Jeff Shi - Interview in The Athletic

[haveaniceday]

Maybe it is, just find it a bit odd. The Athletic, is what, couple quid a month? Or they offer free trials? Yet moan about Jeff/Fosun being tight.

What a weird take.

Jeff can't stop banging on about Wolves needing to be self sufficient and not relying on Fosun for money, they also can't stop raising prices at every given opportunity. They also can't stop pumping out products and merchandise to further encourage fans to spend more at the club. We effectively fund the clubs operation with our financial support, leaving us entitled to an opinion on whether or not the money is being spent fairly, effectively and sensibly. We desperately needed a CB and a CM and despite Fosun saying they have no budget issues and know we needed these players, they failed to recruit either, one due to 5m, which in the greed league is pennies. We also got 6m of profit this window, despite the very obvious need for more players.

Jeff and his boys will be very well compensated for their work at the club, doubt 99% of Wolves fans earn as much as they do. But sure, it's Wolves fans being hypocritical for not wanting to pay for The Athletic, which was barely worth it when we had the Molineux View and is even less worth it now.

 

[jonesy]

Simple, we need a director of football thAt looks after the football side and let Jeff do the non football parts of the business. It would ease the fan pressure on him and make sure an experienced football man run the footballing side of the business and get better results.

 

[DanishWolf]

Simple, we need a director of football thAt looks after the football side and let Jeff do the non football parts of the business. It would ease the fan pressure on him and make sure an experienced football man run the footballing side of the business and get better results.

I agree completely. However if Jeff is still unable(or unwilling due to the fees) to get deals over the line, arent we in the same place?

 

[Hot Fuss]

Thanks for a great reply .Loved it
I can’t agree but that maybe because I could be cold and pragmatic .

Absolutely fair enough.

 

[Sussex Wolf]

Firstly I would question if the money is going to be significantly reinvested in the playing side. Jeffs interview suggests to me he’s perfectly happy to stay up in the premier league without particularly pushing the team/ground.

Secondly, like all premier league clubs, we generate money from shirts, tickets, sponsorship deals and 100 odd million off sky every year. We aren’t potless and should be doing better than the last window in my opinion.

Its not Jeffs fault football is in the state it is, but it’s a million miles away from why I got into it as a kid from Wolverhampton. Success would be great but seeing my club reduced to a “brand” and a “company” and basically being used as a cash generator for an investment company while my tickets prices go up and up and up just leaves me cold.

Since when has Wolves generated any cash for Fosun? The value of Wolves to Fosun will likely only be realised when they sell some or all of their interest in the club. Very few clubs generate stable income beyond their needs for the benefit of their shareholders.

 

[wwbug]

We have the money, we know the positions that need to be filled, yet we haven’t filled them.
Is that ineptitude?
Either Fosun is not able to sell the big picture or recruitment is not doing their job.
To be sorted ….

 

[Stratman Wolves]

I read that and my question to you is
Where do you think the money will come from to buy better players ? Or would you prefer WWFC under Morgan and Moxey.

Going forward, it sounds like Fosun/Shi are going to operate Wolves more like how M&M did rather than how Fosun did from 2016-2019.

You know where the money can come from? Fosun International. FFP is not an obstacle, only Fosun is applying handbrakes to themselves. Before I get accused of wanting to spunk hundreds of billions of pounds, I wish we could just sign a couple first team upgrades to stay competitive for the upper half of the table. Thats it. Fosun has the means to do this, but be it politics/Covid/strategic choice, they've decided not to. And it sucks as a football supporter. I'm a supporter, not an investor. I just want my club to be competitive. If these transfer windows the last couple years have shown us a peek into the future, it absolutely blows.

 

[Wandsworth Wolf]

Would imagine that as long as the club hold the rights to the image then the club has to be getting money out of it, but totally see what you mean that it could be an independent venture that makes more money elsewhere than it does for WWFC.

I'm sure they've said they like the Red Bull 'model', maybe (total hypothesis) they want to build something similar where it's all under the umbrella of that wolf's head emblem. Which to be honest fills me with as much dread as it does hope

Yeah, but DO Wolverhampton Wanderers (the football club) even own the badge and the name anymore.

