Players surrounding the ref

[Eastyorksyeltz]

I suspect that the football authorities know, after Bosman, that any attempt to do that would almost certainly face litigation.

Well no litigation has resulted from it in Rugby and the Union code is well represented by m'lud and his greedy legal pals, both on and off the pitch. It also doesn't seem to inhibit the many challengeable restrictions of trade that are stlll present in the football transfer system after Bosman.

 

[WickedWolfie]

Well no litigation has resulted from it in Rugby and the Union code is well represented by m'lud and his greedy legal pals, both on and off the pitch. It also doesn't seem to inhibit the many challengeable restrictions of trade that are stlll present in the football transfer system after Bosman.

The amount of money involved in football is orders of magnitude different and US, in particular, owners are all too willing to litigate.

 

[Eastyorksyeltz]

The amount of money involved in football is orders of magnitude different and US, in particular, owners are all too willing to litigate.

Sorry don't agree and can't think of any examples of litigation, or threats of it, around the rules of the game, or enforcement of them on the pitch, as opposed to any governance surrounding commercial operations and transactions between players, clubs and associations. If we are to be so cautious, you could argue that every rule and every act of play, or decision of an official, puts us in danger of litigation, so best not play at.

 

[WickedWolfie]

Sorry don't agree and can't think of any examples of litigation, or threats of it, around the rules of the game, or enforcement of them on the pitch, as opposed to any governance surrounding commercial operations and transactions between players, clubs and associations. If we are to be so cautious, you could argue that every rule and every act of play, or decision of an official, puts us in danger of litigation, so best not play at.

Given how speculative both of our comments are l'm not sure that we can go much further. You could well be right but we will doubtless see in due course.

 

[Wolves in Limerick]

Edit- my response does relate to League, I don't have the same familiarity with Union, but assume it's similar, though probably less straightforward.

We are talking at cross purposes then. My familiarity is with rugby union, though from what I see of rugby league it is a far more dynamic and exciting game. I really can't comment on the refereeing of the game and have been careful to state throughout that I was talking of rugby union.

 

[clivewolves]

What's it like in youth football? Eight to fifteen years olds, that sort of range. I don't have any reason to watch it so I don't know how kids act towards referees. I would like to think coaches and parents tell them to respect the ref. If they do act with respect, when does that change? Is it when they become professionals? I was just wondering.

 

[Frank Lincoln]

What's it like in youth football? Eight to fifteen years olds, that sort of range. I don't have any reason to watch it so I don't know how kids act towards referees. I would like to think coaches and parents tell them to respect the ref. If they do act with respect, when does that change? Is it when they become professionals? I was just wondering.

As with everything else in football, the youngsters replicate what they see their heroes do on match of the day. Nowadays in grassroots and youth football players dive and try to con the referee. And recently, surrounding the referee has crept into youth football.

Do the professionals realise that youngsters watch how they behave on a football and think it is alright for them to do the same thing.

 

[bigwolf]

Neves is awful for it. And has got a lot worse since be became captain.

 

[hankin]

What's it like in youth football? Eight to fifteen years olds, that sort of range. I don't have any reason to watch it so I don't know how kids act towards referees. I would like to think coaches and parents tell them to respect the ref. If they do act with respect, when does that change? Is it when they become professionals? I was just wondering.

I have a mate who referees at academy level - U16- U18 matches. He told me that players are as good as gold and are mainly taught by their clubs to respect referees and they do. I can't speak about what behaviour is like at U23 level but it all goes wrong once they get to the first team. The Arsenal match the other night was a disgrace by both teams and I suspect that Arteta and Howes demand this pressurising of refs.

 

[WalsallWolf]

Only read the first few posts of this thread but agree and Arsenal have always, always been utter ****ers with this kind of stuff. They were like it in the mid 90s under Wenger and it has stained them since.

Unfortunately, our lot also have the tendency. Ruben as much as I love him leads the charge.

 

[Frank Lincoln]

I have a mate who referees at academy level - U16- U18 matches. He told me that players are as good as gold and are mainly taught by their clubs to respect referees and they do. I can't speak about what behaviour is like at U23 level but it all goes wrong once they get to the first team. The Arsenal match the other night was a disgrace by both teams and I suspect that Arteta and Howes demand this pressurising of refs.

At academy level I agree that there is no problem. As I highlighted in my recent reply, it is at grassroots level where the behavior of professionals is copied.

 

[Leominster_Wolf]

The problem is its too far gone to do anyting about it.

Last week I watched the Blackburn/Boro Game - mainly to see how Giles played. It was on Ifollow via IPTV, and not familiar with it, but appears that it was a 'home' commentator and they also had a Blackburn Player (who was obviously out injured) as co-comm - not sure who it was I didnt catch his name.

