Ki-Jana Hoever - Value for money?

[Fenrir_]

Bad mistake for the goal and far from the best five minutes he'll ever have as a player but he'll be alright

 

[WeAreTheWolvesII]

Solanke. Ibe. Wilson. Grujic. There's probably loads more.

But, yep, Hoever is the unique one.

The lad is ****. They've done us like they've done everyone else.

 

[Jay Jay de Wolf]

After RAN had kept Mo Salah in check all game. Hoever was left standing and caught cold as Salah waltzed by him and made the assist for Divok Origi to score
You'd think he was a Liverpool player still with giving the ball away straight away also when he first came in for RAN. When he should have past to Raul

ALL ADDED VALUE TO LIVERPOOL & NONE TO WOLVES TODAY

 

[Contrarian]

Or David so we can score some freaking goals

There are those who say Lewendoski couldn't score a goal for us while Coady and Saiss are centre halves. I do get this view, it did look that way last season. But every match this season, for me it get's more obvious that it isn't really the case and our lack of goals rests primarily on the forwards, with the midfield and wing backs as secondary issues.

 

[Hawkguy]

There are those who say Lewendoski couldn't score a goal for us while Coady and Saiss are centre halves. I do get this view, it did look that way last season. But every match this season, for me it get's more obvious that it isn't really the case and our lack of goals rests primarily on the forwards, with the midfield and wing backs as secondary issues.

I think we don't create enough in the midfield, for sure. But we also don't have the forwards to hold the ball up and be creative... especially with Neto out.

In theory Lage plays more offensive. We also have two attacking wingbacks instead of 1 which was the normal for Nuno. And we still can't create much.

Our forwards stand and wait for the ball. They don't fight for it. They don't move enough. I'm not sure if it's coaching or just what they do. Just not enough movement. Ait-Nouri crosses the ball constantly and none of our players are in positions to make runs.

 

[Contrarian]

I think we don't create enough in the midfield, for sure. But we also don't have the forwards to hold the ball up and be creative... especially with Neto out.

In theory Lage plays more offensive. We also have two attacking wingbacks instead of 1 which was the normal for Nuno. And we still can't create much.

Our forwards stand and wait for the ball. They don't fight for it. They don't move enough. I'm not sure if it's coaching or just what they do. Just not enough movement. Ait-Nouri crosses the ball constantly and none of our players are in positions to make runs.

And usually only one player in the opponents penalty area, with Hwang and Traore somewhere or other. I'm wondering if something is being lost in translation with Hwang because in flashes, he looks like he's got potential and has no problems with the pace and physicality of the Premier League. But he doesn't look like he knows what his role is. Unless he's been told "run around a lot, whereever you want, edge of our penalty area, then up the other end to the left corner flag, then the centre circle..". Because that's what he does! How can other players link with him when they don't know where he'll be? Those 2 goals v Newcastle were a false dawn as there is no sign of a partnership between Raul and Hwang now. It's 3 individuals up front who don't look keen to pass to each other any more.

The difference in pressing between our front 3 and Liverpool's, very visible. At least Raul has a clue on it. Hwang has a go. And Adama...no hope.

 

[Super Ted]

After RAN had kept Mo Salah in check all game. Hoever was left standing and caught cold as Salah waltzed by him and made the assist for Divok Origi to score
You'd think he was a Liverpool player still with giving the ball away straight away also when he first came in for RAN. When he should have past to Raul

ALL ADDED VALUE TO LIVERPOOL & NONE TO WOLVES TODAY

We’ll done you. You even put some of that dross in capitals so it must be true.

You forgot to mention the sublime first touch from Salah, but that does not help your argument.

I’ll do it for you. I’ll put it in capitals as well.

WHAT A ****ING SUPERB FIRST TOUCH FROM SALAH!

 

[Hawkguy]

We’ll done you. You even put some of that dross in capitals so it must be true.

You forgot to mention the sublime first touch from Salah, but that does not help your argument.

I’ll do it for you. I’ll put it in capitals as well.

WHAT A ****ING SUPERB FIRST TOUCH FROM SALAH!

You're not wrong. But he made three mistakes in 20 seconds. It was an atrocious cameo.

No reason to right him off. He's still young. But he was putrid today.