It’s a pretty sobering thought.

Do Wolves get all the commercial revenue for the use of its own name (via licensing or ortherwise) or will Fosun use it to drive profits? I love to know if this a money making exercise for Wolves the football club or for Fosun the corporate giant.

And before anyone says ‘Fosun/Wolves same thing’ - it absolutely is not the same thing.

 

[Sussex Wolf]

Going forward, it sounds like Fosun/Shi are going to operate Wolves more like how M&M did rather than how Fosun did from 2016-2019.

You know where the money can come from? Fosun International. FFP is not an obstacle, only Fosun is applying handbrakes to themselves. Before I get accused of wanting to spunk hundreds of billions of pounds, I wish we could just sign a couple first team upgrades to stay competitive for the upper half of the table. Thats it. Fosun has the means to do this, but be it politics/Covid/strategic choice, they've decided not to. And it sucks as a football supporter. If these transfer windows the last couple years have shown us, it absolutely blows.

While Jeff is saying FFP was not the barrier to investment this summer, FFP would limit how much capital any Fosun company could inject directly into the playing squad. That’s precisely why Man City’s owners got into trouble trying to use back door mechanisms to inject further money into City. Of course, it wouldn’t stop Fosun investing several hundred million to expand the stadium, and through that, allow the club to generate more money to spend on players. However the resulting increase in revenue would be relatively modest.

 

[hollo]

I am a legacy fan and i want to be treated as more important than a global fan.

 

[NJWolves69]

Yeah, but DO Wolverhampton Wanderers (the football club) even own the badge and the name anymore.

It’s a pretty sobering thought.

Do Wolves get all the commercial revenue for the use of its own name (via licensing or ortherwise) or will Fosun use it to drive profits? I love to know if this a money making exercise for Wolves the football club or for Fosun the corporate giant.

And before anyone says ‘Fosun/Wolves same thing’ - it absolutely is not the same thing.

This would be a great question for somebody to actually ask Jeff. Too bad he doesn't go off script.

 

[The Wolf In The North]

Thoroughly deflating, for two reasons.

Firstly, that the chairman of the club believes that the best way to communicate with fans at a time of uncertainty is through a third party journalist via an article behind a paywall. To return to Jeff's own analogy, it's like him wanting to reassure his wife that he loves her, but she has to phone a premium rate 0800 number to hear the message. If he has something to say, say it through the medium of the club so everyone can hear it.

Secondly, Jeff is not some kindly uncle who flaps his gums with endearing, off-the-cuff anecdotes. He is a shrewd businessman, precise and deliberate. So when he says Bruno turned down players that is most definitely him turning the tap back on Bruno. Regardless, the message is that either Bruno is unrealistic in what he wants, or that the recruitment team were coming up with 20-30 names not good enough for our first team, and either way that's not a pretty picture because it means the key figures in the club have spent a summer not operating in the same tune.

The football market works the way it works. Everyone knows it's a cross between a circus and a casino. But that's what it is. If you want to own a club at this level, you have to pump your coins in the slot.

The bare truth is that Wolves are currently operating like teams such as Newcastle, Burnley and Southampton, where the money that is invested in new players comes from player sales, and wages are around 70% of the tv money and the rest gets put in a pot, and that's nothing to do with FFP. And if that's the way they want it, so be it, it's their business. But don't trot out the same lines about a difficult market, transfer window after transfer window, and expect people to suck it up like sugar.

And certainly don't do it through a pay-to-view online magazine site.

 

[hollo]

This would be a great question for somebody to actually ask Jeff. Too bad he doesn't go off script.

Would vinny clarke give you a straight answer?

 

[hollo]

Thoroughly deflating, for two reasons.

Firstly, that the chairman of the club believes that the best way to communicate with fans at a time of uncertainty is through a third party journalist via an article behind a paywall. To return to Jeff's own analogy, it's like him wanting to reassure his wife that he loves her, but she has to phone a premium rate 0800 number to hear the message. If he has something to say, say it through the medium of the club so everyone can hear it.

