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Lage and goal prediction

Ned

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I think all of our forward players are guilty of overplaying and picking the wrong option. We would benefit from them simplifying things imo.
They need somebody to play off in order to do that, though. They’re overplaying at times because there isn’t always an easy, forward pass. I’d rather them lose the ball in the final third by trying to create something than the ball somehow finding it’s way along the back line when we were in a good position .
 

DDPPwolf313

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He's had all pre season to conjure up some kind of shape, style of play, method of working the ball quickly around the pitch. ****ing useless. I thought I would sleep on yesterday's performance and wake up with a more optimistic outlook. Not happening, the sooner he's sacked the better, simply not good enough.

Zero tempo, zero composure, zero game plan, zero entertainment. I simply can't see Bruno turning this around.

Fulham were absolutely dog **** yesterday, they offered nothing, played for a draw, and still nearly beat us. Sticking my neck out and will predict he will be sacked by November
 

Premier Quality

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We’re badly missing a striker to play off - but once we have one, Neto, MGW and Guedes have scored goals in the past and will score goals this season.

Traore and Podence have never scored goals anywhere and won’t this season either.
 

Corporate Wolf

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He's had all pre season to conjure up some kind of shape, style of play, method of working the ball quickly around the pitch. ****ing useless. I thought I would sleep on yesterday's performance and wake up with a more optimistic outlook. Not happening, the sooner he's sacked the better, simply not good enough.

Zero tempo, zero composure, zero game plan, zero entertainment. I simply can't see Bruno turning this around.

Fulham were absolutely dog **** yesterday, they offered nothing, played for a draw, and still nearly beat us. Sticking my neck out and will predict he will be sacked by November
Harsh but I think you’re right.

Like yourself, I slept on it and still am struggling to see any real positives. For me the game was summed up by Guedes’ outside of the foot ”pass” ….. to the Fulham goalkeeper and their fans then singing “what a waste of money”.
 

lets all have a disco

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He's had all pre season to conjure up some kind of shape, style of play, method of working the ball quickly around the pitch. ****ing useless. I thought I would sleep on yesterday's performance and wake up with a more optimistic outlook. Not happening, the sooner he's sacked the better, simply not good enough.

Zero tempo, zero composure, zero game plan, zero entertainment. I simply can't see Bruno turning this around.

Fulham were absolutely dog **** yesterday, they offered nothing, played for a draw, and still nearly beat us. Sticking my neck out and will predict he will be sacked by November
Not disagreeing entirely about Bruno ...but how can any manager spend all summer planning shape, and style of play etc and then only two injuries to moutinho and Raul results in all of your plans going out the window.....not having a striker option and only 2 midfielders, when you want to play 3....isn't the fault of the manager . There is more at play than just Bruno.....
 

DDPPwolf313

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Harsh but I think you’re right.

Like yourself, I slept on it and still am struggling to see any real positives. For me the game was summed up by Guedes’ outside of the foot ”pass” ….. to the Fulham goalkeeper and their fans then singing “what a waste of money”.
Decision making all over the pitch was awful wasn't it. Makes me think the players have no confidence in what they are doing.
 

Chisels_n_ommers

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We seem a bit "c'est la vie" when we miss chances.

Bully used to be ready to impale himself on the corner flag if he missed a chance.

They should implement a cattle prod in training and when they do the attacking drills, anyone who misses gets tasered. That would focus the mind.

In all seriousness though, they should say, (forwards) right whoever scores the most chances in training plays the next game. Whoever scores the least has to clean Jeff's car or something like that.
 

thommo1984

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Not disagreeing entirely about Bruno ...but how can any manager spend all summer planning shape, and style of play etc and then only two injuries to moutinho and Raul results in all of your plans going out the window.....not having a striker option and only 2 midfielders, when you want to play 3....isn't the fault of the manager . There is more at play than just Bruno.....
Two things can be true at the same time though. The squad isn’t good enough, Bruno isn’t good enough.
 

