John Barnwell and what happened in the 80’s

[bennymacca]

EXCLUSIVE: Why I left Wolves - John Barnwell finally tells his story - Wolves Bite

All happened when I was very young. A fascinating interview on the situation in 1980 when Andy Gray was bought and sold.

Makes you glad we are investing in youth and the team and we have an owner with deep pockets.

 

[BCWolf]

Good read. Fond memories of that team.

 

[ShropshireLad]

EXCLUSIVE: Why I left Wolves - John Barnwell finally tells his story - Wolves Bite

All happened when I was very young. A fascinating interview on the situation in 1980 when Andy Gray was bought and sold.

Makes you glad we are investing in youth and the team and we have an owner with deep pockets.

That's a great read, matey.

What I really like about it is that he explains why he was at loggerheads with Marshall but there's no character assassination. He actually praises him for doing what he thought was best for the club. If only others could learn from that.

 

[Deleted member 4023]

Top bloke John Barnwell . My grandad & John are the reasons why I started following Wolves

 

[Werewolf of Wombourne]

Always was a class act John Barnwell.

 

[Jamwolf]

Sounds like he was a bit of a hothead at the time but now recognises Marshall’s predicament.

In fairness he suffered a terrible head injury. I remember praying for his recovery and being amazed when he came back so quickly.

Top bloke.

 

[ricki herberts moustache]

I'll tell you what happened in the 80's

The best pop music EVER!

As for the football...at least you signed Ricki Herbert

 

[Rednal Wolf]

Great read about one of our great managers . A true gentleman who along with Richie Barker was much loved by the fans .
I remember standing outside the Southbank having signed petitions to get Marshall out . Fans delayed going in for 10 minutes or so as part of the protests .
The " Marshall must go chants " , the regular pitch invassions by individuals and small groups are memorable . On one occassiin Geoff Palmer making a citizens arrest of a young pitch invader made him hated for a period of time .
A very different time with little to celebrate . Hardcore fans that went home and away with no comcerns about loyalty points , what number coach they were on and talk of bandwagon jumpers . Despite all the doom they stll followed Wolves away in good numbers .
Barnwell was a great manager and would have been very successful at Wolves were it not for the clueless Marshall who sailed the Molineux ship onto the rocks and wrecked the club .
Folk moan about lack of signings now .........they really dont know the half of what older fans went through ......we remember Barnwell very fondly .

 

[Boss Hogg]

Great read, thanks for the link.

 

[Stourport wolf]

Great read.

 

[Seasider]

'Andy Gray, Andy Gray, Harry Marshall is nothing to be scared of...' to the tune of 'Prince Charming' by Adam and the Ants!

I loved John Barnwell and Richie Barker, felt at the time that they could take us places.

 

[Mutchy]

Very interesting read. Would have loved to be at the event with him, Kenny, Willie, and JR.

 

[The Professional]

EXCLUSIVE: Why I left Wolves - John Barnwell finally tells his story - Wolves Bite

All happened when I was very young. A fascinating interview on the situation in 1980 when Andy Gray was bought and sold.

Makes you glad we are investing in youth and the team and we have an owner with deep pockets.

Great interview. Barnwell is now 80. Good grief, he’s still a young manager in my head.

 

[Big Saft Kid]

Great interview. Barnwell is now 80. Good grief, he’s still a young manager in my head.

Blimey, I actually remember Barnwell as a player! Inside forward for Arsenal, which is when I first saw him at Wolves. Excellent against our great 50s side. I think he moved on to Forest. Certainly as a manager he was one of the best we've had. That 79-80 side was very good

 

[Big Nosed Wolf]

Although for those too young to have been there it's a good read for those of us who were it tells us little that we didn't already know.

Marshall was doing the right thing in trying to redevelop Molineux but like many directors he was too concerned with limiting the manager's power and trying to sideline Barnwell over selling Gray was only going to make matters worse. The other club involved wasn't the best to be dealing with at that time either.

Marshall could not have forseen the huge rise in interest rates so quickly and the impending tragedies that came later in the decade meant money would be available to make football safer to watch. So perhaps waiting a few years more and giving Barnwell that which he needed to finish the job would have been better. Had he done I think another first div title would have followed by the mid eighties.

In the end it turned out to be another sorry saga of mis management at the club and this time it was the start of real problems. What Barnwell/Barker achieved from 78/81 wasn't far away from that which Nuno has achieved in the same sort of time frame. We finished 6th, won a major cup, two semi-finals and played in Europe again. In 1978 we had just returned to the First Div after a season in Div2 and struggling. They turned it around very quickly.

 

[Jamwolf]

The problem with the 1979-81 team was that, Gray aside, it was the 1972/3 team !
Well, not quite but the spine was the same.

Having said that, I don't remember Barnwell signing any younger players.

 

[Deleted member 4023]

The problem with the 1979-81 team was that, Gray aside, it was the 1972/3 team !
Well, not quite but the spine was the same.

Having said that, I don't remember Barnwell signing any younger players.