Secondly, Jeff is not some kindly uncle who flaps his gums with endearing, off-the-cuff anecdotes. He is a shrewd businessman, precise and deliberate. So when he says Bruno turned down players that is most definitely him turning the tap back on Bruno. Regardless, the message is that either Bruno is unrealistic in what he wants, or that the recruitment team were coming up with 20-30 names not good enough for our first team, and either way that's not a pretty picture because it means the key figures in the club have spent a summer not operating in the same tune.

The football market works the way it works. Everyone knows it's a cross between a circus and a casino. But that's what it is. If you want to own a club at this level, you have to pump your coins in the slot.

The bare truth is that Wolves are currently operating like teams such as Newcastle, Burnley and Southampton, where the money that is invested in new players comes from player sales, and wages are around 70% of the tv money and the rest gets put in a pot, and that's nothing to do with FFP. And if that's the way they want it, so be it, it's their business. But don't trot out the same lines about a difficult market, transfer window after transfer window, and expect people to suck it up like sugar.

And certainly don't do it through a pay-to-view online magazine site.

Jeff has contradicted himself. First we have to watch ffp then all of a sudden we don't as the championship season financials have dropped off the calculations.
Jeff i don't want to sell , i want to buy and buy big.

 

[sc91]

The more I read, the less I like.

Found more enjoyment last weekend going to non-league than I did for Wolves in a while. Watford away this weekend and I'm more excited that it's quicker home, just not feeling like its Wolves anymore.

 

[AlexWolvesHD]

What is concerning is that they offered Bruno 20 to 30 players and two thirds of them Bruno deemed no better than the player we already had in that position

That to me tells me they tried to do it on the cheap and were looking at subpar players for most of the summer and had Bruno been a yes man we would have ended up with some right dross being signed this summer

 

[Fenrir_]

Yeah, but DO Wolverhampton Wanderers (the football club) even own the badge and the name anymore.

It’s a pretty sobering thought.

Do Wolves get all the commercial revenue for the use of its own name (via licensing or ortherwise) or will Fosun use it to drive profits? I love to know if this a money making exercise for Wolves the football club or for Fosun the corporate giant.

And before anyone says ‘Fosun/Wolves same thing’ - it absolutely is not the same thing.

We do... don't we?!

Pretty sure that guy who claimed to have designed it was in a case against WWFC, and we've definitely not heard anything that says we've sold the rights to it

Someone will be able to find out... I think

 

[DanishWolf]

I am a legacy fan and i want to be treated as more important than a global fan.

But what about us legacy-global fans then?

Kidding of course and I agree completely with you.
Legacy fans are the most important, because they'll be there both before and after Fosun and any others and because they love the club for the right reasons and are attached not just to the brand, but to every part of the club, its history and legacy.

There's also a major difference between those who becomes fans of the "brand" through playing a computergame, and those of us, who fell in love with the football team.

Some of us have spend a fortune, not on brand merchandise, but on trying to save enough money to go see our team as much as possible, despite the distance. Starting in my case with a low paid after school job as a dishwasher at a butchers shop,where I worked daily for 6 months in order to go see the team for the first time. A lot easier today of course when I can go several times a season.
But there's a good fellowship of overseas fans all around, who started following Wolves, for football reasons alone, and who'll also stay loyal to Wolves, no matter what league we're in or whether the brand is trendy or not.

 

[Highlandwolf2]

I don’t now believe a word he says (aka liar). More spin - not that I’m surprised. White noise.

 

[Mr Sizzle]

Yeah, but DO Wolverhampton Wanderers (the football club) even own the badge and the name anymore.

It’s a pretty sobering thought.

Do Wolves get all the commercial revenue for the use of its own name (via licensing or ortherwise) or will Fosun use it to drive profits? I love to know if this a money making exercise for Wolves the football club or for Fosun the corporate giant.

And before anyone says ‘Fosun/Wolves same thing’ - it absolutely is not the same thing.

100 % this.. absolutely critical we understand this to get on board with what they are trying to do. I have my doubts this will directly benefit the wolves we care about .