DDPPwolf313

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Not disagreeing entirely about Bruno ...but how can any manager spend all summer planning shape, and style of play etc and then only two injuries to moutinho and Raul results in all of your plans going out the window.....not having a striker option and only 2 midfielders, when you want to play 3....isn't the fault of the manager . There is more at play than just Bruno.....
It's not just the summer, he's had all last year.

We have the players IMO, they just aren't performing for Bruno, I'm sure there are several reasons why, but they just aren't.

I can't express just how poor Fulham were, the spaces they left wide open, how slow they were, and we have no idea how to exploit their weaknesses. Neto went through twice in 10 minutes and after that we just stopped putting the ball over the top and wide to him, favouring balls into the feet of MGW or Neves. So frustrating.
 

lets all have a disco

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It's not just the summer, he's had all last year.

We have the players IMO, they just aren't performing for Bruno, I'm sure there are several reasons why, but they just aren't.

I can't express just how poor Fulham were, the spaces they left wide open, how slow they were, and we have no idea how to exploit their weaknesses. Neto went through twice in 10 minutes and after that we just stopped putting the ball over the top and wide to him, favouring balls into the feet of MGW or Neves. So frustrating.
I'm not saying I don't disagree ......just saying the problems aren't just Bruno, just like problems weren't just Nuno ......we've needed a new midfielder and particularly a back up striker for 2 or 3 seasons.....the lack of presence in the box is frightening........ Fabio Silva didn't change this.....we need a box operator.... .we need Andre Silva desperately.....
 
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He's had all pre season to conjure up some kind of shape, style of play, method of working the ball quickly around the pitch. ****ing useless. I thought I would sleep on yesterday's performance and wake up with a more optimistic outlook. Not happening, the sooner he's sacked the better, simply not good enough.

Zero tempo, zero composure, zero game plan, zero entertainment. I simply can't see Bruno turning this around.

Fulham were absolutely dog **** yesterday, they offered nothing, played for a draw, and still nearly beat us. Sticking my neck out and will predict he will be sacked by November
Totally agree - hope you’re right about November (if not before), he’s had enough time now he really needs to go.
 

lets all have a disco

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And the rest, all underperforming. Neto, Nouri, MGW, etc etc.

We bring in a Raul'esque striker and a CM, I don't have any faith at all we will be any better. And that's why he will be sacked IMO
Any of the managers outside a few could be sacked at any given time, it's the nature of the league I'm afraid. .Graham potter team went 3 months without scoring at home last season and drew a blank yesterday....Gerrard was toast last week, Ralph at Southampton is toast most weeks, lampard, etc etc ..

Getting rid of Bruno today wouldn't change our problems over night......but as I said I'm not disagreeing he might not be up to it .....but so would the next one coming if we don't address our issues ..
 

Bill McCai

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We're on a shocking run.

We have not won a PL game since Villa at home on April 2nd. One win in our last ten matches.

Since Feb 27th we've played 14 PL games (12 last season, 2 this season), we've won 2, drew 3 and lost 9 (PPG 0.6 - this works out at 23 points over the course of a 38 game season). We've scored 11 goals in that time and conceded 25.

Now I'm sure people will say 'you cannot combine seasons' or 'why did you not start the data earlier and include the win v Leicester*' - but do you think we are going to turn this around? I'm sure we will also get onto recruitment - but even then - does a manager usually survive this kind of run?

*we actually won 5 in 6 from Jan 3rd - Feb 20th but that form now seems totally beyond us based on the 14 games since.
 

The Wolf In The North

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Lage deserves credit for a number of things, not least overseeing a challenge for the top six until it all fell apart in February, and for having the courage to do what many were advocating this summer, deposing Coady and moving to a back four. And he hasn't been backed in the areas that matter.

The damning flipside, however, is that he really can't seem to formulate ideas to change a game while it's in progress, and his reputation is that of a deep thinker and planner who studies the opposition. I don't know the exact stat that has been floating around since he's been in charge, the one about how many times we've got back into a game when conceding, or turning tight draws into wins, but I'm pretty sure it boils down to "hardly ever". And he has to take some responsibility for that, not just the players.

