mercenaries offer better skills on the field in the short term.

I doubt it would be announced up front that he’s only coming for a year so the fans would have no idea. We all knew Sako was likely to go but that didn’t stop the fans loving him right up to his final game. He won’t get a move if he doesn’t perform so really don’t see it as a problem, and if he moves we should make profit. Any player doing well looks to move onwards and upwards, even Ronaldo left Man Utd, it’s the way things work.

 

[we8wba]

Jesus wept some of you need to get real

There's virtually no loyalty in football anymore

Did anyone moan afobe signed as only stayed season with us?

If talisca is real deal enjoy the ride the moments the good times and he goes leaving us many memories

If he isn't as good expected still moves we'll be relieved

If crap then so be it

Just enjoy the moment, I for one can't wait to see him in action hopes lives to hype and fires us up

 

[Deleted member 4008]

If he uses it as a stepping stone to me then more than likely he will be playing well and near the play offs at least.

 

[OLDGOLD]

We could sign him for five years and he could do what is known in the trade as a Johnson, or potentially an O'Hara.
If he comes and is great, superb. But.....I would still rather four five million players than one 20 million one.

 

[Edgmond Wolf]

Alright keep your heron.

Very clever

 

[Adrian_Monk]

Jesus wept some of you need to get real

There's virtually no loyalty in football anymore

Did anyone moan afobe signed as only stayed season with us?

If talisca is real deal enjoy the ride the moments the good times and he goes leaving us many memories

If he isn't as good expected still moves we'll be relieved

If crap then so be it

Just enjoy the moment, I for one can't wait to see him in action hopes lives to hype and fires us up

Couldn't agree more. Nobody is here to make Wolves great again, let's just enjoy the moment.

 

[Starsky]

Rather have good players using us a stepping stone than dire plodders sticking around as nobody else wants them.

The squad is jam packed with the latter!

 

[Neves wolf]

Agent Dave on Twitter now saying he'll sign for Liverpool and be loaned to us

https://twitter.com/agentdave_/status/763339342223908864

Tbh I can see this happening. I really can't see with ffp rules how we can afford to spend €25 million on 1 player.

 

[rincewind]

Tbh I can see this happening. I really can't see with ffp rules how we can afford to spend €25 million on 1 player.

Think it's going over old ground but Liverpool would almost certainly not get a work permit whilst we almost certainly would.
As for FFP it's over a 3 year rolling period not instantaneous and the fee will most certainly not be £25million unless all the add ons kick in (which would be fantastic for Wolves). As a final note on FFP, new owners can exceed the limit for a time as long as they have a clear business plan to return within the limits in a reasonable timescale (not sure how much leeway you get though).

 

[maws]

I love Port thanks Portugal

Oh no he may use us as a stepping stone fulfilling his potential! Let's sign another James Henry eh! Had potential now just got no speed or crossing ability!

 

[NOKASPLACE]

I am interested if this goes through what our next steps will be?
Surely we are not going to pitch a 25 M euro player in with free transfers

I really think that Jeff and Mendez have got bodies in quickly.. Hence the Benfica B team players, and now they will add quality..... I really think that should Talisca sign then the next 2 to 3 players will all be at least 5M..... Probably around 10....

The more i think about it, the more it makes sense and aligns with Jeffs opening conference comments.... "Investment is not a problem" "potential for growth at wolves is huge"

So do you buy a premier club with not much scope for improvement like the baggies for £150M
A championship club like villa for £70M
Or Wolves for 30M ... Spend 40 to 50M to get in the premier and build from there.....


Time will tell, i could be way off..... But maybe i am not....

 

[Jonzy54]

I hope all our eggs aren't in one basket .We need several players and quickly

 

[Dans la Lune]

Over the life of the Premier League the balance of power has switched from the clubs to the players.

The fact is, that any player not entirely satisfied with his position at a club can simply disregard the conditions of his contract and engineer a move.

