Expectations and general negativity

[Bob Wolf]

Been noticing a lot of negativity regarding how we have been playing for the last few months - I think the last good (exciting) performance was against Spurs just prior to lock down. I agree that we have been a hard watch over the last few months and sometimes very frustrating.

I try to think of myself as a balanced supporter (my nappy is neither too full or empty at anyone time) but I have to think that we are in danger of losing the special bond/atmosphere that Nuno has generated since he took charge. This season is going to be one of transition combined with recovery from the monumental effort from last year. I think we need to bear the following in mind before being too critical and risk fans upsetting the apple cart:
1) The style is changing because Nuno wants to take the team forwards. This itself means that he and the ownership have ambition to take the club further than just being premier league also rans.
2) We have a clear transfer strategy regarding purchasing talented young players prior to them getting on the radar of the likes of untied and city. Whether this will be successful is yet to be seen, but at least we do have a plan. Again suggesting that there is forward thinking and a long term vision.
3) Despite the poor performances, new players, no pre-season (something that is very important to Nuno’s teams) and trying to implement a new system we have made a better start to the season than last year.

So in summary my feelings are that we weren’t going to get where we want to be doing the same thing as the last two seasons and I’m glad that nuno has the balls to gamble. Dreaming is for free - so can everyone just grow a pair, suck it up for a season, support the team and just be grateful for what we have.

 

[Deleted member 9788]

Been noticing a lot of negativity regarding how we have been playing for the last few months - I think the last good (exciting) performance was against Spurs just prior to lock down. I agree that we have been a hard watch over the last few months and sometimes very frustrating.

I try to think of myself as a balanced supporter (my nappy is neither too full or empty at anyone time) but I have to think that we are in danger of losing the special bond/atmosphere that Nuno has generated since he took charge. This season is going to be one of transition combined with recovery from the monumental effort from last year. I think we need to bear the following in mind before being too critical and risk fans upsetting the apple cart:
1) The style is changing because Nuno wants to take the team forwards. This itself means that he and the ownership have ambition to take the club further than just being premier league also rans.
2) We have a clear transfer strategy regarding purchasing talented young players prior to them getting on the radar of the likes of untied and city. Whether this will be successful is yet to be seen, but at least we do have a plan. Again suggesting that there is forward thinking and a long term vision.
3) Despite the poor performances, new players, no pre-season (something that is very important to Nuno’s teams) and trying to implement a new system we have made a better start to the season than last year.

So in summary my feelings are that we weren’t going to get where we want to be doing the same thing as the last two seasons and I’m glad that nuno has the balls to gamble. Dreaming is for free - so can everyone just grow a pair, suck it up for a season, support the team and just be grateful for what we have.

Everton performance was pretty good

 

[Bob Wolf]

Everton performance was pretty good

Fair enough - you get the idea though.

 

[Tezthewolvesfan]

Negativity on here is pushing people away. I tend to ignore the match day thread.

 

[Deleted member 11332]

The lack of pre season coupled with a fair amount of turbulence to a settle team can't be understated, think we will take a few months to really get going but there are signs, for 20 minutes tonight we looked like scoring every time we went forward. This is the best Wolves team I've seen in my lifetime and Nuno has earned our trust, there's a lot more rope before our fans upset the apple cart with that man personally. He's adored.

 

[Hawkguy]

Match day threads are generally going to be negative unless you're crushing the opposition. This happens in all sports on all forums.

Constant negativity outside the match day threads are where the problem lies. But there's also an realism issue with being too positive as well.

Blind positivity is what makes us cream our pants over Adam Le Fondre coming in instead of Ruben Neves or Rui Patricio or Nelson Semedo. Constant negativity is thinking that we aren't spending enough after a huge transfer window like we just had.

 

[Stoichkov]

I’ve just stopped reading around matches on here and wolves on Twitter

Life is much nicer

 

[nomadwolf]

Our best ever 5 game start to the Premier League.

 

[John de Wolf's hairdryer]

Our best ever 5 game start to the Premier League.