 

[Mile End Wanderer]

After that today he’s going to be a scapegoat

 

[marrs-guitar]

I've never seen him do anything to suggest he is ready for PL football. He looks clumsy, physically weak and unaware in almost every appearance.

Why didn't we save the 10 million and just give Ryan Giles a shot at being the 3rd or 4th choice, as I'm sure the club expected in summer 2020 to have Jonny, RAN and Marcal all able to contribute a few months later?

 

[Mile End Wanderer]

I've never seen him do anything to suggest he is ready for PL football. He looks clumsy, physically weak and unaware in almost every appearance.

Why didn't we save the 10 million and just give Ryan Giles a shot at being the 3rd or 4th choice, as I'm sure the club expected in summer 2020 to have Jonny, RAN and Marcal all able to contribute a few months later?

Thelwell liked him from the cup game where he featured against us

 

[Goldust]

Shouldn't even play for the Academy team, nevermind the main squad.

 

[Ian]

I've never seen him do anything to suggest he is ready for PL football. He looks clumsy, physically weak and unaware in almost every appearance.

Why didn't we save the 10 million and just give Ryan Giles a shot at being the 3rd or 4th choice, as I'm sure the club expected in summer 2020 to have Jonny, RAN and Marcal all able to contribute a few months later?

Exactly this!
Poor kid always looks scared stiff too, his body language is awful.
Was hard for him to come on " cold" in the last couple of minutes but he should have ( been instructed to) keep it simple.
In hindsight Donk should have been dropped back and Saiss pushed out wider.

 

[JadeWolf]

I've never seen him do anything to suggest he is ready for PL football. He looks clumsy, physically weak and unaware in almost every appearance.

Why didn't we save the 10 million and just give Ryan Giles a shot at being the 3rd or 4th choice, as I'm sure the club expected in summer 2020 to have Jonny, RAN and Marcal all able to contribute a few months later?

He was good against Leicester on the first day of the season. I’m sure he’d have played more but Semedo god love him seems to have found a bit of consistency. All I’ll say is this to all the people slagging him- Kilman is 24 and has only in the last few months started to look like an absolute diamond. So let’s not throw a 19/20 year old kid into the dustbin because he made a mistake against one of the best players in the world, yeah?

 

[Krispy Kreme]

I've never seen him do anything to suggest he is ready for PL football. He looks clumsy, physically weak and unaware in almost every appearance.

Why didn't we save the 10 million and just give Ryan Giles a shot at being the 3rd or 4th choice, as I'm sure the club expected in summer 2020 to have Jonny, RAN and Marcal all able to contribute a few months later?

Because Giles is a left back and Hoever is a right back?

 

[dewolfman]

Those vilifying Hoever, have you calmed down now from your post-match agression?

I want to see Hoever in for Semedo, Semedo has 0 assists/ 0 goals this season and a player in his position should be doing more in our system.

 

[Wolf316]

Those vilifying Hoever, have you calmed down now from your post-match agression?

I want to see Hoever in for Semedo, Semedo has 0 assists/ 0 goals this season and a player in his position should be doing more in our system.

Hoever for Semedo? Surely you’re not being serious?

 

[Deleted member yltz11841]

Needs to go out on loan like MGW and get regular playing time as he is still young. However as our useable squad size is pathetic because of our inept recruitment the last few windows we don’t have that luxury. Saying that though we let MGW go out so we may as well let Hoever, I’m sure we can name another keeper on the bench.

 

[Scallywolf]

Hoever for Semedo? Surely you’re not being serious?

Absolutely agree.

And I am being very serious!

 

[WickedWolfie]

Those vilifying Hoever, have you calmed down now from your post-match agression?

I want to see Hoever in for Semedo, Semedo has 0 assists/ 0 goals this season and a player in his position should be doing more in our system.

Semedo has been one of our best players this season. This is one of the most asinine posts that l've ever seen on the Mix. That, given some of the competition there's been, is quite an achievement.

 

[Wolf in Kenilworth]

Semedo has been one of our best players this season. This is one of the most asinine posts that l've ever seen on the Mix. That, given some of the competition there's been, is quite an achievement.

Semedo has been just fine this season.

The stats on assists and goals is wasted seeing as we have scored so few.

 

[TheConcourse]

Those vilifying Hoever, have you calmed down now from your post-match agression?