 

[BCWolf]

More sophistry from Shi. Trust and hope this is his last season at Wolves. Completely out of his depth without a DOF. Recruitment at the club is a shambles and has been since 2019.

Not convinced Fosun cares about their "project" anymore, but if they replace Jeff with a CEO and a DOF it would be a start.

 

[Ironfistedmonk]

These e-sports purchases, are they being put through Wolves books or Fosuns?

 

[Mile End Wanderer]

More sophistry from Shi. Trust and hope this is his last season at Wolves. Completely out of his depth without a DOF. Recruitment at the club is a shambles and has been since 2019.

Not convinced Fosun cares about their "project" anymore, but if they replace Jeff with a CEO and a DOF it would be a start.

Novelty soon wore off for the Chinese. They either want to help Wolves grow or they don’t, being self sustaining is a long term project yes I don’t think we have the infrastructure right now to do that

 

[Hot Fuss]

Since when has Wolves generated any cash for Fosun? The value of Wolves to Fosun will likely only be realised when they sell some or all of their interest in the club. Very few clubs generate stable income beyond their needs for the benefit of their shareholders.

Would you not say that now the club is worth 10x what it was bought for (thanks to vary significant investment in the first 3 years) that it is now basically there to be part of the “brand” and turn a profit for the company while staying the premier league?

There little sign of much investment in either the squad or the ground, prices rise at large rates and Jeff is very excited about the potential of esports.

 

[jonesy]

look the tx window is over lets just get behind them and see how we get on till January. Im sure (by rumors) calla car and sanches are on the radar and we will be in a better place!!

 

[Sussex Wolf]

Yeah, but DO Wolverhampton Wanderers (the football club) even own the badge and the name anymore.

It’s a pretty sobering thought.

Do Wolves get all the commercial revenue for the use of its own name (via licensing or ortherwise) or will Fosun use it to drive profits? I love to know if this a money making exercise for Wolves the football club or for Fosun the corporate giant.

And before anyone says ‘Fosun/Wolves same thing’ - it absolutely is not the same thing.

This is a blind alley.

Fosun own Wolves, and Wolves own the rights to the Wolves brand. Should Fosun wish to use the brand for other businesses than Wolves, they would need to obtain Wolves approval for this. If they failed to do so, then Fosun would be exposed to Wolves not being considered a separate legal and tax entity in the eyes of the HMRC, and potentially exposed to paying tax on Fosun’s global corporate earnings. The principle of corporate separation must be maintained in order to protect Fosun from this, and from potential legal claims through Wolves.

Now in practice, or course Wolves could grant any other Fosun entity the right to use the Wolves brand. Following on from the same principle of corporate separation, they would need to demonstrate they were doing so in a tax defendable manner, which means charging a commercial rate or some other commercial agreement which achieves the same result. That might for instance be through Wolves generating higher value sponsorship deals because the brand has been made more valuable by the greater exposure through the other Fosun businesses.

The long and short is that Wolves have to derive some commercial value from use of its brand by other Fosun businesses.

 

[Keyser Soze]

look the tx window is over lets just get behind them and see how we get on till January. Im sure (by rumors) calla car and sanches are on the radar and we will be in a better place!!

One of the things they stood out from me was that Sanches, Botman & Car were in fact the ‘not ideal’ targets as they’d missed out on these 20/30 ‘top’ targets as they were the deadline day deals

so with that in mind, wouldn’t we try again for the mystery top ones in Jan… and therefor rule out the Sanches’ etc for Jan… unless we have to resort to them on the last day?

or have I missed interpreted that? I may be more confused than before I saw these comments

 

[Sussex Wolf]

Would you not say that now the club is worth 10x what it was bought for (thanks to vary significant investment in the first 3 years) that it is now basically there to be part of the “brand” and turn a profit for the company while staying the premier league?

There little sign of much investment in either the squad or the ground, prices rise at large rates and Jeff is very excited about the potential of esports.