Agreed, and I love it, but it isn't exactly a spectacularly high hurdle for us to have cleared when you think about our previous six attempts at the EPL, with only 2018-19 being particularly creditable over the first five fixtures (but even then there were still only two wins in that little run). Although I hate to say it, Villa's start to the season is quite a bit more impressive than any run we've achieved in the EPL to date...we've yet to notch four wins on the trot in the EPL at any stage, never mind in the first four outings to a season.

 

[sedgwolf1980]

The other point not mentioned is that we were ‘told’ before Nuno joined us what he was like, in terms of being pragmatic and defensive. The season in the champ hid that as our players were simply so much more talented than everyone else.

Given what he has achieved so far, and where he clearly thinks he can take us, im more than ok with that. Would be nice to see us play a full 90 how we started versus Sheffield and how we played for the first 30mins of the second half last night, however I guess that’s broadly what Nuno is trying to achieve through this transition.

Whichever way you cut it, the man clearly, clearly knows what he is doing.

 

[GeoffPalmersLeftBoot]

Agreed, and I love it, but it isn't exactly a spectacularly high hurdle for us to have cleared when you think about our previous six attempts at the EPL, with only 2018-19 being particularly creditable over the first five fixtures (but even then there were still only two wins in that little run). Although I hate to say it, Villa's start to the season is quite a bit more impressive than any run we've achieved in the EPL to date...we've yet to notch four wins on the trot in the EPL at any stage, never mind in the first four outings to a season.

Don’t worry, Villa will run out of steam and will be found wanting, big style.

 

[reanswolf]

Personally I don't see any evolving style. A team that only has 25-30% possession is not going to thrive long-term.

It doesnt mean i am negative, just because I feel there are unaddressed issues that stood out last season towards the end.

But...........in Nuno I trust despite seeing things that way.

 

[topcat99]

We are suffering from the lack of fans. Many teams are.

The negativity is partially to do with the general situation in the world in my opinion.

Still, 9 points and beating “the best team ever to be promoted, with the greatest manager since God” has cheered me up no end!

 

[JadeWolf]

Negativity always finds a place on here. The first season I was on here, was the year Nuno took us up with 99 points. We lost a couple of games early spring, our lead at the top was cut to about 7 points, and someone started a thread called “would you take a play off place”.

 

[WW1963]

Negativity on here is pushing people away. I tend to ignore the match day thread.

It was a nightmare last night. I thought I was on westbrom.com for most of it.

 

[Mutchy]

The negativity goes over the top. Some are genuine, some are definitely looking to push buttons, and god knows for others. It doesn't do anything for the forum.
However, the other side of the coin is that the posters who cannot wait to attack, bait, belittle, ridicule, are doing nothing for the forum either.
We had a good victory last night and the atmosphere on here is still horrible. Both sides are playing a part in that.

 

[rincewind]

Negativity always finds a place on here. The first season I was on here, was the year Nuno took us up with 99 points. We lost a couple of games early spring, our lead at the top was cut to about 7 points, and someone started a thread called “would you take a play off place”.

Sadly I can't stand the match thread anymore. After 3 years people are still complaining that we're not dominating possession. Its like they've never seen us play before.
Hopefully it will improve if Nuno ever gets his new possession based style going.

 

[Darvo]

The negativity goes over the top. Some are genuine, some are definitely looking to push buttons, and god knows for others. It doesn't do anything for the forum.
However, the other side of the coin is that the posters who cannot wait to attack, bait, belittle, ridicule, are doing nothing for the forum either.
We had a good victory last night and the atmosphere on here is still horrible. Both sides are playing a part in that.

Well said @Mutchy ... sums it all up very well.

Unfortunately, I think that it is not just on here but symptomatic of internet ‘debate’. People just don’t behave like they do face to face and there is far too much petty squabbling / point scoring (hands up ... I’m as guilty as others at times). I’ve been reading The Mix for a long time now and this is the first time that I’ve become a bit tired of it.

I’ve even dreamed of a Mol Mix 2 where strict moderation allowing reasoned debate only is born.