Traore yesterday was a prime example. We all know his qualities and limitations, he came on with 20 minutes or so to play, but I can't remember a single pass coming to him. So what was the point, and who is at fault? Because either there was no gameplan to get the ball to him, which is on Lage, or there was a plan but the players ignored it, which doesn't speak well of them or on Lage's influence.

I'd like to see how well he does backed with players who can put his plans into motion but EVERY manager wishes they had different/better/more players, and their remit is to make the best of who they have in the meantime. I'm really not convinced Lage does that.

The point stands though, if players had taken just one of their few chances yesterday, we win, and it's a different story. So Lage is unlucky, but by the same token, as someone has already said, you can only be an unlucky manager for so long before you become an ex one.
 

lets all have a disco

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Podence and hwang up top would test the management of klopp and pep.....

That's before we start on Gibbs donk and Jonny.....
 

Adrian_Monk

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Lage deserves credit for a number of things, not least overseeing a challenge for the top six until it all fell apart in February, and for having the courage to do what many were advocating this summer, deposing Coady and moving to a back four. And he hasn't been backed in the areas that matter.

The damning flipside, however, is that he really can't seem to formulate ideas to change a game while it's in progress, and his reputation is that of a deep thinker and planner who studies the opposition. I don't know the exact stat that has been floating around since he's been in charge, the one about how many times we've got back into a game when conceding, or turning tight draws into wins, but I'm pretty sure it boils down to "hardly ever". And he has to take some responsibility for that, not just the players.

Traore yesterday was a prime example. We all know his qualities and limitations, he came on with 20 minutes or so to play, but I can't remember a single pass coming to him. So what was the point, and who is at fault? Because either there was no gameplan to get the ball to him, which is on Lage, or there was a plan but the players ignored it, which doesn't speak well of them or on Lage's influence.

I'd like to see how well he does backed with players who can put his plans into motion but EVERY manager wishes they had different/better/more players, and their remit is to make the best of who they have in the meantime. I'm really not convinced Lage does that.

The point stands though, if players had taken just one of their few chances yesterday, we win, and it's a different story. So Lage is unlucky, but by the same token, as someone has already said, you can only be an unlucky manager for so long before you become an ex one.
Agree with pretty much all of this other than Lage being unlucky playing a major part - had Mitrovic been a yard higher we'd have lost that game
 

OsloWolf

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But I don't think any manager would be good enough with our squad. ......no manager can operate without a striker or a midfield....
I think most managers in the PL would get way better results out of this squad. I see your point regarding the missing striker, but to claim we play without a midfield is a tad dramatic.

I agree we need some new bodies in, but still... our squad is far better than those we have played so far this season. And our midfield (on paper) should be okay at this level.

And I know I'm alone here, but I think Ruben Neves is far from the player some of our fans seem to think he is. And that's probably why he'll stay at Wolves.
 

The Clock

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I think these figures are correct (but happy for someone to correct them!)

Take last 8 games worth of points from last season and add to this.
Assign highest finish Championship to highest finish Premier league, so:
Fulham adopt Burnleys figures.
Bournemouth adopt Watford figures
Nottingham Forest adopt Norwich figures.
Before the remaining games this weekend the table shows

league table.jpg

In essence, we have half the number of points required to finish in the same position as last year
 
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lets all have a disco

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I think most managers in the PL would get way better results out of this squad. I see your point regarding the missing striker, but to claim we play without a midfield is a tad dramatic.

I agree we need some new bodies in, but still... our squad is far better than those we have played so far this season. And our midfield (on paper) should be okay at this level.

And I know I'm alone here, but I think Ruben Neves is far from the player some of our fans seem to think he is. And that's probably why he'll stay at Wolves.
I think neves is on his own in midfield and has been for 2 seasons........crying out for someone to play with him......for donk he did ok yesterday, but that was the good donk and it was still just ok....
 

