The Death of Football, R.I.P.

[Ebbo]

Of course. I said VAR is a factor.

I'm a concerned fan at the minute about the future of our club. It might be heat of the moment stuff after a defeat, but I've never seen the number of people claiming they won't renew, claiming they've fallen out of love with football etc. and it's left me worried about what is going to happen with us.

However, VAR seems to be getting most of the blame. As I've pointed out, VAR has been around for a while. It was here for the best time we've had in decades, and we we're still getting done then! It was criticised then, but it was never ever ever stopping this number of people going to games.

As I say, if we're in an FA Cup final, are this number of people claiming they're going to give up season tickets and not watch? Not a chance in a million years.

There's an apathy that has taken over a lot of our fans right now - and I do sympathise. It's deflating watching us get done again and again with ridiculous decisions.

But, in the bigger picture, the major issues for us right now are the club. We need anger not apathy and to target the right things.

Suitable investment into the team, lying about PSR, cheaper ticket prices. These are some of the major problems we have right now and if they're fixed then Wolves fans will get back to feeling a love for the club.

VAR is a tiny symptom of the bigger problems for us. I don't like where we're quickly heading and VAR is covering the problems IMO.

This post misses the point by a million miles. Sorry, but for most of the years i've be supporting Wolves, we've been way worse than we are now. Since my Dad first took me in 1973, we've very rarely been in a better position as a club than we currently are.

VAR is the single biggest factor, making me wonder why we bother. Nothing to do with Fosun.

As ST holders and AST holders, I will probably renew mine and my son will too... but it's far from certain. It's a hard habit to break, but VAR is giving it a go!!

 

[northnorfolkwolf]

Further to my post above I've been reading a bit more about VAR and the Premier League website says the Premier League clubs originally all agreed to the introduction of VAR in 19/20 season. Surely if that is the case then the Premier League clubs can all agree to get rid of it? Wolves fans should make their feelings known to the Club and ensure they vote against the continuation of VAR. Our voice must come first? Those giving up their STs should make it clear, if this is the case, that part of the reason for doing this is VAR.

 

[WeAreTheWolvesII]

This post misses the point by a million miles. Sorry, but for most of the years i've be supported Wolves, we've been way worse than we are now. Since my Dad first took me in 1973, we've very rarely been in a better position as a club than we currently are.

VAR is the single biggest factor, making me wonder why we bother. Nothing to do with Fosun.

As ST holders and AST holders, I will probably renew mine and my son will too... but it's far from certain. It's a hard habit to break, but VAR is giving it a go!!

You can say that but the evidence is on my side in terms of renewals.

As we all know, this is nothing new for Wolves. We had a **** VAR against us in the opening day at Leicester. There was mistake after mistake over the years, but fans would not give up their season tickets.

In the meantime, prices have gone up, the team has gone backwards really, there's no investment from the owners and another bleak summer awaits.

There has to be a tipping point, and perhaps this is it. A ****tail of **** served up to fans, with VAR a part of it.

However, there would not be a 'Death of Football' thread on here if we were in an FA Cup final. There would not be talk of giving up season tickets if we were one game away from Europe and potentially the best day in the lives of the majority of our fans - which is exactly where we should be.

I am repeating my points, so I'll leave it at that. And as I say, I do respect our fans views on it even if they differ to mine, and it does stem from major concern about where we're heading as a football club.

We've had our best times as a club in 40-50 years in a VAR era, let's not forget that.

 

[WeAreTheWolvesII]

Further to my post above I've been reading a bit more about VAR and the Premier League website says the Premier League clubs originally all agreed to the introduction of VAR in 19/20 season. Surely if that is the case then the Premier League clubs can all agree to get rid of it? Wolves fans should make their feelings known to the Club and ensure they vote against the continuation of VAR. Our voice must come first? Those giving up their STs should make it clear, if this is the case, that part of the reason for doing this is VAR.

The clubs won't want to get rid of it.

 

[thetwistedsock]

I've pretty much stayed off here for 24 hours as I made my point early in the thread. My views have not changed. I'm going out on Saturday and will come back and see what our result was. I will not watch any of the last 3 games as I think our injury situation, our league position and VAR make all 3 results pretty much a foregone conclusion. I'm just so disillusioned with it all tbh. I haven't read through all this but I feel I need to write to the people who run VAR and basically say that they are killing the game I've loved and been going to for 60+ years. Does anyone know the address of the organisation I need to write to ? Thanks.

When you find out come back and tell us.

