11 August 2020 - our peak

[wwbug]

Since that match with Sevilla we have been on a continuous downward trend.
It takes hindsight to see it but Fosun trajectory was upwards until that date.
All our issues stem from not kicking on and strengthening the team.
Something drastic needs to change now or it will probably be relegation within a few years.
Originally I hoped Bruno was to have a large hand in restructuring next year, but having read about his meagre salary, and seeing Scott Sellars elevated I am not sure of Fosuns plans.
Added to our recent performances I fear for our future more than I have hope. The players seem uninterested .

 

[Contrarian]

That was after our capitulation in the post-lockdown run-in? I think our peak was probably the 3-2 win against City 8 months before.

 

[Hoganstolemywife]

The one main thing I take from that is how mental it was for a season to still be going in August!

 

[TheConcourse]

Since that match with Sevilla we have been on a continuous downward trend.
It takes hindsight to see it but Fosun trajectory was upwards until that date.
All our issues stem from not kicking on and strengthening the team.
Something drastic needs to change now or it will probably be relegation within a few years.
Originally I hoped Bruno was to have a large hand in restructuring next year, but having read about his meagre salary, and seeing Scott Sellars elevated I am not sure of Fosuns plans.
Added to our recent performances I fear for our future more than I have hope.

I’d argue we were very fortunate to beat Olympiakos tbh, but I get the sentiment. Nuno knew that we couldn’t open up. He knew what we needed after Sevilla. Jeff didn’t listen. We don’t pay the money for quality CB’s, so instead of gambling we play deep.

Jeff isn’t a football man.

 

[Chris H]

That was after our capitulation in the post-lockdown run-in? I think our peak was probably the 3-2 win against City 8 months before.

Nah, 3-2 win away at Spurs just before lockdown I’d say.

A dull 0-0 vs Brighton was a bit of a dampener before everything stopped. How we’d take that right now!

 

[Perton Wolf]

FOSUN have done fantastic overall but they aren't the ones to take us to the next level. They'll be more than content with having us midtable in the Prem while investing little. Only fresh ownership will give us the investment we need to progress the squad.

Yes, I understand this is much better than what we've experienced in previous years but it's hard to justify forever increasing ticket prices when there's an ever decreasing investment in the squad, as well as extremely dull football on display. Eventually, something will have to give. They're taking the fans for granted at this point.

 

[Jawwfc]

FOSUN have done fantastic overall but they aren't the ones to take us to the next level. They'll be more than content with having us midtable in the Prem while investing little. Only fresh ownership will give us the investment we need to progress the squad.

Yes, I understand this is much better than what we've experienced in previous years but it's hard to justify forever increasing ticket prices when there's an ever decreasing investment in the squad, as well as extremely dull football on display. Eventually, something will have to give. They're taking the fans for granted at this point.

Fans are always the first to suffer, unfortunately the Premier League is the same regardless of what club it is, the Premier League is a product in itself, we tend to always have 20000ish if we are in the championship add in the Premier League and we now have a waiting list for season tickets and sell out every game, I don't remember seeing any vloggers or samosa sales when we were mid table championship fodder.

 

[wwbug]

FOSUN have done fantastic overall but they aren't the ones to take us to the next level. They'll be more than content with having us midtable in the Prem while investing little. Only fresh ownership will give us the investment we need to progress the squad.

Yes, I understand this is much better than what we've experienced in previous years but it's hard to justify forever increasing ticket prices when there's an ever decreasing investment in the squad, as well as extremely dull football on display. Eventually, something will have to give. They're taking the fans for granted at this point.

But can you aim to be mid table , such an aim could easily lead to relegation.

 

[Contrarian]

Nah, 3-2 win away at Spurs just before lockdown I’d say.

A dull 0-0 vs Brighton was a bit of a dampener before everything stopped. How we’d take that right now!

Yes, that Spurs match is the other contender. Though only just over 2 months after the City match. That period in general was definitely our peak. We never looked the same after lockdown. So that was the final 1/3 of that season and all of last season in decline. At times, it looked like that had reversed this season.

What's concerning about today especially (as well as the previous 2 matches) is not that it's some radical new departure, but that we are playing much the same as the worst times of that post-lockdown time. Again,though, is it any surprise they play the same way, when we take to the field often with 9, even 10 of exactly the same players who played last season?