A3wolf

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But I don't think any manager would be good enough with our squad. ......no manager can operate without a striker or a midfield....
I think it’s too optimistic to think that if we got a decent CM and striker in that will solve everything though.
It would certainly improve the 1st 11 if all fit but injuries and suspensions can easily deprive us of our best 11 and we should be able to be competitive against non top 6 sides without them and with the team + subs we put out yesterday.
I think both matches so far this season could have gone either way. In both we had dominant spells. The biggest disappointment for me is that we can’t maintain that dominance for longer periods.
 

Banks's Mild

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I am struggling to see where we are going as a team at the moment but given the heat yesterday, the early stages of a new style/system (even if I can't really see what our game plans are) and the hope that new players are still to come, I would give him the benefit of the doubt for now. But if by the time we play Leicester when there should be no excuses by then regardless of who we buy- as you have to make the best use of whatever resources are available- I expect to see us improving and looking like a team that knows what it is doing and how to go about winning games. If by the world cup break we aren't averaging at least a point a game and looking like we are definitely going in the right direction then we should seriously look at replacing him.
I thought yesterday was pretty boring and that is reflected in the atmosphere as well as once again there was very little to get the crowd going, at the moment going to the games feels more of a habit than a really exciting day out to look forward to and for me personally that needs to change- and it's not just about winning either.
 

Perton Wolf

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Yep

18 points in the last half a season
9 points from the last 14 games
9 games without a win

God awful form
Lage probably won't survive if such form continues but let's be under no illusions, our recruitment has been poor for years and it's finally coming home to roost.

Shi is culpable, way out of his depth. We had a good thing going after our first transfer window in the PL which was fantastic but he's somehow managed to **** it up since then.
 

Fifty Niner

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Arguably yes.

We have Fabio, who's developing but out on loan.

Lage either supported the loan - possibly unlikely because he's only a Head Coach and not a Manager - or he is complicit simply because of his treatment of Silva last season.

And no, I'm not claiming that Fabio is the answer (at present) to our goal drought, but he can play with his back to goal and bring other players in.

In my view Lage has to share some of the blame. Just my view.
Ruddy said Bruno’s man management skills need improving. That said, the loaning out of MGW seems to have worked out well.
 

DDPPwolf313

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Probably been one of our best players in both games. Too many agendas on here. The likes of Neto and Podence were rubbish yesterday, goals are our biggest problem.
That's exactly the point I was making. Dendonker doesn't win or lose us a game, he does his job and nothing else. Every other player on that pitch has the ability to step it up a gear and change the game, and they should be held accountable. Not Dendonker, ironically
 

Contrarian

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Or how the team respond to his instructions...

I've been 100% supportive of Bruno all along, pinning most of our problems on lack of the right signings. However, at this point I'm starting to doubt him. I know opinions were polarised, but that video the other week where the had a microphone on Bruno, I found it difficult to understand what Bruno was going on about most of the time. And I thought the players looked baffled, too.

In matches, we see him shouting instructions, pointing at things on the clipboard. But rarely does anything change in the match. The baffling player positions and changes are beginning to mount up. Players seem to be going through the motions, I don't think either Fulham or Leeds have better players than us. But theirs had more drive and appeared far more "up for it" than ours.
 

Ned

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We just can’t get the ball from the defence, to the forwards quick enough without a long ball. Whether that’s the lack of movement or the lack of a dynamic midfielder sitting alongside Neves.

We still take too long playing it out and across the back line that we allow teams to get into shape. We NEVER have sides under sustained pressure where we have 10-15mins periods of thinking we could score at any time. Whether it’s the Portuguese way but we would rather slow it down and go backwards to keep the ball, when we slow it down the opponents get into shape and that’s that.

We only looked like scoring from breaks yesterday which simply can’t be the case when playing at home.
 

Supadavewolf

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Ruddy said Bruno’s man management skills need improving. That said, the loaning out of MGW seems to have worked out well.
I think the Fabio loan will also be a good move, though like others on here maybe last season was the better bet - always assuming we could have recruited a more experienced central striker.
 
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