 

[rubyloo]

If you think we are terrible at the moment then you clearly were not arround when Sollbakken and Saunders were taking us down to League One. Or when we had the Chapman brothers and we failed to score at home for months on end. This thread is about VAR and its effects not about us being in poor form which is a regular recurring situation at Wolves over the years that comes and goes.

ok - "terrible" relative to a few months ago, not relative to our darkest depths. My first game at Molineux was in 1970 so i don't need a history lesson thanks.

I know the thread is about VAR, I only mentioned form because another poster brought it up.

 

[northnorfolkwolf]

The clubs won't want to get rid of it.

They would if the fans demanded it/gave up STs. The fans are the life-blood of the Clubs. If fans like BSK and myself give up on the game then that is a really sad day for football.

 

[WeAreTheWolvesII]

They would if the fans demanded it/gave up STs. The fans are the life-blood of the Clubs. If fans like BSK and myself give up on the game then that is a really sad day for football.

They couldn't care one bit, unfortunately, but it is sad.

There's too much money involved for them to accept wrong decisions. Even if VAR isn't perfect, the numbers suggest it gets more right than previously.

 

[Frank Lincoln]

Further to my post above I've been reading a bit more about VAR and the Premier League website says the Premier League clubs originally all agreed to the introduction of VAR in 19/20 season. Surely if that is the case then the Premier League clubs can all agree to get rid of it? Wolves fans should make their feelings known to the Club and ensure they vote against the continuation of VAR. Our voice must come first? Those giving up their STs should make it clear, if this is the case, that part of the reason for doing this is VAR.

One problem regarding the premier league clubs is that even now most managers say they like the idea of VAR, even though they say it does need to be improved. Both David Moyes and Sean Dyche have said similar things in recent weeks. Even our own Gary O‘Neil has said he won’t discuss VAR anymore, and he even said he had sympathy for Stuart Attwell after he had a difficult week.

I believe that the clubs have been told to wind down their comments regarding VAR. Nottingham Forest have done what the Premier League and PGMOL didn’t want anyone to do, they have questioned the integrity of PGMOL officials. But it is no use one club going rogue, it needs a majority of clubs doing so, which I can’t see happening anytime soon.

Meanwhile Mr Webb and his colleagues will continue to be wined and dined in hospitality suites at Premier League matches.

 

[Very Proud (AKA Still Proud)]

I'll say again, the VAR technology is not the problem, it's PGMOL. Feels like they need Janet and John level instructions as they are incapable of interpreting the laws in the context of the game. I've been thinking about it and it's not that hard.

1. You must only bring to the attention of the referee any infringement that he couldn't see e.g. he was looking in another direction and it happened behind him. You should only do this is an outfield player catches the ball, any player lays out another with a haymaker, or Bruno Fernandes is rolling around on the floor crying.
2. A handball is where the player is moving his hand/arm in the direction of the ball and then makes contact with it. The hands are in a natural position if they are outstretched and he is lunging for the ball with his foot, if they are by his side then that is unnatural, even though you may normally run like this its still unnatural for normal people.. Please refer to the silhouettes provided by the football coaches and not the ones provided by referees/PGMOL.
3. If you think an infringement has been committed and the referee has seen it, you are wrong. DO NOT bother the referee with your thoughts on the matter.
4. A pass is made when the ball leaves a player's foot (determined by a gap between the foot and the ball). For avoidance of doubt if the attacking player is ahead of the defender (please ensure there are two defenders between the attacker and the goal line - one may be the goalkeeper), he is onside if the distance between the two is the length of his boot or less (no other part of his body matters to you). You should be able to determine this at one glance (as a linesman used to be instructed to do) and if you feel the need to draw lines then the attacker is onside and you should keep your mouth shut.
5. You are not employed to referee the game, that is the job of the idiot on the pitch dressed in black. If he gives a red or yellow card, that's his decision not your's so but out.
6. If you are in any doubt whatsoever, keep your mouth shut and go and go watch Sesame Street on the other telly, your carer will have the remote.
7. If you are the referee, the idiot at Stockley Park has been determined to have a lower IQ than yourself, that means its okay to ignore his advice even if he asks you to look at his pretty pictures on the telly at the side of the pitch. If you listen to him everyone thinks you're the bigger idiot.

There I think that should sort it......

 

[The Wolf In The North]

They've got a tasty derby with Vulcan coming up.

Niche.

 

[Darvo]

Of course. I said VAR is a factor.

