Everton, surely a points deduction?

[Topcat]

Hard to see Everton coming through this, another loan of £16m announced to cover day to day overheads, it’s not just money they’re running out of but time itself.

How you repay £400m plus and still have a viable business is beyond my comprehension!

Nicely summed up on the Everton forum:

“In short, Moshiri made promises he couldn't afford, couldn't raise the funding despite hiring the best finance firms, started the project without the funding being in place, got into bed with some right dogs and we're now covered in fleas and looking like we're going to run out of money.

Good times”

 

[topcat99]

"BBC Sport understands the club are not taking insolvency advice,, external but are considering ways of restructuring its short-term debt to make it more manageable.

The club owes about £400m to numerous third-party firms, with much of the loans being used towards the building of the new stadium.

It is believed there is currently not a threat of administration as the club remain up to date with payments to stakeholders such as the players, staff, stadium construction company Laing O'Rourke and HMRC."

Who do you believe, Guardian or the Beeb?

Neither. Two cheeks, one ****

 

[SingYourHeartsOut]

Not only have no money but may actually want repayment....

Yes, haven't really understood from the start.

Did they lend Everton money so they could keep going until the takeover, that seems odd as it removed the pressure on Moshiri to sell?

Or have they just put themselves in the position where they can force Everton into administration, take a loss on the loan and buy them cheaper?

Either way it feels like a basket case company trying to buy a basket case club.

 

[WickedWolfie]

Yes, haven't really understood from the start.

Did they lend Everton money so they could keep going until the takeover, that seems odd as it removed the pressure on Moshiri to sell?

Or have they just put themselves in the position where they can force Everton into administration, take a loss on the loan and buy them cheaper?

Either way it feels like a basket case company trying to buy a basket case club.

Not sure of the exact details but l do know that one group of creditors (perhaps 777) blocked a takeover by another group of creditors (who happen to have security on the new stadium).

 

[SingYourHeartsOut]

Not sure of the exact details but l do know that one group of creditors (perhaps 777) blocked a takeover by another group of creditors (who happen to have security on the new stadium).

I guess it makes sense that they might have loaned Everton money in exchange for being the preferred bidder for a takeover. They shouldn't really pass a fit and proper test, but the bar seems pretty low for that.

 

[Sussex Wolf]

Not sure of the exact details but l do know that one group of creditors (perhaps 777) blocked a takeover by another group of creditors (who happen to have security on the new stadium).

MSP Sports were the original preferred partner, and they loaned Everton 158m while waiting to complete their takeover. But they were blocked by a prior lender RMF, who loaned Everton 225m prior to that. RMF secured their loan against Goodison, and MSP secured their loan against the new stadium, so should things go belly up with 777, Everton could be left with no stadium. As has been clear from the very start, 777 are struggling to raise cash to complete their takeover, and it’s widely reported this has been a recurring challenge with virtually all the companies and clubs they have purchased. Somehow they have so far raised and loaned Everton 200m, but Everton’s debts are believed to exceed 1bn now. The Premier League made repayment of the MSP loan and depositing cash in an escrow account conditions of their approval, and they have missed multiple deadlines doing this to date.

There is a decent summary of events here:-

777 Partners press on with Everton takeover after £16m lands on day of chaos

The attempted takeover of Everton by 777 Partners was hit with new questions on Tuesday, though the arrival of a funding package eased some immediate concerns over the club's finances

www.liverpoolecho.co.uk

The Everton crisis explained: how did it get to this point?

Owner Farhad Moshiri once said the club were ‘robust’ enough to fund stadium but now they need working capital injections

www.theguardian.com

 

[WickedWolfie]

MSP Sports were the original preferred partner, and they loaned Everton 158m while waiting to complete their takeover. But they were blocked by a prior lender RMF, who loaned Everton 225m prior to that. RMF secured their loan against Goodison, and MSP secured their loan against the new stadium, so should things go belly up with 777, Everton could be left with no stadium. As has been clear from the very start, 777 are struggling to raise cash to complete their takeover, and it’s widely reported this has been a recurring challenge with virtually all the companies and clubs they have purchased. Somehow they have so far raised and loaned Everton 200m, but Everton’s debts are believed to exceed 1bn now. The Premier League made repayment of the MSP loan and depositing cash in an escrow account conditions of their approval, and they have missed multiple deadlines doing this to date.