Generaly, clubs don't have the appetite to resist by holding them to their obligations because they risk destabilising the rest of their squad. Football is an insetuous business, beyond a few high status teams, if a club were to flex its muscles and demand contract loyalty, it would risk alienating players and agents and make the club less attractive to future signings. Most players who can attract outside interest as a result of improving performance are valuable assets, but once they start agitating for a move the clubs become complicit in cutting their losses or maximising their profits.

What this new type of transfer activity, the extended loan or short term deal offers is a degree of transparency. A player is somewhat obligated to try his best so that he can become an attractive proposition for a "bigger" club and everyone knows where they stand. Its no different to signing a player on a three or four year deal only for him to move on after a season when the big boys come sniffing around. Only now, you insert safeguards such as sell on clauses, performance related bonuses, first refusal rights and relegation (or failed promotion) releases in exchange for a lower transfer fee therefore effectively renting a player that you previously couldn't entertain signing.

As a struggling provincial club the only way that we were able to secure so-called big names like O'hara and Johnson was to commit to expensive long term deals that worked wholly in favour of the player, we couldn't offer the promise of a top six finish and Wolverhampton isn't exactly a thriving cosmopolitan metropolitan centre, so we has to sweeten the deal. This came back to haunt us when the club suffered relegation.

Were in a different position now, we appear to have the wealth to insure ourselves against poor performance, however; we have not yet attained the status required to attract top level players without having to offer potential recruits an escape route. Many of the provincial teams struggle in the same way, if you can't offer the bright lights of the capital, or the perceived glamour of the Manchester/Liverpool teams you have to cut your cloth accordingly.

 

[Gornal]

Think it's going over old ground but Liverpool would almost certainly not get a work permit whilst we almost certainly would.
As for FFP it's over a 3 year rolling period not instantaneous and the fee will most certainly not be £25million unless all the add ons kick in (which would be fantastic for Wolves). As a final note on FFP, new owners can exceed the limit for a time as long as they have a clear business plan to return within the limits in a reasonable timescale (not sure how much leeway you get though).

Your old ground is rubbish though. Work permit rules for Wolves are exactly the same as for Liverpool. It is a permit to work in this country not a permit to work in Wolverhampton. So if he can get a permit for Wolves he would be able to get one for Liverpool. If a player doesn't qualify automatically on international appearances the points to qualify are based on Premiership transfer fees and wages for everybody.

 

[k-dog]

Jesus wept some of you need to get real

There's virtually no loyalty in football anymore

Did anyone moan afobe signed as only stayed season with us?

If talisca is real deal enjoy the ride the moments the good times and he goes leaving us many memories

If he isn't as good expected still moves we'll be relieved

If crap then so be it

Just enjoy the moment, I for one can't wait to see him in action hopes lives to hype and fires us up

Get real? You were telling everyone they were deluded to think he was even going to sign for us

 

[Supadavewolf]

2500 posts on Talisca. Wow!

 

[Henry Palfrey]

Has anyone tested the swear filter yet because this is ****ing massive!

 

[kwolf]

as he signed yet

 

[Fifty Niner]

I'd rather have a season of Talisca. It will put an end to the longing for Sako to come home to mamma

 

[oldgoldheart]

re FFP, the transfer fee doesnt make that much difference on its own. we just cant lose more than £39m over 3 years (after all income and costs are taken into account). Transfer fees arent necessarily expensed like wages. His signing could increase season tickets and shirt sales and boost revenue. It could also help us go up if we sign a few more good players. If we go up he may not leave for Liverpool. If we stay where we are he would probably leave.So will the loan guys we have just taken on. Personally I dont think we should worry too much. I just hope that we buy/loan 4-5 other quality players to give us a chance. I fear that the next two home games will show WZ and Jeff Shi what a mountain we have to climb. Hope I am wrong and I hope Talisca does come. It still feels a bit unlikely but Wolves have changed so who knows

 

[Perton Wolf]

Your old ground is rubbish though. Work permit rules for Wolves are exactly the same as for Liverpool. It is a permit to work in this country not a permit to work in Wolverhampton. So if he can get a permit for Wolves he would be able to get one for Liverpool. If a player doesn't qualify automatically on international appearances the points to qualify are based on Premiership transfer fees and wages for everybody.