I'm a concerned fan at the minute about the future of our club. It might be heat of the moment stuff after a defeat, but I've never seen the number of people claiming they won't renew, claiming they've fallen out of love with football etc. and it's left me worried about what is going to happen with us.

However, VAR seems to be getting most of the blame. As I've pointed out, VAR has been around for a while. It was here for the best time we've had in decades, and we we're still getting done then! It was criticised then, but it was never ever ever stopping this number of people going to games.

As I say, if we're in an FA Cup final, are this number of people claiming they're going to give up season tickets and not watch? Not a chance in a million years.

There's an apathy that has taken over a lot of our fans right now - and I do sympathise. It's deflating watching us get done again and again with ridiculous decisions.

But, in the bigger picture, the major issues for us right now are the club. We need anger not apathy and to target the right things.

Suitable investment into the team, lying about PSR, cheaper ticket prices. These are some of the major problems we have right now and if they're fixed then Wolves fans will get back to feeling a love for the club.

VAR is a tiny symptom of the bigger problems for us. I don't like where we're quickly heading and VAR is covering the problems IMO.

I don't think you appreciate the depth of feeling and upset / hurt that VAR has caused.

One of my brothers has a season ticket and has had for a very long time. He has now stopped going to matches and will not renew. Let me assure you, it has nothing whatsoever with how Wolves are performing and everything to do with VAR.

The bigger issue here is football ... not Wolves.

 

[surreywolf]

You can say that but the evidence is on my side in terms of renewals.

As we all know, this is nothing new for Wolves. We had a **** VAR against us in the opening day at Leicester. There was mistake after mistake over the years, but fans would not give up their season tickets.

In the meantime, prices have gone up, the team has gone backwards really, there's no investment from the owners and another bleak summer awaits.

There has to be a tipping point, and perhaps this is it. A ****tail of **** served up to fans, with VAR a part of it.

However, there would not be a 'Death of Football' thread on here if we were in an FA Cup final. There would not be talk of giving up season tickets if we were one game away from Europe and potentially the best day in the lives of the majority of our fans - which is exactly where we should be.

I am repeating my points, so I'll leave it at that. And as I say, I do respect our fans views on it even if they differ to mine, and it does stem from major concern about where we're heading as a football club.

We've had our best times as a club in 40-50 years in a VAR era, let's not forget that.

Think you’ve got this badly wrong. There’s always been ups and downs supporting Wolves, but the killer for me at the moment is how we’ve been at the brunt of VAR issues. Full stop.

 

[sedgwolf1980]

Normally agree with a fair bit of what @WeAreTheWolvesII posts, however I don’t think I could do disagree more on this VAR debate.

It also makes me genuinely sad that, as a passionate match going fan, you can be so ambivalent to this monstrosity and what’s it has done to the game.

I haven’t celebrated a goal properly now, in a league game, in nigh on 5 years. That feeling, the feeling, has been stolen away. I don’t understand how every single football fan doesn’t feel exactly the same way.

**** reform, it needs binning, completely and immediately,

 

[Jefe]

I'll say again, the VAR technology is not the problem, it's PGMOL. Feels like they need Janet and John level instructions as they are incapable of interpreting the laws in the context of the game. I've been thinking about it and it's not that hard.

1. You must only bring to the attention of the referee any infringement that he couldn't see e.g. he was looking in another direction and it happened behind him. You should only do this is an outfield player catches the ball, any player lays out another with a haymaker, or Bruno Fernandes is rolling around on the floor crying.
2. A handball is where the player is moving his hand/arm in the direction of the ball and then makes contact with it. The hands are in a natural position if they are outstretched and he is lunging for the ball with his foot, if they are by his side then that is unnatural, even though you may normally run like this its still unnatural for normal people.. Please refer to the silhouettes provided by the football coaches and not the ones provided by referees/PGMOL.
3. If you think an infringement has been committed and the referee has seen it, you are wrong. DO NOT bother the referee with your thoughts on the matter.
4. A pass is made when the ball leaves a player's foot (determined by a gap between the foot and the ball). For avoidance of doubt if the attacking player is ahead of the defender (please ensure there are two defenders between the attacker and the goal line - one may be the goalkeeper), he is onside if the distance between the two is the length of his boot or less (no other part of his body matters to you). You should be able to determine this at one glance (as a linesman used to be instructed to do) and if you feel the need to draw lines then the attacker is onside and you should keep your mouth shut.
5. You are not employed to referee the game, that is the job of the idiot on the pitch dressed in black. If he gives a red or yellow card, that's his decision not your's so but out.
6. If you are in any doubt whatsoever, keep your mouth shut and go and go watch Sesame Street on the other telly, your carer will have the remote.
7. If you are the referee, the idiot at Stockley Park has been determined to have a lower IQ than yourself, that means its okay to ignore his advice even if he asks you to look at his pretty pictures on the telly at the side of the pitch. If you listen to him everyone thinks you're the bigger idiot.

