This site is supported by the advertisements on it, please disable your AdBlocker so we can continue to provide you with the quality content you expect.

Decisive Goalkeeping and Wayne Hennessey

Discussion in 'Molineux Mix Archive' started by PeteWolf, Dec 29, 2008.

  1. PeteWolf

    PeteWolf Guest

    Some of you may have read the book 'All for the Wolves' by Stan Cullis, one line that sticks with me is towards the end when he's picking a team of players made up from the era he played and managed in.

    In goal he went for Frank Swift of Man City as the best GK during that time (Bert Williams reserve keeper), and relays a story of one of the first times they ever played together:

    "In one of our first matches together, I went up to head away a dangerous centre somewhere near the penalty spot. Suddenly I went down in the mud and I thought a steam-roller had strayed on to my part of the field. In a flash, big Frank was picking me up, straightening me out and warning me, "The six yards area belongs to me!". Never in all my life have I been so pleased to obey an order without a second thought."

    For me this is Wayne Hennessey's biggest failing and starting to cost us a number of points. Both goals tonight, the second especially could have been dealt with by more decisive action. Yes, he's young, but if he isn't confident enough then he shouldn't be playing. It's the one thing that the training staff really need to get drummed into him, he's got support from the crowd like few players ever have over the past 20+ years, so no excuses of boo boys getting on his back, but he really needs to sort it out. Any ball in the box he should be making sure he gets to. The indecision and staying on his line will continue to cost us, and ultimately him his place if he doesn't sort it out.

    I won't be surprised to see Mick playing Ikeme against Blues with the intention to keep him in after that.
     
  2. Sedgley Wolf

    Sedgley Wolf Guest

    Agree with all of that.

    I'd love to see Ikeme in the team as he has proved that he has confidence in dealing with crosses and that must give the defence so much more confidence at set-pieces. He is also a terrific shot-stopper.

    I feel for Hennessey but he was a liability for their second goal tonight,
     
  3. ice cream head

    ice cream head Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    7,761
    Likes Received:
    254
    Joined:
    May 6, 2007
    He still needs to fill out a bit. He isn't strong enough to clatter everything in his way and nor is he tall enough to pick the ball out of the air (in a Murray style)

    He's a great shot stopper and fantastic kicker of the ball, but personally I would rather see Ikeme in goal. He gives me more confidence at set pieces and in this league, alot of goals are scored that way.

    I still hope we keep hold of him, because when he does fill out a bit more, he will be world class. However, Wolves aren't a world class team so it's inevitable he'll be on his way sooner rather than later. (Arsenal in Jan)
     
  4. PeteWolf

    PeteWolf Guest

    Size is certainly a factor, but also I think aggresion is as well. If he can't develop that, then it will stop him fulfilling the promise he has. Some players (/people) are just born with it, maybe it will come of age, but without it then he will always be weak, however much he fills out. It doesn't usually take long for teams to figure out to put a man on a hesitant goalkeeper.
     
  5. Wolv3nsam

    Wolv3nsam Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    15,342
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2007
    He's taller than Murray.
     
  6. ice cream head

    ice cream head Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    7,761
    Likes Received:
    254
    Joined:
    May 6, 2007
    Not with arms aloft he isn't. Murray has arms like an oranguntan. Just a shame he has the legs of a muscle wasted heroin addict.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 30, 2008
  7. Bawtry Wolf

    Bawtry Wolf Senior Member

    Messages:
    435
    Likes Received:
    131
    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2006
    Hennesey was poor tonight, he didn't attack the ball for the goal and was thus trying to punch it with his arms out in front of him, ie he didn't try to get it at its highest point and therefore take out the inrunning forward, if he could have got out earlier the likelihood is that he would have been clattered and we would have had a free kick. I also don't think he reads the game well, a couple of times he could have come and collected balls on the ground in the box thus relieving pressure from the defence instead he let defenders play the ball whilst facing our goal, I can remember this happening a couple of time with Hill (who shouldn't be in front of a fit Ward). Also for the first goal I can't help feeling that if Murray had been in goal he would have been off his line making himself look huge and generally scaring the crap out of the forward, the ball did travel a long way. He is a good shot stopper but I don't think he is the long term answer, but he is in a long line of Wolves goalkeepers who have been too scared to leave their line, Oakes and Kendal (RIP) to name but two.
     
  8. bigbluewolf

    bigbluewolf Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    3,869
    Likes Received:
    334
    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2005
    Hennessey made a decisive decision for the second goal by coming for the ball. Unfortunately, it was the wrong one. He came, he missed, they scored.
     
  9. glasgowwolf

    glasgowwolf Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    11,176
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2005
    It was not just the fault of Hennesey.
    We were too deep meaning by the time the ball was in the air, and Hennesey was coming the players were on top of him.
    Hennesey made the decision to come far too late, by the time he came he was never going to make it.

    With young players you will get wrong decisions, the decision was not so much the wrong one as a late one.