 

[VancouverWolf]

Well I for one have no idea where normal fan discussion of a game and reasonable criticism strays into the ’negative’ spectrum.
Its not like anyone on here are suggesting slashing tires or throwing molotives at Compton.
Far from it.
Chill....we don’t all have to agree on a game or be admonished for it.
The Mix has a HUGE welcome mat out in front for all Wolves fans and unless I’m wrong, all polite dissenting opinions are acceptable.

Are we exaggerating a bit of normal criticism too harshly and inaccurately labeling it as ‘negative’ ?

 

[reanswolf]

Well I for one have no idea where normal fan discussion of a game and reasonable criticism strays into the ’negative’ spectrum.
Its not like anyone on here are suggesting slashing tires or throwing molotives at Compton. Far from it.
Chill....we don’t all have to agree on a game or be admonished for it.
The Mix has a HUGE welcome mat out in front for all Wolves fans and unless I’m wrong, all polite dissenting opinions are acceptable.

Well said...........its as though you are not allowed to highlight issues you feel exist.

It doesnt mean that you are disloyal, impatient, or bipolar, just that you might feel strongly about a specific issue.

I know fully well how lucky we are to have Fosun and Nuno, and teh midfield issue is the only issue I have highligted as a serious concern for me, in a few years.

 

[GuzzWolf]

The other point not mentioned is that we were ‘told’ before Nuno joined us what he was like, in terms of being pragmatic and defensive. The season in the champ hid that as our players were simply so much more talented than everyone else.

Given what he has achieved so far, and where he clearly thinks he can take us, im more than ok with that. Would be nice to see us play a full 90 how we started versus Sheffield and how we played for the first 30mins of the second half last night, however I guess that’s broadly what Nuno is trying to achieve through this transition.

Whichever way you cut it, the man clearly, clearly knows what he is doing.

So as we improve we may well become the attacking side we were in the Championship? And I'm here now watching it no matter what.

 

[Tojo the grass]

Performances have been frustrating in recent months but there are plenty of mitigating factors as previously discussed.

We have got nine points from the first five games which is a very decent start and now go into a period where Nuno can finally start to work with his team and decide how he wants to use the new signings.

I expect performances to start improve as we develop relationships and new ways of playing.

We don’t have the crippling schedule that we had last season so we should be able to find our rhythm and get some good runs going.

 

[AndyWolves]

Hopefully Nuno will get some decent amount of uninterrupted time with the lads on the training pitch between now and Christmas.

It's all been a bit stop / start with international breaks and new signings needing to bed in.

Leeds was our last pre-season game and now the season starts for real

 

[Flea]

I think it is perfectly okay to be able to see both side of the coin and having more than one idea at a time.
It is almost never pure black or white..the normal condition is a shade of grey.
We won against Leeds?..Great.
Overall we didn´t play particulary well?..Not that great.

A shade of grey.

 

[Oh When the Wolves]

Well said...........its as though you are not allowed to highlight issues you feel exist.

It doesnt mean that you are disloyal, impatient, or bipolar, just that you might feel strongly about a specific issue.

I know fully well how lucky we are to have Fosun and Nuno, and teh midfield issue is the only issue I have highligted as a serious concern for me, in a few years.

posts like yours aren’t negative as such, just debating how we can improve - which is the sort of stuff you want

it’s the tiresome posts of joswolf and northnkrfolkwolf where when you open a thread you can predict what negativity will come out of them. I don’t think I have ever seen a positive post between the pair of them.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Don’t worry, Villa will run out of steam and will be found wanting, big style.

I wouldn't be surprised if the same happened to Leeds.

 

[Pessimistic Wolf]

It's a strange situation we find ourselves in, almost certainly exacerbated by Covid and closed stadia.

We started the post-lockdown period of last season well, with some impressive wins over West Ham and Everton, as well as beating Olympiakos to reach the quarter finals of the Europa League. The fact that we lost to Seville (even if they were better than us and went on to win the tournament), and petered away to a lower finish than initially expected perhaps sucked a bit of optimism and joviality out of the club.