There I think that should sort it......

As sensible as your suggestions are, the, "It's not VAR, it's PGMOL" argument feels like a distinction without a difference. Give a toddler a loaded gun and it won't end well. Give egomaniacs with woeful judgment (and worse common sense) the means to trample all over the game to make themselves centre of attention, and they will. A useful tool in the hands of the wrong person can yield disastrous results, so until the referees improve beyond recognition, then VAR has to be shelved.

 

[Very Proud (AKA Still Proud)]

As sensible as your suggestions are, the, "It's not VAR, it's PGMOL" argument feels like a distinction without a difference. Give a toddler a loaded gun and it won't end well. Give egomaniacs with woeful judgment (and worse common sense) the means to trample all over the game to make themselves centre of attention, and they will. A useful tool in the hands of the wrong person can yield disastrous results, so until the referees improve beyond recognition, then VAR has to be shelved.

Oh I’d a happily bin both. I just don’t want us to forget PGMOL. Their the biggest threat to our game since football hooliganism.

 

[SoCal_Wolf]

As much as I hate it VAR is never going to be removed. It gives broadcasters a whole new topic to discuss and some say arm chair and international audiences love the drama, football has become a video game.

There is absolutely nothing anyone is going to do to change this, nothing.

The big six don't tend to get effected by the decisions, if you are regularly winning games 2 or 3 nil then so what if one gets chalked off due to VAR.

More to the point the big clubs can also afford to loss 5 or 10% of "legacy fans" because there will be plenty of tourists to fill the void, the board casters won't care they can dub crown noise and it won't be long before AI generated crowds can fill an empty stadium for the purposes of tv audiences.

I hate it, I really do. I was going to say it's destroying the game, but it's not what it's doing is morphing the game into something else that "legacy fans" hate but TV loves.

They may knock some of the rough edges off it next season, but it's sill soulless and kills the joy of scoring a goal.

TV fans hate VAR, too. It ruins the flow of the game and believe it or not, we jump up and shout when we score a goal, too! I would much rather watch a game without VAR, than with VAR. Like, not even close. They are making football worse - anytime the referees are the main players and storyline, then the sport is in total shambles. They really, really need to follow the lead of the Swedes and abolish its use - not for corners, not for throw-ins, or red cards - total ban. It's a ****ing joke.

Secondly, and relatedly, the PGMOL needs to address the **** poor reffing. They are all pretty dire. It's rare and surprising when one of them actually refs a good game.

Until the referee quality is much better, then I wouldn't entertain reinstating VAR. And even then, I would only use VAR, for honest-to-goodness howlers. Not for re-refereeing the game. If you have to draw a line for offsides or go to super slo-mo and squint one eye or find 30 different angles to see an infringement, then you're doing it wrong. It's close enough to trust the refs' judgment.

 

[SA Wolf]

They couldn't care one bit, unfortunately, but it is sad.

There's too much money involved for them to accept wrong decisions. Even if VAR isn't perfect, the numbers suggest it gets more right than previously.

Agree with you about clubs not missing fans so much. There is too much money in the game now and fans's direct contributions are minimal compared to TV money, advertising, merchandise etc... However, your point about VAR getting more right than previously! Isn't it minimal? Something light a half percent improvement. A large price to pay for such a small benefit imo.

 

[SA Wolf]

TV fans hate VAR, too. It ruins the flow of the game and believe it or not, we jump up and shout when we score a goal, too! I would much rather watch a game without VAR, than with VAR. Like, not even close. They are making football worse - anytime the referees are the main players and storyline, then the sport is in total shambles. They really, really need to follow the lead of the Swedes and abolish its use - not for corners, not for throw-ins, or red cards - total ban. It's a ****ing joke.

Secondly, and relatedly, the PGMOL needs to address the **** poor reffing. They are all pretty dire. It's rare and surprising when one of them actually refs a good game.