Yes it’s more valuable, but that doesn’t mean it’s generating cash for Fosun yet. The value of Wolves relative to Fosun’s global corporate value is lost in the rounding. It’s not like Man Utd, where the sheer size of Utd allowed the Glazers to borrow significantly more money to fund further asset purchases. My point is that their 120m+ investment in Wolves to date will likely only be monetised when they sell some of all of the club. We know they have been looking to do this for at least a couple of years, so it’s only a matter of time.

 

[Oldgoldilox]

Thoroughly deflating, for two reasons.

Firstly, that the chairman of the club believes that the best way to communicate with fans at a time of uncertainty is through a third party journalist via an article behind a paywall. To return to Jeff's own analogy, it's like him wanting to reassure his wife that he loves her, but she has to phone a premium rate 0800 number to hear the message. If he has something to say, say it through the medium of the club so everyone can hear it.

Secondly, Jeff is not some kindly uncle who flaps his gums with endearing, off-the-cuff anecdotes. He is a shrewd businessman, precise and deliberate. So when he says Bruno turned down players that is most definitely him turning the tap back on Bruno. Regardless, the message is that either Bruno is unrealistic in what he wants, or that the recruitment team were coming up with 20-30 names not good enough for our first team, and either way that's not a pretty picture because it means the key figures in the club have spent a summer not operating in the same tune.

The football market works the way it works. Everyone knows it's a cross between a circus and a casino. But that's what it is. If you want to own a club at this level, you have to pump your coins in the slot.

The bare truth is that Wolves are currently operating like teams such as Newcastle, Burnley and Southampton, where the money that is invested in new players comes from player sales, and wages are around 70% of the tv money and the rest gets put in a pot, and that's nothing to do with FFP. And if that's the way they want it, so be it, it's their business. But don't trot out the same lines about a difficult market, transfer window after transfer window, and expect people to suck it up like sugar.

And certainly don't do it through a pay-to-view online magazine site.

Well I'm guessing that no one from Molineux Mix asked him for an interview. He could have gone to the E&S maybe but I guess Britney is regarded as the prime local and national reporter on most matters Wolves these days so not unnatural that he would go in that direction. The E&S guy was reporting on Smallsal a few weeks ago, hardly likely to give him the gig.

 

[JOSWolf]

Even though Bruno has stated he only wants players in that will improve the team? Perhaps you could point him in the direction of them!

We have 3 central midfield players. Dave Edwards would be an improvement on depth at the moment!

 

[JOSWolf]

Bit awkward and a little daft to shoot down the ffp excuse as that was the one thing the positive brigade had been clinging too all summer.

Correct.

 

[The Clock]

Shi attempting to save face and at same time ensure the Manager remains the sacrificial goat.

Fairly symptomatic of most CEO's really.

 

[Marvellous007]

Thoroughly deflating, for two reasons.

Firstly, that the chairman of the club believes that the best way to communicate with fans at a time of uncertainty is through a third party journalist via an article behind a paywall. To return to Jeff's own analogy, it's like him wanting to reassure his wife that he loves her, but she has to phone a premium rate 0800 number to hear the message. If he has something to say, say it through the medium of the club so everyone can hear it.

Secondly, Jeff is not some kindly uncle who flaps his gums with endearing, off-the-cuff anecdotes. He is a shrewd businessman, precise and deliberate. So when he says Bruno turned down players that is most definitely him turning the tap back on Bruno. Regardless, the message is that either Bruno is unrealistic in what he wants, or that the recruitment team were coming up with 20-30 names not good enough for our first team, and either way that's not a pretty picture because it means the key figures in the club have spent a summer not operating in the same tune.

The football market works the way it works. Everyone knows it's a cross between a circus and a casino. But that's what it is. If you want to own a club at this level, you have to pump your coins in the slot.

The bare truth is that Wolves are currently operating like teams such as Newcastle, Burnley and Southampton, where the money that is invested in new players comes from player sales, and wages are around 70% of the tv money and the rest gets put in a pot, and that's nothing to do with FFP. And if that's the way they want it, so be it, it's their business. But don't trot out the same lines about a difficult market, transfer window after transfer window, and expect people to suck it up like sugar.