First half they praised the Ref and the player said you get good and bad, the good ones are the ones you can talk to and communicate with the the players. But he went on to say there are some who just want it to be about 'them' to be the star. He also went as far to say that there is one Ref, who he didnt name, but who he has no idea how he got to be a ref or carry on doing it as he is clueless.

Then in second half, Blackburn had a player sent off (very oddly for bouncing the ball off a Boro players head). ref didnt see it, but acted on 4th officials advice.

Cue commentator and said player slagging the ref off, pretty much non stop for the rest of the match - and the player was the worst of the two. Every Free kick given against blackburn was wrong, the Ref was Clueless......

Towards the end Blackburn were pushing for an equailser and Boro player fouled. Ref wanted to book him, and stopped a quick free kick being taken - Comms were getting angrier and angrier - look at him now.... making it all about him again, making the player come to him.

It was Awful, and if that is how the player behaves off pitch whilst being broadcast, then what is he like on it?

 

[Rauls Headband]

The problem is its too far gone to do anyting about it.

I'm not sure it has, I think its more about the relevant footballing authorities needing the will (or being pushed) to do something about it.

Some have said, transparency of communication is key, and that cuts all ways and its very telling when you see players covering their mouths when speaking to referees (Kane is one of the worst for this).

But some simple changes to the rules of the game, and then active enforcement, could stop it all in a couple of weeks.

 

[Rabid Wolf]

Looks like Arsenal is being charged by the FA for failing to control their players against Newcastle.

 

[Fifty Niner]

Neves is awful for it. And has got a lot worse since be became captain.

I guess as captain he has a bit more leeway, as they do in rugby, but I deplore the mob mentality of bullying the referees.

Been nearly 10 years ago now but I still well remember Dylan Hartley getting sent off for swearing at referee Wayne Barnes in the rugby Premiership final. Barnes came over to the touchline and, if I remember correctly, told the coach that no-one calls him a f*** cheat and stays on the pitch. At the time I wished football referees would take a similar hard line with players, either dishing out yellows or reds. It would be carnage for a few months but eventually players and managers would get the message! I still hold to those views.

 

[TheConcourse]

Only read the first few posts of this thread but agree and Arsenal have always, always been utter ****ers with this kind of stuff. They were like it in the mid 90s under Wenger and it has stained them since.

Unfortunately, our lot also have the tendency. Ruben as much as I love him leads the charge.

Ruben is a genius, but his tantrums on the pitch are painful to watch. Must just annoy refs tbh.

Constantly running up to them with his head in his hands and his mouth wide open which gives off the suggestion that they’re utterly stupid.

Trippier did a decent job the other night, pushed all of his players away and spoke calmly.

 

[Southdownswolf]

I guess as captain he has a bit more leeway, as they do in rugby, but I deplore the mob mentality of bullying the referees.

Been nearly 10 years ago now but I still well remember Dylan Hartley getting sent off for swearing at referee Wayne Barnes in the rugby Premiership final. Barnes came over to the touchline and, if I remember correctly, told the coach that no-one calls him a f*** cheat and stays on the pitch. At the time I wished football referees would take a similar hard line with players, either dishing out yellows or reds. It would be carnage for a few months but eventually players and managers would get the message! I still hold to those views.

Couldn't agree more.
Clamp down on it, for a few weeks it would be mayhem. However, the players would either get the message or spend a lot of time suspended.

 

[chignalwolf]

I'd love to see the 4 officials run up to a player who they think had made a mistake and surround him having a go,
imaging David de Gea tonight or Conor Coady after his own goal, thats a lot of toys to throw out the pram, LOL

 

[Frank Lincoln]

Looks like Arsenal is being charged by the FA for failing to control their players against Newcastle.

That’s good, but the manager should also be charged for his ridiculous behaviour.

 

[stever]

That’s good, but the manager should also be charged for his ridiculous behaviour.

Good. But if they don't start pulling rank on the players and booking them then the next thing is points deduction.

Football at the highest level in this country isnt the entertainment it was. Cheating, time wasting, feigning injuries, subs running on the pitch. The authorities just need to show some guts and start coming down on people.

 

[JadeWolf]

It comes from the top. If the Arsenal players see Arteta having a tantrum and throwing his dummy in the dirt on the touchline, are they going to be nice and calm when talking to the referee, or follow his lead and start ranting and screeching.

Managers need touchline bans for bad behaviour and poor conduct. Then you can start addressing the players.

 

[Beeches wolf]

That’s good, but the manager should also be charged for his ridiculous behaviour.

He made himself look stupid running down the touchline like a windmill.