    Jarvis made more wrong decisions as did SEB, however because he is a keeper his mistake will let in a goal.

    Also take nothing away from the delivery it was excellent.
     
  10. Tarcisio Mifsud

    Tarcisio Mifsud Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    4,412
    Likes Received:
    679
    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2005
    I strongly feel that if Wolves do not make it to the Premiership this season, we would be more than justified to point our fingers towards him. Hope that Wolves would gain automatic promotion, so that he will redeem himself.

    I was so disappointed with the result after seeing the match direct on tv, that I just went to bed, rather than coming on this forum.

    Jarvis should have scored a hatrick so it was not just Hennessey that we dropped 2 points against Blackpool.
     
  11. sy king

    sy king Guest

    i agree GW, He was kind of blocked off by his own players becuase they didnt think he was coming for the ball, so they went for it and then Hennessey decided to try and punch it....
     
  12. Salisbury Wolf

    Salisbury Wolf Moderator

    Messages:
    3,990
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2005
    That was a great ball in to the box though. I did mentally say "that's in" as Wayne came for the ball. He left it too late to make his move in my opinion.

    I know some will say it's not an excuse, but it was bloody cold last night and standing around freezing your $$$$$$ off will slow your movements down to some extent. There's only a certain amount of running around you can do to keep warm between the sticks.
     
  13. Ulver

    Ulver Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    4,176
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2008
    What a load of $$$$$$$$! I don't even know where to start.
     
  14. Wulfhere

    Wulfhere Guest

    I used to keep goal many years ago. I followed in the footsteps of my Dad who was also a custodian. He used to tell me to be like big Frank Swift and when you go for the ball make sure it is yours no matter who got in the way, it did not matter if it was the opposition or you own players, shift them and make it yours. Hennessey does not fill me with confidence in the department although he is an excellent shot stopper.
     
  15. ProudWolf

    ProudWolf Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    5,160
    Likes Received:
    242
    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2005
    Hennessey has been flapping more than ever lately.
    Ikeme deserves the shirt back as, despite what Radio WM told you during his stint, he didnt make a catalogue of errors and only lost his place through injury. He was much more commanding and his shot stopping was also very good.
     
  16. wolfie smith

    wolfie smith Guest

    goalies never seem to be penalised for fouling when collecting crosses so wayne needs to learn to wipe everyone out to get the ball, thats down to the coaches, if he cant learn he needs to stay put and make use of his shot stopping.
     
  17. Tarcisio Mifsud

    Tarcisio Mifsud Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    4,412
    Likes Received:
    679
    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2005

    It appears only you did not agree with my comments for if you see what other contributors have written in this thread and also comments in other threads on same subject, they more or less agree with my version.

    Still you have a right for your opinion, even if it is incorrect.
     
  18. Wolv3nsam

    Wolv3nsam Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    15,342
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2007
    What a load of $$$$. If we don't make the automatic promotion spots then it's down to the team as a whole, not one player.
     
  19. sy king

    sy king Guest

    pathetic.
     
  20. Mark Rankines Lovechild

    Mark Rankines Lovechild Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    10,452
    Likes Received:
    3,685
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2008
    Over-reaction, but you do have to say that the last two games - two mistakes - points gone! I wouldn't be surprised if he makes way for Ikeme in the next game. I wonder if we sometimes defend so deep because our defense dont entirely trust Hennessey. I really am not a fan of punching the ball....but if you come for it you have to get it and knock anyone and everyon in your way over to get there. The chances are if a keeper goes down he gets the foul, whatever way you paint it last nights attempt was weak effort
     
  21. derbyrameater

    derbyrameater Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    21,756
    Likes Received:
    906
    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2005
    So why was Matt murray hailed as the main reason for promotion?
     
  22. molineux man

    molineux man Senior Member

    Messages:
    918
    Likes Received:
    49
    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2006
    Ikeme makes mistakes too. Don't forget he caught one and then fell back into his own goal vs Norwich.

    Goalies will always make mistakes, even the best ones. If it wasn't for Wayne, we would have lost 5-1 to Sheff Utd on Boxing Day.

    We should be thankful we have two top-class goalkeepers.
     
  23. Mutchy

    Mutchy Administrator

    Messages:
    13,493
    Likes Received:
    2,112
    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2005
    Its Christmas/New Year, we're seven points clear, and you're choosing the player/s you're going to blame if we don't go up. Great.
     
  24. Dewsburywolf

    Dewsburywolf Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    39,109
    Likes Received:
    105
    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2007
    I'm presuming you're ruling out Big Matt because he's not fit.
     
  25. Bertiewolf

    Bertiewolf Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,240
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2005
    Be grateful Ulver at least had the courtesy to reply to such utter uniformed gob*****! You either know absolutely nothing about football or the Libyans are infiltrating your water supply with devastating effect
     
  26. I don't like the idea of blaming players either but we really should have finished the game with 3 points in the bag and the team must know that too. We seem to be playing down to the level of other teams and not to the standards we have set earlier in the season. Wayne made some awful decisions last night and can certainly play better than that. But if this is going to be our mid-season dip in form where we draw a few games and not lose a load then I don't mind too much.
     