 

[Chris H]

Yes, that Spurs match is the other contender. Though only just over 2 months after the City match. That period in general was definitely our peak. We never looked the same after lockdown. So that was the final 1/3 of that season and all of last season in decline. At times, it looked like that had reversed this season.

What's concerning about today especially (as well as the previous 2 matches) is not that it's some radical new departure, but that we are playing much the same as the worst times of that post-lockdown time. Again,though, is it any surprise they play the same way, when we take to the field often with 9, even 10 of exactly the same players who played last season?

Todays game was almost a carbon copy of Burnley last season, and as you say performances aren’t exactly drastically different to any point since lockdown.

Every 3 years a squad needs a refresh, I’m sure Ferguson used to say that and you’d reckon he knew what he was taking about. It concerns me Lage is saying the bulk of this squad will remain in the summer. A large chunk of the core will have been here over 4 years and it looks stale.

Add to that we’ve lost our identity, which was likely to happen with a transition but we don’t appear to be becoming anything else, we’re just a bit nothing in style. Not helped by not changing the squad too.

I’m not usually that reactionary but I am starting to worry that without a big summer we could be in trouble next season. We’re exactly the sort of club right now that comes in to the PL new and fresh and then stalls, drifts and falls away again.

 

[wwbug]

The project .
Everyone needs a common goal. It’s not just one match at a time. It’s one step towards your goal at a time.
What the **** is our goal , because I don’t know and more importantly it looks like the players dont.

 

[Cookyssweetleftfoot]

The second half of our first season back in the Premier takes some beating for me.
After moving to 2 up top I think Jota and Jimenez were generally excellent in the run in and the addition of Donk in midfield stopped Neves and Moutinho being overrun.
We finished that season strongly to get into Europe and should have made the cup final too.
An upgrade on Donk would have improved us further in my opinion.

 

[WV4 Wolves]

I think the F.A. cup quarter final against Man U was the peak.

The season after was when we started playing for one half of the games to save energy.

 

[Alex Rae The Substitute]

Another way of looking at: Would you rather our current squad or the squad we had at that point?

 

[I'm the Wanderer]

I said a week ago that our peak was 1 second before Raul's penalty was blocked in Europe.

 

[sedgwolf1980]

We were an upgrade to Donk and Saiss away from being genuine top 6 quality.

Maybe I’m naive but I still say covid and the wider political situation have killed us way more than any other factor.

The most Wolves thing ever to be on the cusp of greatness and have it scuppered by a global pandemic.

 

[marrs-guitar]

We were an upgrade to Donk and Saiss away from being genuine top 6 quality.

Maybe I’m naive but I still say covid and the wider political situation have killed us way more than any other factor.

The most Wolves thing ever to be on the cusp of greatness and have it scuppered by a global pandemic.

Yep, the lockdown killed the club's momentum, when you look at where we were in the league and how Spurs and Man Utd had substantial injury problems that were granted time to heal through the lockdown.

Even had we eventually drawn Sevilla in Europe, over two legs and the prospect of a packed Molineux, we would have knocked them out imo, and had every chance of the top 6, even top 5.

I don't know what players exactly had COVID-19 (Coady confirmed he had, I think Boly is confirmed as a long covid case), but after the adrenaline of the first couple of games we largely looked exhausted after the break, even though we had weeks off.

 

[KnowNuttin]

I think the 2-3 Spurs wins before lockdown was the last proper Nuno performance. It all seemed to go tits up as soon as Covid hit. Before Covid, we'd go in against anybody with a belief we could get summat, even if we went behind. But he/we lost our mojo as soon as the fans were locked out and we've never really got it back.

Unfortunately, we're now a pale shadow of the pre covid team.

 

[Deak77]

Selling Jota and replacing him with a kid was the issue that still has us hamstrung to this day, along with selling Doherty and replacing him with a bloke who cost £27m but offers less than 10% of his productivity. I don't dislike Semedo, but thats the truth.

Look back at everything that has happened since August 2020 and tell me that I'm wrong.

People on Twitter and other platforms today saying that Fabio was our best player, yet he can't even get a shot off, and constantly makes the wrong decisions when in posession.