There is a decent summary of events here:-

777 Partners press on with Everton takeover after £16m lands on day of chaos

The attempted takeover of Everton by 777 Partners was hit with new questions on Tuesday, though the arrival of a funding package eased some immediate concerns over the club's finances

www.liverpoolecho.co.uk

The Everton crisis explained: how did it get to this point?

Owner Farhad Moshiri once said the club were ‘robust’ enough to fund stadium but now they need working capital injections

www.theguardian.com

That is one hell of a hole that Everton are in.

 

[iamthenewno2]

MSP Sports were the original preferred partner, and they loaned Everton 158m while waiting to complete their takeover. But they were blocked by a prior lender RMF, who loaned Everton 225m prior to that. RMF secured their loan against Goodison, and MSP secured their loan against the new stadium, so should things go belly up with 777, Everton could be left with no stadium. As has been clear from the very start, 777 are struggling to raise cash to complete their takeover, and it’s widely reported this has been a recurring challenge with virtually all the companies and clubs they have purchased. Somehow they have so far raised and loaned Everton 200m, but Everton’s debts are believed to exceed 1bn now. The Premier League made repayment of the MSP loan and depositing cash in an escrow account conditions of their approval, and they have missed multiple deadlines doing this to date.

There is a decent summary of events here:-

777 Partners press on with Everton takeover after £16m lands on day of chaos

The attempted takeover of Everton by 777 Partners was hit with new questions on Tuesday, though the arrival of a funding package eased some immediate concerns over the club's finances

www.liverpoolecho.co.uk

The Everton crisis explained: how did it get to this point?

Owner Farhad Moshiri once said the club were ‘robust’ enough to fund stadium but now they need working capital injections

www.theguardian.com

Should we be waiting for the PL to bend a rule or two for "the good of the club's future" and allow 777 in the door?

 

[Mile End Wanderer]

Should we be waiting for the PL to bend a rule or two for "the good of the club's future" and allow 777 in the door?

Even if they allow them in or whatever it’s kicking the can further down the road. Where is the money coming from? They would literally have to have a major fire sale of many players if not all.

 

[Sussex Wolf]

Even if they allow them in or whatever it’s kicking the can further down the road. Where is the money coming from? They would literally have to have a major fire sale of many players if not all.

As I commented previously, as far as I can see, even with the extra revenue from their new stadium, I can only just about see the club breaking even, but that’s without paying back the debts accumulated to build it and cover the clubs operating losses before hand. To me, all they can hope for is that a cash rich buyer buys them after the new ground is finished and maybe that is the opportunity 777 (and MSP before them) is hoping for?

If however 777 can’t complete the takeover, I can only really see administration as the only outcome, and given the haircuts this would bring the existing lenders, then it’s perhaps understandable why they have not called their loans in sooner.

 

[Oh When the Wolves]

They should be relegated .

Why should teams that complied with the rules be relegated instead?

Absolute madness

 

[Mile End Wanderer]

They should be relegated .

Why should teams that complied with the rules be relegated instead?

Absolute madness

Absolutely right

 

[old wittonian]

The Bury's of this word, however, are allowed to go to the wall.

 

[Werewolf of Wombourne]

They will have to have a proper fire sale this off season if the takeover collapses, not the pretend one we did.

 

[Boss Hogg]

They must be paying £50million a year in interest payments

They could be buying a couple of decent players a year with that!

 

[WV10Wolf]

They must be paying £50million a year in interest payments

They could be buying a couple of decent players a year with that!

Not with their recent history of recruiting players they couldn’t.

 

[WW1963]

They will have to have a proper fire sale this off season if the takeover collapses, not the pretend one we did.