Some points are given for being the highest earner at a club for example which can obviously vary from club to club, so your argument isn't as straightforward as you make out.

 

[Sedgley Gold N Black]

But surely the FA don't issue work permits.

I'd guess they give the club permission to be able register him as a player which in turn will allow the club to employ him and get the work permit?

 

[rincewind]

Your old ground is rubbish though. Work permit rules for Wolves are exactly the same as for Liverpool. It is a permit to work in this country not a permit to work in Wolverhampton. So if he can get a permit for Wolves he would be able to get one for Liverpool. If a player doesn't qualify automatically on international appearances the points to qualify are based on Premiership transfer fees and wages for everybody.

It's not though. The permit is awarded on a points system based on the players transfer fee relative to others in that league and wages relative to others at the club plus the status of the selling club relative to the purchaser.
Talisca would not be a top transfer in the premiership nor a big earner at Liverpool as he would be here. He will easily qualify for us but has very little, if any chance at Liverpool.

 

[Plastic Shrapnel]

People already assuming he may go the way of O'Hara, just bear in mind he could also the way of Afobe or Sako. Or non Wolves related Mahrez.

 

[Baboon]

2500 posts on Talisca. Wow!

This thread has become something of an old friend and I'll really miss it when one way or another the saga has been concluded. Checking each morning to make sure nothing has happened has now become part of my early routine like brushing my teeth and watching breakfast telly.

 

[Edgmond Wolf]

Has anyone tested the swear filter yet because this is ****ing massive!

Yep and ****** got through on one thread

 

[Wolf in Liverpool]

It's not though. The permit is awarded on a points system based on the players transfer fee relative to others in that league and wages relative to others at the club plus the status of the selling club relative to the purchaser.
Talisca would not be a top transfer in the premiership nor a big earner at Liverpool as he would be here. He will easily qualify for us but has very little, if any chance at Liverpool.

Not quite true. The points based on the transfer fee is taken relative to the Premier League in order to stop clubs trying to flout the system and also to prevent under qualified players just plying their trade in the lower divisions.

 

[we8wba]

I've got be honest I didn't think he would sign until late last week when more apperent concrete info came in regarding deal

Rather be wrong than right

No doubt you was one wanted everyone apologise

 

[Wolf in Liverpool]

I'd guess they give the club permission to be able register him as a player which in turn will allow the club to employ him and get the work permit?

I would have thought that the club has to get a work permit from the authorities before the FA will register players. Surely you can't have registered players without the required permits?

 

[Rangiora Wolf]

I hope all our eggs aren't in one basket .We need several players and quickly

I couldnt agree more. Doesnt seem to be much else happening that we know of

 

[Tony]

Big money signing if it comes off but the 38 year old would sell more tickets imo! Sign them both to solve the dilemma of ticket sales or promotion!

 

[wildfire_wolf]

Has anyone tested the swear filter yet because this is ****ing massive!

**** knows!

 

[Tony]

*******s

 

[waggys left foot]

How can he possibly come here for €25million and be guaranteed a move elsewhere after a year -what club in their right mind would accept such a deal .

I could understand selling him to pool and him being loaned to us .

Very fishy stuff and all far far too public .

 

[Gornal]

It's not though. The permit is awarded on a points system based on the players transfer fee relative to others in that league and wages relative to others at the club plus the status of the selling club relative to the purchaser.
Talisca would not be a top transfer in the premiership nor a big earner at Liverpool as h would be here. He will easily qualify for us but has very little, if any chance at Liverpool.

I'm afraid you are wrong. The points are judged against premier league transfer fees and premier league salaries no matter what league he is going to play in. The whole point of the system is to stop sub standard foreign players being signed by lower league clubs.

To make it clearer lets assume the person applying for a work permit is a professional baked bean counter and Heinz apply for a work permit for him. The government decide he isn't a good enough baked bean counter so refuse the permit. Cross & Blackwell hear about this and because they are happy to employ baked bean counters who are less good at counting they apply for a work permit for him. But because he doesn't meet the countries criteria for baked bean counting he still won't get a work permit.