TBF - JB didn't have much of a say in who we signed or didn't sign.

 

[Big Nosed Wolf]

The problem with the 1979-81 team was that, Gray aside, it was the 1972/3 team !
Well, not quite but the spine was the same.

Having said that, I don't remember Barnwell signing any younger players.

Only Hibbitt, Parkin and Richards were there from 1972/3. Palmer was there is 1980 but he wasn't in the 1972/3 side.Hardly a spine. No Dougan, Wagstaffe, Bailey. Munro, McCalle, McCalliog, Sunderland or Daley.

Barnwell didn't sign any younger players, although Gray was hardly old, because we still had some decent youth of our own then.

 

[Flea]

Very interesting read.

The early 80´s economy in England was pretty tough I recon and we were caught in it´s limelight with the building of the now Steve Bull stand.

 

[drewsie]

I was only a kid back then when Barnwell walked out (about 9 or 10). After that the **** really hit the fan! Remember watching ATV Today (Central News) and they were talking to Jimmy Greaves about Wolves going into administration. Looked at my old man and he said “think the Wolves are finished kid”.

Obviously being a kid I couldn’t get my head around it. We had a decent side, won the league cup in 80 and now we’re in ruin.

Infuriates the life out of me now when I come on here or Twitter and see messages, ordering the club to sign players!

The Wolves are in better health now than in any time in our history and it’s a great time to be a fan.

The idiots need to wind their necks in and let a multi-talented & successful Fosun run our club without the hassle they are receiving from said idiots!

 

[Deleted member 5276]

Fond memories of a time when we threatened to be going places... for one season. The rest is history. Glad Barnwell is doing well. It was a huge set back when he had his car accident.

 

[northnorfolkwolf]

Very interesting read.

The early 80´s economy in England was pretty tough I recon and we were caught in it´s limelight with the building of the now Steve Bull stand.

It was a very good insight and a sad reflection on those running the club at the time. Was it all down simply to the building and financing of the Steve Bull that brought on the 80s woes or was there more to it?

 

[WolfLing]

An interesting read.

Basically, our whole demise in the 80s was brought on by an unstable economy and high inflation/interest rates.

Hopefully Brexit goes smoothly and wider economic forces don't derail our current comeback!

 

[Shergar]

Great read. “John Barnwell and Richie Barker”
Did Barnwell have a falling out with Richie Barker? They were very much a strong partnership at Wolves but he makes no mention of Barker. Barker kept things going whilst Barnwell recovered from his accident.

 

[The Professional]

I was only a kid back then when Barnwell walked out (about 9 or 10). After that the **** really hit the fan! Remember watching ATV Today (Central News) and they were talking to Jimmy Greaves about Wolves going into administration. Looked at my old man and he said “think the Wolves are finished kid”.

Obviously being a kid I couldn’t get my head around it. We had a decent side, won the league cup in 80 and now we’re in ruin.

Infuriates the life out of me now when I come on here or Twitter and see messages, ordering the club to sign players!

The Wolves are in better health now than in any time in our history and it’s a great time to be a fan.

The idiots need to wind their necks in and let a multi-talented & successful Fosun run our club without the hassle they are receiving from said idiots!

Same age as me. When Barnwell left, the club and fans particularly were pretty stunned, and the rot was starting to set in. We offered the job to Alex Ferguson, which of course he turned down although he had affection for the club, and appointed Ian Greaves. We all knew then, we were in for a bumpy ride. Rest is history.

 

[The Professional]

Great read. “John Barnwell and Richie Barker”
Did Barnwell have a falling out with Richie Barker? They were very much a strong partnership at Wolves but he makes no mention of Barker. Barker kept things going whilst Barnwell recovered from his accident.

Wasn’t he very hurt because Barker stayed on for a bit after he left Wolves?

 

[Sampford Wolf]

It seems like a lack of communication was at play with Harry Marshall. With some dishonesty and old fashioned stubbornness thrown in.

If he had admitted to JB that the club was in financial trouble and worked with him instead of sidelining him maybe we wouldn't have signed Andy Gray, kept the money and not gone bankrupt.

 

[Big Nosed Wolf]

It seems like a lack of communication was at play with Harry Marshall. With some dishonesty and old fashioned stubbornness thrown in.

If he had admitted to JB that the club was in financial trouble and worked with him instead of sidelining him maybe we wouldn't have signed Andy Gray, kept the money and not gone bankrupt.

Andy Gray's transfer was paid for by selling Steve Daley to Man City for roughly the same money.

 

[Ian]

EXCLUSIVE: Why I left Wolves - John Barnwell finally tells his story - Wolves Bite

All happened when I was very young. A fascinating interview on the situation in 1980 when Andy Gray was bought and sold.

Makes you glad we are investing in youth and the team and we have an owner with deep pockets.