We lost Jota and Doherty. On a footballing level, this hasn't been too devastating I don't think, but they were popular figures and contributed to the way we identify with Wolves. They were both with us from the Championship and created some great memories.

Despite a good points total so far this season, we have been quite unremarkable, and the 4-0 loss to West Ham was very difficult to take. We have a lot of new players who are bedding in, and with whom we are not familiar.

This has actually been a very busy period with a lot of change. The absence of a pre-season, the quick turnaround between seasons and the fact that we're not at Molineux to see our new players makes me think that, as a fanbase, we are still processing the change. We haven't had the chance to make peace with the idea that we're not the dynamic, counter-attacking upstarts that terrified the big boys but never truly threatened breaking into the top 4.

It's also really not clear what the expectations are for this season. It's hard to make sense of the fact that signing a striker for £35M isn't going to have an immediate impact on our first team performances. That's not a criticism of the signing, but it's a reality that we have to adjust to now, and the club is going in a direction that it hasn't gone in before.

Fan responses will level out as we learn more about these new players and this new identity, for better or worse. Right now, the way we engage with the club is in flux.

 

[Werewolf of Wombourne]

As a set of supporters we are renowned for negativity, how many times have we heard it said about us that if you could keep our team quiet for the first 15 minutes we would start getting on their backs. It's improved in the last 3 seasons obviously but it's never far away. You just know that if Nuno does successfully implement a possession style of play you'll hear loads of shouts of 'stop p*****g about with it , gerrit forward'

 

[WolfInSheep'sClothing]

Criticism is fine. As is criticism of criticism.
And I do think that some of you guys are guilty of minimising what we have done the last couple of years. Haven't quite broken into the top 6, but 7th twice, uefa quarters, an FA Cup semi final; throw it all in the bin because villa have signed Ross Barkley and won 4 games in a row.
And all the "If you don't include all the games where we played well, we haven't played well since October 1992" sort of criticism is starting to get on my tits too. IMO west ham and Chelsea are the only games we played badly in since lockdown.
Appreciate what we have, because these are the good times.

 

[Stourport wolf]

We are 6th in the Premier League, in 2nd gear.

 

[Westbakejazz]

Match day threads are generally going to be negative unless you're crushing the opposition. This happens in all sports on all forums.

Constant negativity outside the match day threads are where the problem lies. But there's also an realism issue with being too positive as well.

Blind positivity is what makes us cream our pants over Adam Le Fondre coming in instead of Ruben Neves or Rui Patricio or Nelson Semedo. Constant negativity is thinking that we aren't spending enough after a huge transfer window like we just had.

We haven’t spent anything so far . I believe we are around 5 million in credit

 

[reanswolf]

posts like yours aren’t negative as such, just debating how we can improve - which is the sort of stuff you want

it’s the tiresome posts of joswolf and northnkrfolkwolf where when you open a thread you can predict what negativity will come out of them. I don’t think I have ever seen a positive post between the pair of them.

Thank you , I am aware that when I feel passionately about something I won't let it go, so it sounds negative but its only because I am desperate for us to make the most of the situation.

After Seville everyone (neutrals as well) were saying Wolves need to do something about midfield, or where are Wolves midfield. I thought that game made it blatantly obvious where we needed to upgrade to move forward.

Here I go again..................anyway I worship Nuno and desperately want him to shove my views up my derriere.

 

[Direwolf]

I am very happy with some of our play and happy with most of our results (except West Ham of course but they were due a win). As for our league position very healthy indeed. We are evolving I expect us to improve as we play more and overall it is very much a time for optimism.

 

[JonahWolf]

Personally I don't see any evolving style. A team that only has 25-30% possession is not going to thrive long-term.

It doesnt mean i am negative, just because I feel there are unaddressed issues that stood out last season towards the end.

But...........in Nuno I trust despite seeing things that way.

Isn't it?

I give you: Atletico Madrid, Leicester. 2 teams that upset the cartel to win a title playing on the counter with very little possession.

Nuno still says he wants to move away from that, but it’s not like it can’t be effective. Yanited’s run last season was just counter, as is the much lauded ‘new and improved Arsenal’.