At a time when the transfer market is completely deflated. Any club having to sell just to survive as a club are in huge trouble.

Two years ago, Pickford might have been worth upwards of £100m. In today's market - especially the Premier League - he isn't going to be bought for half that amount.

 

[Topcat]

Interestingly, if Everton go bust then it’s not exactly a good look for the PL.

Think they’re stuck between a rock and a hard place to sanction 777 as fit and proper and as such the writings on the wall for Everton at this present time.

 

[Bullyboy]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1785259946273296706

Sounds like 9 points coming off for Everton

Hopefully this season!

 

[wesley]

Rumours on twitter Everton have called an emergency board meeting.

 

[Madmalc]

HMRC would be the ones who might bring it down. They have nothing to lose.
It will be interesting to see if the working capital injections keep HMRC at bay.

 

[Topcat]

Rumours on twitter Everton have called an emergency board meeting.

Apparently denied on Everton forum as a load of tosh!

Be interesting if true though?!

 

[Ned]

It’s hard to have any sympathy for them as a club, I know this is different than PSR/FFP but it still annoys me that they had a few very saleable assets and didn’t bother getting rid of at least 1.

 

[Mile End Wanderer]

This will all unfold after the season has finished and roll over to next season absolute farce from the FA and PL

 

[Topcat]

This will all unfold after the season has finished and roll over to next season absolute farce from the FA and PL

Personally I think Everton have run out of time and things might unfold sooner than we think?

They can only gloss over the predicament their in for so long before the games effectively over.

 

[WickedWolfie]

Personally I think Everton have run out of time and things might unfold sooner than we think?

They can only gloss over the predicament their in for so long before the games effectively over.

There are legal rules about director's liabilities for trading while insolvent that will doubtless be concentrating minds...

 

[Minimalist]

Can someone explain quite how Everton have got themselves in such a hole?

 

[WW1963]

Apparently denied on Everton forum as a load of tosh!

Be interesting if true though?!

Is that the same forum that wailed Everton were victims of a conspiracy against them by the Premier League?

 

[Wolf316]

Can someone explain quite how Everton have got themselves in such a hole?

Spunked a **** ton of money on absolute dross that’s now worth **** all.

 

[Topcat]

Can someone explain quite how Everton have got themselves in such a hole?

Mismanagement on a colossal scale over the past decade or so.

Massive over spends on player recruitment without very little sell-on value plus the construction of BMD

 

[Minimalist]

Spunked a **** ton of money on absolute dross that’s now worth **** all.

Can’t just be that though?
I never seem to remember them spending that much?? Admittedly what they did buy was poor.
Surely they could have a fire sale and bring in over £100m quite easily, even if they ended up relegated they would at least still be solvent?
It must have a lot to do with the stadium build??

 

[SingYourHeartsOut]

Spunked a **** ton of money on absolute dross that’s now worth **** all.

While deciding to build an £800m stadium.

 

[Topcat]

Is that the same forum that wailed Everton were victims of a conspiracy against them by the Premier League?

More than likely!

Bit of a deluded lot if you ask me!

 

[Fenrir_]

Hopefully this season!

Hopefully next season! They'll survive this season

 

[SA Wolf]

Spunked a **** ton of money on absolute dross that’s now worth **** all.

You must be a chartered accountant to articulate financial terminology like that. Respect!

 

[SingYourHeartsOut]

Hopefully next season! They'll survive this season

The EFL rule is that if you enter administration after the 3rd Thursday in March (I think) you still get the points deduction that season, unless you're relegated anyway, in which case it carries over. No idea if that applies in the EPL though, has anyone done it since Portsmouth?

 

[Poztin]

Everton in bits

 

[Minimalist]

Everton in bits

From “doin’ bits”
To
“Going to bits…..”

 

[Wolf316]

You must be a chartered accountant to articulate financial terminology like that. Respect!

****ing right I am!

 

[Mile End Wanderer]

Give them 3 months they will hit admin if prem do not approve 777