Until the referee quality is much better, then I wouldn't entertain reinstating VAR. And even then, I would only use VAR, for honest-to-goodness howlers. Not for re-refereeing the game. If you have to draw a line for offsides or go to super slo-mo and squint one eye or find 30 different angles to see an infringement, then you're doing it wrong. It's close enough to trust the refs' judgment.

Yep - this! As a TV fan who watches a lot of matches; completely agree with you. I said on another thread, that I now don't cheer goals until I've seen a replay and am fairly confident that everyone is onside and there doesn't appear to be a foul in the build-up. Unfortunately, Hwang's 'goal; on Wednesday threw me as there was no offside, Hwang's header was clean, however, I didn't think the VAR would go back so far as to recommend Cunha be penalised!
I watched the Champo match between QPR and Leeds last night and so nice to be able to cheer the QPR goals without worrying about them being chalked-off by VAR. Similarly, the FA Cup games at stadia below Premier League level, earlier this season.
VAR is slowly killing the game and I'd happily go back to arguing about **** refereeing decisions in the pub, rather than this monstrosity.

 

[Jefe]

The PGMOL needs to address the **** poor reffing. They are all pretty dire. It's rare and surprising when one of them actually refs a good game.

And even when that happens, it's more because the game mercifully didn't give them a major decision to make, than it was a display of competence.

 

[Wolfman jack]

Ive e mailed FA and PL . If they get 100,000 emails, they may take some notice.

 

[Frank Lincoln]

Another nail was hammered into the football coffin with that ridiculous decision to disallow the Chelsea goal at Aston Villa. Chelsea players celebrated with their fans because they had scored a late winner after being two down, but VAR ruined that moment and all because the clown decided to re - referee the game.

 

[WeAreTheWolvesII]

So lucky to have VAR as Burnley's survival chances are kept alive by technology.

The Clarets were about to be cheated at Old Trafford, as many teams have been over the past few decades, but thankfully VAR came to the rescue as Burnley were given a penalty to salvage a point.

 

[Sketchead]

Another nail was hammered into the football coffin with that ridiculous decision to disallow the Chelsea goal at Aston Villa. Chelsea players celebrated with their fans because they had scored a late winner after being two down, but VAR ruined that moment and all because the clown decided to re - referee the game.

Watching on TV, you can see it was going to be a foul a mile off the moment it happened.

Carlos (think that was the defender in question) didn't even appeal for it at the time, and only appealed after the goal because he saw a couple of team-mates moaning.

It probably is a foul to be honest, but referees letting things go that are likely fouls because VAR will 'correct' it is the totally wrong approach.

And let's not get into what on earth the referee was doing at West Ham Liverpool yesterday. Absolute shambles.

 

[Chriswwfc]

Can’t get over looking at the table and considering all that’s gone against us this season believe we should be sat pretty in 6th.
Potentially higher when you take off the unjust points other teams have gained against us.

 

[maws]

Oh look it’s happened to Chelsea abd it’s all over Sky! **** me drunk, that one is a nailed on foul compared to Cunha

 

[Bjorn Star]

So lucky to have VAR as Burnley's survival chances are kept alive by technology.

The Clarets were about to be cheated at Old Trafford, as many teams have been over the past few decades, but thankfully VAR came to the rescue as Burnley were given a penalty to salvage a point.

You’re clearly trolling at this point or employed by PGMOL. If VAR is so fantastic why did they not spot the exact same foul against us at Old Trafford?

I know I shouldn’t bite but you seem to be enjoying the attention of being VAR’s biggest fan

 

[Frank Lincoln]

Watching on TV, you can see it was going to be a foul a mile off the moment it happened.

Carlos (think that was the defender in question) didn't even appeal for it at the time, and only appealed after the goal because he saw a couple of team-mates moaning.

It probably is a foul to be honest, but referees letting things go that are likely fouls because VAR will 'correct' it is the totally wrong approach.

And let's not get into what on earth the referee was doing at West Ham Liverpool yesterday. Absolute shambles.

I only saw the highlights because last night I enjoyed watching a thoroughly entertaining game in the championship, and with no VAR to ruin it.

I think the point is that why does VAR get involved with things like this. The Aston Villa defender swung his arm out, which may or may not be the reason for the slight push. Incidents like that happen every week without VAR getting involved. Also, the referee had a good view of the incident and saw nothing wrong, so the goal should have stood.

Chelsea have not had a great season by their standards, but one of the best moments of it was taken away by VAR.

 

[WeAreTheWolvesII]

You’re clearly trolling at this point or employed by PGMOL. If VAR is so fantastic why did they not spot the exact same foul against us at Old Trafford?