I want to see Hoever in for Semedo, Semedo has 0 assists/ 0 goals this season and a player in his position should be doing more in our system.

Laughable. You’d rather have a kid in over one of the best defensive full backs in the league?

Why don’t you talk about our attacking players goals/assists contributions? Or Moutinho and Neves’? Or our CB’s from set pieces? Or RAN?

The constant garbage from fans on Semedo is mental. He’d walk into most teams in this league.

 

[sillytuna]

Semedo gets flack because his forward play is terrible. He'a an rb not an rwb. Defensively very happy with him now and he's good on the ball.

Hoever is young and needs games. Always looks like a CB playing wide to me though. Think we way overpaid for a player who wasn't going to be a starter for years, if at all, but yesterday was just unfortunate. He and silva were down to wolves poor transfer negotiations, not the managers at the time or the players. They were worth 15-20 combined max and we're really paying the price now.

 

[groundhogwolf]

Those vilifying Hoever, have you calmed down now from your post-match agression?

I want to see Hoever in for Semedo, Semedo has 0 assists/ 0 goals this season and a player in his position should be doing more in our system.

Using your goals and assists logic we best drop Marcal, Moutinho, Traore, and in danger with a massive 1 assist are RAN and Dendoker but dont let that get in the way of your Semedo agenda.

 

[Fifty Niner]

Semedo has been just fine this season.

The stats on assists and goals is wasted seeing as we have scored so few.

The fact that some are blaming a defender for lack of assists says it all really.

It's been a consistent problem. The way we play doesn't create many chances per game and on the odd occasion that it does we haven't got enough goals in the team to take advantage. The only 'natural' goal scorer is Raul and, as usual, when he isn't scoring who is?

 

[Scallywolf]

Using your goals and assists logic we best drop Marcal, Moutinho, Traore, and in danger with a massive 1 assist are RAN and Dendoker but dont let that get in the way of your Semedo agenda.

So why just pick out Semedo then??

 

[Nige100]

He was good against Leicester on the first day of the season. I’m sure he’d have played more but Semedo god love him seems to have found a bit of consistency. All I’ll say is this to all the people slagging him- Kilman is 24 and has only in the last few months started to look like an absolute diamond. So let’s not throw a 19/20 year old kid into the dustbin because he made a mistake against one of the best players in the world, yeah?

Spot on coming on in the 90th as he did was never gonna be up to speed against Salah. I like him and think he will grow into a decent CB rather then a full/wing back tho. He was great in the game against United last season when we nearly snatched a 0-0 too but for Kilman’s slip at the the end. How ironic that Kilman is now rightly the golden boy. Couldn’t agree with you post more.

 

[Sammy Chungs Tracksuit]

Semedo gets flack because his forward play is terrible. He'a an rb not an rwb. Defensively very happy with him now and he's good on the ball.

Hoever is young and needs games. Always looks like a CB playing wide to me though. Think we way overpaid for a player who wasn't going to be a starter for years, if at all, but yesterday was just unfortunate. He and silva were down to wolves poor transfer negotiations, not the managers at the time or the players. They were worth 15-20 combined max and we're really paying the price now.

Cant argue with what you are saying about Semedo. A competent footballer whose forward play is terrible but unfortunately we bought him (and paid top dollar) as a right wing back. Defensively he has improved this season.

Seems to me when Semedo goes forward, 19 times out of 20 he turns and passes backwards and the 1 time in 20 when he doesnt pass back is when passing back is not an option. I'll bet his Opta stats for successful passes are very good but his end product as a wing back is basically zero.

Hoever is basically a championship level full back who is overrated (and was overpriced) because he came from Liverpool. Semedo is also overrated (and was overpriced) because he came from Barcelona so big things were expected.

 

[JOSWolf]

Massive mistake to bring him on in that position yesterday. Although I'm not a fan of Saiss at left back we should have put him there and put Donck in defence.

 

[WolfInSheep'sClothing]

Laughable. You’d rather have a kid in over one of the best defensive full backs in the league?

Why don’t you talk about our attacking players goals/assists contributions? Or Moutinho and Neves’? Or our CB’s from set pieces? Or RAN?

The constant garbage from fans on Semedo is mental. He’d walk into most teams in this league.