  27. I'll just add something here. If Murray was fit he would have been between the sticks. His standard of keeping is so high the second choice keeper, despite playing for his country and being coveted by some Premiership clubs, gets some stick. To me that speaks volumes about the collective quality of the three keepers we have.
     
  28. bigbluewolf

    bigbluewolf Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    3,869
    Likes Received:
    334
    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2005
    Hennessey IS a good keeper but is still young, especially in goalkeeping terms, and will make mistakes - as does every player.

    David James made mistakes when he was young (and still does) but he has turned into an excellent keeper. If us Wolves fans don't destroy Hennessey with constant criticism then he will not just be a good keeper but an excellent one.

    As for last night's result, we had enough chances which should have been taken to make Blackpool's second goal meaningless.
     
  29. goldeneyed

    goldeneyed Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    14,554
    Likes Received:
    3,105
    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2005
    Wow Hennessey made a mistake! Let's get rid of him fast.

    Hennessey is one of the finest prospects to come out of the club for many years. We are lucky to have him and Ikeme. Its amazing how people forget the fantastic saves he has made which must have saved us so many points.

    He is 21 and a fantastic goalkeeper for his age and already an established international with Wales. Yes he does need to dominate his penalty box more but that should come with time and good coaching. The Blackpool result was not due to one moment of indecision by Hennessey it was due to a whole series of factors including poor team selection at the outset.

    Perhaps Ikeme will get the nod on Saturday perhaps not. Personally I would stick with Hennessey.
     
  30. goldfish

    goldfish Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    2,134
    Likes Received:
    477
    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2006
    With all this high-profile flapping, do we still reckon Spurs will be interested, given their current flapper-extrraordinaire?
     
  31. WH is a really good keeper with a big flaw in his game. Commanding his box is something that he should find easy with his height all he needs to do is build himself up a little and get a little agression in himself, with the right coaching he will sort this out easily!
     
  32. A wanderer from Bristol

    A wanderer from Bristol Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    2,797
    Likes Received:
    138
    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2007
    Gomez has played well recently
     
  33. Wolv3nsam

    Wolv3nsam Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    15,342
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2007
    He certainly saved us a lot last season, including a point at the Hawthorns.
     
  34. DJW

    DJW Guest

    Wayne has been poor for a while now. I have had reservations about him due to him being so weak and lighweight.
    I doubt this will improve as he has little aggression. I would be tempted to sell him in Jan if someone is daft enough to splash 5m on him.
    Playing against Wolves you would ping high balls into the box all evening and wait for the spoils.
    Gosh we miss Murray, but a keeper puchase may be required next year.
     
  35. derbyrameater

    derbyrameater Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    21,756
    Likes Received:
    906
    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2005
    IMO no way is James an excellent goalkeeper.

    I remember seeing James at Watford and he still has the same flaws in his game.

    James is a brilliant shot stopper but put balls into the box in the air on the 6 yard box and he is a flapper extraordinaire, how the bloke plays for England shows how poor the goalkeeping dept has become in this country. In the not to distant past England was renowned for its continuous production line of top goalkeepers.

    Foreign goalkeeprs were the ones renowned for being flappers who were brilliant short stoppers and they couldn`t even take a goalkick (for those old enough to remember)..

    Obviously the last paragraph doesn`t include the great Lev Yashin which brings to mind an old Wolves song..
     
  36. Any goalkeeper who cannot come out and claim crosses out of the air is a liability. The coaching part should be easy - you tell your goalkeeper to stand 2-3 yards off his line and practice collecting crosses until it becomes second nature. Anyone remember how Murray used to do it time after time in the pre-match warm ups? Either we have no proper goalkeeper coaching at all or we do and Hennessey is not learning properly.
    Until he learns that basic skill for a top class keeper then he has to spend time on the practice ground and not on the pitch playing for a top of the table team.
     
  37. duanepipe

    duanepipe Guest

    I always remember a mate of mine used to moan frequently about being a Man Utd supporter. "Van Nistelrooy", he whined, "only brings goals to the team, his all round game is terrible." I'd nod and agree and then behind his back I'd laugh at him for being such a massive tool and think to myself, if ever my team is in a dominant position with players who most other teams would kill for I'll never become 'that guy'. I'm not going to start with Hennesey. I'm genuinely delighted that we are a full 7 whole points clear at New Year 09 and that we have a young, international goalkeeper who we developed ourselves. What he did last night was not indecision it was a technical error, he'll make more of them too. Like all goalkeepers his mistakes will cost us goals - however his technical excellence will (and has) saved us points as well. With better finishing we'd have won that game 5-2.
     
  38. Deutsch Wolf

    Deutsch Wolf Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    15,653
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2005
    Correct. And without Hennessey, we'd have lost 4-1 on Friday.
     

Share This Page