Ive always been of the view we would have been better off getting in 3 or 4 players instead of using the Steve Daley money to buy Gray..... it was an aging team and we needed new faces.
It struck me as an ego , PR thing by Barnwell and the club at the time and it did certainly get us attention and short term it paid off but Richards had history of injuries, Gray was a physical player that was also going to miss games, Emlyn Hughes was obviously not a long term solution and our two best midfielders were both in the veteran stage....
My biggest disapointment was that Dave Thomas ( who is now sadly blind) never really achieved anything with us as he was a fantastic player.
I think it was a combination of bad decisions and bad luck that led to the decline.

 

[wolfman]

Great manager but not a nice bloke

 

[crocos]

Very interesting stuff to read, that. I remember the day we bought Andy Gray, "the first million pound player" etc, and it seemed we were well on the up. Oh dear ...

 

[Knocker Lite]

The problem with the 1979-81 team was that, Gray aside, it was the 1972/3 team !
Well, not quite but the spine was the same.

Having said that, I don't remember Barnwell signing any younger players.

Correct, the lack of all round strategy through the seventies with everyone aware of each others needs created the slide through the eighties.

 

[Newbridge Wolf]

I’m too young to have been around at the time, but reading into it, it always struck me that Marshall inherited a pretty poor situation from John Ireland who had overseen the gradual decline on and off the field?

The Molineux Street Stand had been condemned after the Safety of Sports Grounds Act in 1975, so it needed replacing. You might argue something more modest could have been built, but at the same you could probably argue that the stand was affordable, but it was the interest rates that killed us, something unforeseeable?

As Barnwell mentioned, the youth system didn’t really exist any more, so again from the highs of the 50’s, it wasn’t something he couldn’t be held responsible for to have suddenly inherited it.

Also read that there was a lot of politics going on in the boardroom that he was constantly fighting against.

Interesting to note he never stopped watching us as a fan, right up to his death.

 

[Sampford Wolf]

Andy Gray's transfer was paid for by selling Steve Daley to Man City for roughly the same money.

Yes it was and that is how barnwell viewed it and how I remember it, though I was only nine, but with the benefit of hindsight they should have used the Daley money to pay off the stand.

 

[Big Nosed Wolf]

Yes it was and that is how barnwell viewed it and how I remember it, though I was only nine, but with the benefit of hindsight they should have used the Daley money to pay off the stand.

No. There was a loose policy that transfers had to be funded by sales. Without selling Daley there would have been no Gray and therefore no spare to pay off anything. Bob Hazel was sold to QPR in 1979 and Emlyn Hughes and Dave Thomas came in. It wasn't exactly the same in coming v outgoing but it was a near as damn it.

 

[Big Nosed Wolf]

Just on the Youth policy it's true the decline was there when Barnwell came but in 1976 the Youth team had played in the FA Youth Cup final and lost to Albion over 2 legs 5-0.

There was still much to work with though in 1979.

 

[ricki herberts moustache]

It was a very good insight and a sad reflection on those running the club at the time. Was it all down simply to the building and financing of the Steve Bull that brought on the 80s woes or was there more to it?

Building the John Ireland stand definitely played a major role in Wolves careering towards bankruptcy in the summer of 1982 but I dare say that was just one symptom of a bigger illness affecting the club at the time

Don't forget the big money splashed out on Andy Gray then too: huge for it's time

 

[Saltyjim]

Yes but the Andy Gray signing was more or less paid for by Man City signing Steve Daley. The economic downturn was massive at the start of the 80's and we were saddled with the interest on the John Ireland stand. I remember Peter Reid saying that he was all ready to be signed after Dave Thomas but Wolves hadn't got the money so he ended up at Everton instead.

 

[Deleted member 5276]

Ive always been of the view we would have been better off getting in 3 or 4 players instead of using the Steve Daley money to buy Gray..... it was an aging team and we needed new faces.
It struck me as an ego , PR thing by Barnwell and the club at the time and it did certainly get us attention and short term it paid off but Richards had history of injuries, Gray was a physical player that was also going to miss games, Emlyn Hughes was obviously not a long term solution and our two best midfielders were both in the veteran stage....
My biggest disapointment was that Dave Thomas ( who is now sadly blind) never really achieved anything with us as he was a fantastic player.
I think it was a combination of bad decisions and bad luck that led to the decline.

Very easy to say in hindsight but without Gray, I very much doubt we'd have achieved our highest position in years and winning the League Cup.

We showed ambition back then coupled with being linked to Platini and Reid. Unfortunately the decision to build the new stand to replace the decrepit Mol. St stand was the one that caused us financial chaos. If you look at what Marshall did, was it really any different to what Ridsdale did at Leeds years later?

Again, it's easy to blame Marshall but he was a fan of the club and had everything gone well, he'd have been seen as a hero. As it was, we won our last real trophy during that period and then we all know the rest.

I absolutely agree with you in regard to Thomas. He was a fantastic player for Everton and I was really pleased we got him. I still remember his debut when we beat Man Utd in the home opener that season. Sadly it didn't work out in the long run but we did have a good side playing some attractive winning football.

 

[Jamwolf]

Apart from it's distance to the pitch, that stand has served us well for 40 years.