Semedo, the guy who had to be taken off against Norwich because he was all over the place positionally, is one of the best full-backs defensively in the league? He just isn't is he. Is he's already getting outshone by the 19 year old on the other side of the park, in both aspects of his game.
Ask yourself if what he did yesterday was as bad as Semedo's clearance against Palace. It just isn't is it? It's not like it was the first time we gave the ball away all game. Or the first time Liverpool had a clear cut opportunity from a defensive mistake(Saiss and Sa colliding).

 

[SA Wolf]

Semedo, the guy who had to be taken off against Norwich because he was all over the place positionally, is one of the best full-backs defensively in the league? He just isn't is he. Is he's already getting outshone by the 19 year old on the other side of the park, in both aspects of his game.
Ask yourself if what he did yesterday was as bad as Semedo's clearance against Palace. It just isn't is it? It's not like it was the first time we gave the ball away all game. Or the first time Liverpool had a clear cut opportunity from a defensive mistake(Saiss and Sa colliding).

While RAN was on, virtually every effective Liverpool attack came from Semedo's side. Semedo wasn't awful yesterday, but 'one of the best attacking full-back defensively in the league'! He's having a giraffe.

 

[WolfInSheep'sClothing]

Using your goals and assists logic we best drop Marcal, Moutinho, Traore, and in danger with a massive 1 assist are RAN and Dendoker but dont let that get in the way of your Semedo agenda.

We have already dropped Marcal. We should be dropping Moutinho. Traore has been dropped several times already this season, as has Trincao. Podence looks like he might be first choice in the wingers pecking order anyway. Ait Nouri and donk have started how many games? Semedo has been absent for a grand total of one. I think he's missed 2 games since being here, and there has really been some shockers in there.

 

[TheConcourse]

Semedo, the guy who had to be taken off against Norwich because he was all over the place positionally, is one of the best full-backs defensively in the league? He just isn't is he. Is he's already getting outshone by the 19 year old on the other side of the park, in both aspects of his game.
Ask yourself if what he did yesterday was as bad as Semedo's clearance against Palace. It just isn't is it? It's not like it was the first time we gave the ball away all game. Or the first time Liverpool had a clear cut opportunity from a defensive mistake(Saiss and Sa colliding).

All over the place against Norwich? He got taken off against Norwich because we weren’t creating anything. Bruno took him off for Traore at RWB.

How did Mane do yesterday? Got in behind him once. Another Semedo shocker, right?

 

[Wolf316]

We have already dropped Marcal. We should be dropping Moutinho. Traore has been dropped several times already this season, as has Trincao. Podence looks like he might be first choice in the wingers pecking order anyway. Ait Nouri and donk have started how many games? Semedo has been absent for a grand total of one. I think he's missed 2 games since being here, and there has really been some shockers in there.

I’d be starting Podence and Adama vs City Hwang needs dropping.

 

[TheConcourse]

While RAN was on, virtually every effective Liverpool attack came from Semedo's side. Semedo wasn't awful yesterday, but 'one of the best attacking full-back defensively in the league'! He's having a giraffe.

One of the best defensive full backs in the league. You might want to quote what I actually said.

Semedo’s attacking numbers have never been good in terms of direct goals and assists.

 

[Shergar]

Don’t particularly want to jump on the lad for his mistake against Sala but everytime he comes on he looks like he doesn’t think he belongs on the pitch, shy, introverted, he is a deer trapped in the headlights all the time.

 

[Summer_Wolf]

I don't see what this lad does. He's weak, he's bullied easily off the ball, he can't defend, he's poor at crossing. Another poor signing.

 

[BCWolf]

Nowhere near ready for the first team football. Every time he plays I feel like we've gone down to 10 men.

Needs a spell out on loan and then make a decision in the summer. Maybe swap him for Sanderson?

 

[Dan G WWFC]

I'm yet to see what makes him a good prospect. I mean he's not that fast, not that good at defending, poor going forward and way too small to be a centre half.

Needs to step up massively to even be a championship player. A loan move could be needed

 

[NJWolves69]

Pretty brutal cameo from him yesterday. If he plays that ball to Raul making the overlapping run, we probably escape with a point.

Haven't really seen anything from Hoever that suggests he should be anywhere near the first team to be honest. Maybe with Jonny looking like he's due back shortly, we can get Hoever out on loan somewhere? Still so young so he shouldn't be written off, I just haven't seen anything that suggests he can play at a high level