And certainly don't do it through a pay-to-view online magazine site.

I couldn't agree anymore spot on

 

[The Wolf In The North]

Well I'm guessing that no one from Molineux Mix asked him for an interview. He could have gone to the E&S maybe but I guess Britney is regarded as the prime local and national reporter on most matters Wolves these days so not unnatural that he would go in that direction. The E&S guy was reporting on Smallsal a few weeks ago, hardly likely to give him the gig.

Why go through any third party news outlet, though? He's within his rights not to speak whatsoever, he's not contractually obliged to speak to the media. But if he made the decision to say something, why not address fans through the official club website, where it would reach the most people? What happens now is that a bunch of people won't actually read what he's said, because they can't, and will instead comment on what they think he's said and what other people say, which will get skewed by personal bias.

 

[JOSWolf]

Crystal clear to me that we need a top quality director of football at the club with worldwide contacts. The current recruitment appears all over the place and a shambles.

Sellars seems very quiet recently.

 

[goldeneyed]

Not great and he needs to learn to be totally honest in such interviews. The lack of proper cover for Jiminez (Hwang is not a centre forward) and the failure to bring in a cm (we probably need two) are simply major errors that could cost the club dearly. Not so concerned about a CB although an upgrade is always welcome and Boly's injury issues are worrying.

On the plus side yes Trincao and perhaps Mosquera look like useful additions. AIt-Nouri was a great signing for a decent fee. Hwang - at least he is a 'forward' but surely not covering the most urgent position at centre forward. The Sanches issue, utterly ridiculous last moment stuff for a player known to have injuries that would keep him out short to medium term. No proper back up plan leaving us hugely vulnerable. Not impressive Jeff, looked very amateurish.

Top marks for not selling Neves and Traore on the cheap but yet again a huge missed opportunity.

 

[old wittonian]

Shi attempting to save face and at same time ensure the Manager remains the sacrificial goat.

Fairly symptomatic of most CEO's really.

A good season and Bruno may be off to pastures new then

 

[Stoichkov]

Firstly, that the chairman of the club believes that the best way to communicate with fans at a time of uncertainty is through a third party journalist via an article behind a paywall. To return to Jeff's own analogy, it's like him wanting to reassure his wife that he loves her, but she has to phone a premium rate 0800 number to hear the message. If he has something to say, say it through the medium of the club so everyone can hear it.

Couldn't agree more

Tim Spiers and co will say well someone has to pay the local journo's wages, and for the Athletic's paywall you could look at Sky's subscription - I pay the latter but so far won't pay the former, doesn't offer value for money and I;m amazed they can pay their journos

Either way I just don't see why fans should have to sustain yet another paid model when we should be hearing this for free from the club that we give so much money to

Great shame the E&S aren't seen as a viable outlet

 

[Deleted member 9202LYK]

Looks forward to a window where we don't have to spend 50 or 100m so the money can be used on the Steve Bull stand

When are they starting work then?

 

[wwbug]

Going forward, it sounds like Fosun/Shi are going to operate Wolves more like how M&M did rather than how Fosun did from 2016-2019.

You know where the money can come from? Fosun International. FFP is not an obstacle, only Fosun is applying handbrakes to themselves. Before I get accused of wanting to spunk hundreds of billions of pounds, I wish we could just sign a couple first team upgrades to stay competitive for the upper half of the table. Thats it. Fosun has the means to do this, but be it politics/Covid/strategic choice, they've decided not to. And it sucks as a football supporter. I'm a supporter, not an investor. I just want my club to be competitive. If these transfer windows the last couple years have shown us a peek into the future, it absolutely blows.

What is competitive ? Its quite something to say top of this league like Man City .
We are far better than we have been over the last 35 years . So that is much more competitive.
I do think Fosun will not advance (from mid table) unless they have a clear narrative to attract top players .
Shi alluded to this when he said its difficult to buy ONE top player . I agree you need 5 top players to attract any new top players, and I feel we have let one top player go in Patricio.
But I ask again where does the money come from. They have already put in £150 million .