 

[Axle]

The other point not mentioned is that we were ‘told’ before Nuno joined us what he was like, in terms of being pragmatic and defensive. The season in the champ hid that as our players were simply so much more talented than everyone else.

Given what he has achieved so far, and where he clearly thinks he can take us, im more than ok with that. Would be nice to see us play a full 90 how we started versus Sheffield and how we played for the first 30mins of the second half last night, however I guess that’s broadly what Nuno is trying to achieve through this transition.

Whichever way you cut it, the man clearly, clearly knows what he is doing.

I think that the lack of being able to do this for 70 minutes is likely to be due to not having time with the players on the training ground.

Semedo will come good and he will be one of our best signings when he is integrated into the team.

 

[Bill S Preston Esq.]

Well I for one have no idea where normal fan discussion of a game and reasonable criticism strays into the ’negative’ spectrum.
Its not like anyone on here are suggesting slashing tires or throwing molotives at Compton.
Far from it.
Chill....we don’t all have to agree on a game or be admonished for it.
The Mix has a HUGE welcome mat out in front for all Wolves fans and unless I’m wrong, all polite dissenting opinions are acceptable.

Are we exaggerating a bit of normal criticism too harshly and inaccurately labeling it as ‘negative’ ?

Come on man, there's one poster that seems to have negative threads ready to go. He normally waits 45 minutes to post it though......

Maybe, just maybe they should wait until a match is over. It would certainly help in providing a more balanced view.

 

[reanswolf]

Isn't it?

I give you: Atletico Madrid, Leicester. 2 teams that upset the cartel to win a title playing on the counter with very little possession.

Nuno still says he wants to move away from that, but it’s not like it can’t be effective. Yanited’s run last season was just counter, as is the much lauded ‘new and improved Arsenal’.

Both Arsenal and Manure have only improved since the introduction of better CMs.

 

[JonahWolf]

Both Arsenal and Manure have only improved since the introduction of better CMs.

Fernandes helped United, no doubt. He mostly helped them win and convert penalties, and provide the quality to construct fast effective counters more often. They’ve bought a new midfielder but hardly play him.

Arsenal have bought a star new defensive midfielder, he’s barely played. The only differences between how Arsenal are playing now and how we have for the first 2 years is they knock the ball around at the back rather than let the opposition have the ball, and they have Aubemeyang to get more regular success out of counters.

Cmon man, must try harder. Citeh, Leicester, Everton, and Brighton are probably the only teams consistently trying to play possession based, attacking football atm.
Liverpool are still far more likely to score from high turnovers due to the relentless press than they are a sustained possession move.
It’s a difficult style to play.

 

[sillytuna]

Not being at games doesn't help, nor does the entire situation. Being at matches is all about emotion and right now none of us has that release.

I also think some woefully underestimate the effect last season and the situ has on our players. You can tell Nuno is very down about it.

Doesn't help that we have idiotic internationals going on when top teams had no rest or preseason.

 

[reanswolf]

Fernandes helped United, no doubt. He mostly helped them win and convert penalties, and provide the quality to construct fast effective counters more often. They’ve bought a new midfielder but hardly play him.

Arsenal have bought a star new defensive midfielder, he’s barely played. The only differences between how Arsenal are playing now and how we have for the first 2 years is they knock the ball around at the back rather than let the opposition have the ball, and they have Aubemeyang to get more regular success out of counters.

Cmon man, must try harder. Citeh, Leicester, Everton, and Brighton are probably the only teams consistently trying to play possession based, attacking football atm.
Liverpool are still far more likely to score from high turnovers due to the relentless press than they are a sustained possession move.
It’s a difficult style to play.

I'm not the one saying we are trying to play more possession-based football, its Nuno. 30% is still a low % and we will be put to the sword by teams with better finishing.

Arteta has made Arsenal much better defensively but still place sgreat emphasis on getting forward quickly. Ceballos is starting to thrive and even Xhaka is playing as a great defensive CM, with Saka and Pepe thriving and attacking well.