We've gone from Jota, peak Adama and peak Raul to Fabio, Hwang/Trincao and a shadow of Raul, and people wonder why we're not scoring goals, the reasons are right there in front of us

Without significant investment this summer we're in the **** next season, no 2 ways about it.

 

[Deak77]

I think the 2-3 Spurs wins before lockdown was the last proper Nuno performance. It all seemed to go tits up as soon as Covid hit. Before Covid, we'd go in against anybody with a belief we could get summat, even if we went behind. But he/we lost our mojo as soon as the fans were locked out and we've never really got it back.

Unfortunately, we're now a pale shadow of the pre covid team.

This seems a popular misconception, but we won 5 out of 9 post lockdown league games,losing against Arsenal, Chelsea and Sheff Utd and being robbed against Burnley.

The real problems started with the Autumn 2020 rebuild, we've been nowhere near the same since.

 

[Stoichkov]

Since that match with Sevilla we have been on a continuous downward trend.
It takes hindsight to see it but Fosun trajectory was upwards until that date.
All our issues stem from not kicking on and strengthening the team.
Something drastic needs to change now or it will probably be relegation within a few years.
Originally I hoped Bruno was to have a large hand in restructuring next year, but having read about his meagre salary, and seeing Scott Sellars elevated I am not sure of Fosuns plans.
Added to our recent performances I fear for our future more than I have hope. The players seem uninterested .

Finished 14th last season, now 8th

But yeah

 

[reanswolf]

We were an upgrade to Donk and Saiss away from being genuine top 6 quality.

Maybe I’m naive but I still say covid and the wider political situation have killed us way more than any other factor.

The most Wolves thing ever to be on the cusp of greatness and have it scuppered by a global pandemic.

Bang on.

The summer after Seville was the time to upgrade Donk and Saiss - a more mobile centre midfielder and a CB.

Instead we spent £28m on another wing back and £35m on a youngster. I got hung out to dry on here for deflaming our transfer policy at that point, but incredibly it has been allowed to fester ever since with neither position upgraded. Quite incredible in the scheme of things.

We were indeed that close to becoming a top 6 side, we clearly had the finances but royally ****ed up in a way only Wolves could do.

 

[Matt]

Selling Jota and replacing him with a kid was the issue that still has us hamstrung to this day, along with selling Doherty and replacing him with a bloke who cost £27m but offers less than 10% of his productivity. I don't dislike Semedo, but thats the truth.

Look back at everything that has happened since August 2020 and tell me that I'm wrong.

People on Twitter and other platforms today saying that Fabio was our best player, yet he can't even get a shot off, and constantly makes the wrong decisions when in posession.

We've gone from Jota, peak Adama and peak Raul to Fabio, Hwang/Trincao and a shadow of Raul, and people wonder why we're not scoring goals, the reasons are right there in front of us

Without significant investment this summer we're in the **** next season, no 2 ways about it.

Agree 100%. We sold two of our top scorers for a combined £57m and replaced them with two players who, while I rate them both, don’t offer anywhere near the same output for a combined £62m.

We will be starting next season on the back of relegation form at the end of this season, without serious investment we will be fighting down there imo. We can’t expect Sa to get us so many points again next year.

 

[Contrarian]

Agree 100%. We sold two of our top scorers for a combined £57m and replaced them with two players who, while I rate them both, don’t offer anywhere near the same output for a combined £62m.

We will be starting next season on the back of relegation form at the end of this season, without serious investment we will be fighting down there imo. We can’t expect Sa to get us so many points again next year.

Yes, when you put it like that, it is clear. Seems to me that many don't take actual player quality into account. They see the fees and subconsciously assume it *must* be a like-for-like replacement. And if things don't work out, the goals dry up, for example, they have to produce elaborate explanations that it must be the tactics. Or the manager has lost the dressing room. Or find a single scapegoat and blame him for everything, rather than see it as a couple of seasons of less than stellar transfers.

As for 11 August 2020, the Sevilla match. We played disappointing. Sat back, absorbed pressure with our main chance a penatly from a Traore sprint. We'd played that way many times before - often even won or drew against teams probably technically better than us. It was disappointing but not the end of the world - and I still think we'd have beaten them over 2 legs.

Something else happened very soon after the Sevilla match. How about looking to 5th September 2020 instead? Things have never been the same since that day. The budget gone, occasional fractures in a previously totally united squad and so on.