I know I shouldn’t bite but you seem to be enjoying the attention of being VAR’s biggest fan

Who said it’s fantastic? Not me.

They missed it because they made a terrible mistake. Which they rightly apologised for, not that it helps us.

I’m bringing balance to this. VAR could have kept Burnley up by intervening yesterday.

Whether you’re a fan of it or not, that should be acknowledged and seen as a pretty big deal.

 

[rubyloo]

So lucky to have VAR

 

[WorcesterWanderer]

Dont think its just var its a wider malaise in what football as a whole has become. yes been cheated a bit this season but it is just one part.
Everything you read about the way football is going is just not what the game and people who love it actually value.

- Games being moved to the US and abroad
- Financial charges, rule changes
- Media love in of big teams and bias, complicit in tv agenda
- Disneyfication of football, more overseas games, complete saturation of tv documentaries
- Closed shop at the top
- Elite clubs bullying others and governing bodies to increasingly get what they want
- Expanded CL
- Expanded World Cup and club world cup
- Destruction of pyramid and financial structure
- Complete degradation of the FA cup
- Increase in ticket prices (tied in with cost of living crisis added to that)
- Terrible standard of refereeing in general, soft penalties, rule changes (I have less of an idea of what constitutes a penalty or a handball now than i did when i was 5yrs old, which cant be a good thing.)
- VAR and everything that comes with it

Could go on lol. but the tide really does feel like its turning.

On the positive side the list is much shorter but would love to know what others think has actually improved in recent times?!?
- Goal line tech
- Improvement in coverage and standard of womens football
- Possibly the Conference league (intention was more money as per, however does give those teams not normally in europe some aspiration and exposure)

I'm going to use this wonderfully written post to say that I could not give a flying **** about Wrexham's "story", nor the inevitable dramatised film about their completely natural and not financially doped "rise to the top".

I think I may be in some kind of minority with this one.

 

[wulfie88]

 

[Spitfire]

And let's not get into what on earth the referee was doing at West Ham Liverpool yesterday. Absolute shambles.

Anthony Taylor clearly making it up as he went along .

 

[Perton Wolf]

Ive e mailed FA and PL . If they get 100,000 emails, they may take some notice.

It's up to the clubs, who continue to back it for some reason.

 

[Vietnam Wolf]

Game is finished for me. I still buy my son and ex wife's STs but this year told them I'll deposit money to their accounts instead and they can decide.

I'm done with football and VAR, Attwell, PGMOL, Stockley Park, inconsistency, cheating, focused favouritism, incompetence, poor technique of assessing one end of the offside closer than the other, new trait of going back as far as necessary to disallow a goal from an unfavoured club (new this season).

****ing done with it. No more TV on the box for me either.

 

[Contrarian]

They would if the fans demanded it/gave up STs. The fans are the life-blood of the Clubs. If fans like BSK and myself give up on the game then that is a really sad day for football.

That's not the case any more. Broadcasting revenue is the life-blood of Premier League clubs. Fans in the ground account for for lessrevenue than that and merchandise sales.

 

[Wednesbury Wolf]

That's not the case any more. Broadcasting revenue is the life-blood of Premier League clubs. Fans in the ground account for for lessrevenue than that and merchandise sales.

That's dead right, games could easily be played to empty grounds. Money wise as long as the vast amounts of external cash continues to roll in fans can watch on the telly.

 

[WorcesterWanderer]

That's dead right, games could easily be played to empty grounds. Money wise as long as the vast amounts of external cash continues to roll in fans can watch on the telly.

All clubs seem to want in the grounds now are fans who'll spend hundreds in the club shop on merchandise. So the Korean lot seem to satisfy that, heaps of them looked like mannequins out the shop.

 

[Big Saft Kid]

They would if the fans demanded it/gave up STs. The fans are the life-blood of the Clubs. If fans like BSK and myself give up on the game then that is a really sad day for football.

That hasn't been true for many years in the PL. Fans coming through the gate is a minor part of the money the elite clubs make. If they all stopped coming tomorrow, AI would soon take care of creating the visual and auditory impression of a large crowd to please the armchair fan

 

[WorcesterWanderer]

That hasn't been true for many years in the PL. Fans coming through the gate is a minor part of the money the elite clubs make. If they all stopped coming tomorrow, AI would soon take care of creating the visual and auditory impression of a large crowd to please the armchair fan

That sounds like a genuine nightmare, my God...