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Chelsea - Alex wants to leave.

Discussion in 'Molineux Mix Archive' started by Shergar, Dec 11, 2008.

  1. Shergar

    Shergar Guest

  2. leedswolf

    leedswolf Just doesn't shut up

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    John Terry, Ricardo Carvalho and Branislav Ivanovic in front of Mancienne. Scolari could also use the Alex money to buy another established CB.
     
  3. Shergar

    Shergar Guest

    I hope you're right Leeds.
    bugt allied to all of the positive press with the England call-up etc..Either of Carvalho or Terry are prone to the odd game out with various niggles, Mancienne becomes first reserve or either steps over that clumsy Ivanovic.... money doesn't get spent as Roman is down to his last 3 super yachts.
    Could be on his way methinks.
     
  4. The_Blade

    The_Blade Just doesn't shut up

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    Mancienne will go back to Chelsea, Terry is slow as hell and Carvalho is getting on a bit now, Mancienne has a very similar style to Carvalho IMO. It would be a bit of a dumb move if they sold him.
     
  5. I thought this was going to be a thread about a possible cheeky bid for Alex!
    How much do you think he'd go for?
     
  6. Mancwolf

    Mancwolf Guest

    Judging from recent comments from Big Phil, I'd say they'll definitely buy if Alex goes. Mancienne has been brilliant for us, but would his performances against QPR and Birmingham be good enough for someone who could potentially end up playing in a Champions League final this season?
     
  7. Carlos#5

    Carlos#5 Has a lot to say

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    On the one hand, Scolari is going to prefer him playing regular Championship football than being 3rd/4th choice and barely getting a game at Chelsea.

    On the other hand, Chelsea have to consider their registering of players for the knock-out stages of the Champions League, and the requirement to name a certain amount of 'home-grown' players.

    If, it is allowed for Chelsea to name him in the squad, and loan him out then that would probably be the best solution for all parties. The drawback with that being is that they would naturally have to have a recall option, and if he did get recalled and required to sit on the bench for one game, for example, we would not be allowed to loan him for a 3rd time in the same season.
     
  8. Sozzled Wolf

    Sozzled Wolf Just doesn't shut up

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    I really think Scolari will sell Mancienne if the price is right. I don't think he feels fully confident in him due to his physique. Agyemang gave him an awful time, as did Jerome & co the week before, so he's not going to fare much better against the likes of Drogba, Adebayor, Benjani etc etc etc.

    Thankfully time is on his side and he will bulk out, but I don't think Chelsea can afford to wait a couple more seasons for this.
     
  9. goldeneyed

    goldeneyed Just doesn't shut up

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    I think Mancienne will be allowed to stay on loan for the season and long term I don't think he has the physical presence a top team like Chelsea will need at CB. I hope we make a decent bid for him in the summer or in January if Chelsea indicate they might sell.
     
  10. WolvesAreBoringOnCeefax

    WolvesAreBoringOnCeefax Moderator

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    Also saying that if Man City can't get Upson they'll go for Lescott, hopefully for big money for our sell on clause!
     
  11. Jack Regan

    Jack Regan Senior Member

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    Then how will we sign him when we get up?

    I could really see Joleon coming back if we got promoted, his England chances are being ruined by Moyes playing him at left back. Had he been a centre half this season, he would have had a real chance of playing in the recent England games instead of Upson.

    As for Alex, i'd demand a transfer if Ivanovic was being picked over me. Chelsea really do need to sign a 3rd quality CH so i'd be dissapointed and surprised if they recalled Mancienne.
     
  12. Sozzled Wolf

    Sozzled Wolf Just doesn't shut up

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    Just the type of club we want going in for Joleon!
     
  13. jlovatt

    jlovatt Guest

    I believe it is possible for him to be named in the Champions League requirement then loaned back out, but he couldn't be aloud to be out on loan the day the squad was decided...except if he was named in the orginal Champions League squad. Any know if he was?
     
  14. Space Wolf

    Space Wolf Guest

    Branislav Ivanovic has been linked with a January move as well. Rumours say that he might be off to Lazio on loan.
     
  15. Super Hans

    Super Hans Guest

    In the same gossip column it also says Chelsea are in for a centre back from Portugal or Brazil. So hopefully he'll come in and pave the way for Mancienned to stay until May.
     
  16. wolfie smith

    wolfie smith Guest

    who says mick wants mancienne to stay?
     
  17. northnorfolkwolf

    northnorfolkwolf Just doesn't shut up

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    As much as I like the look of MM I still worry that in this league 2 footballing CHs is a bit of a luxury. Both him and RS $$$$ about on the ball too much for my liking. Against bruising Championship CFs a RS Collins/Shackell partnership may be just as good.
     
  18. A wanderer from Bristol

    A wanderer from Bristol Just doesn't shut up

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    I know where you are coming from but I hope we can buy Mancienne or get him on loan for the season and I hope we stick with Mancienne and Stearman as the centre back partnership. Yes they need to bulk up and stears may find himself out of position, but they give us so much more than any other combination.

    Derby didn't have a shot in anger on tuesday night and a lot of that was down to the pace and skill and assurance of mancienne in particular but stears too. I don't think Derby forwards thought they were going to score - I certainly didn't. there will be times when they will be our muscled but they will get better at dealing with that, but there will be more clean sheets and building from the back and closing games out with these two in the team. Would be really interesting to see the numberu of clean sheets or goals conceded with MM and stears at CB. Even thogh they are young and still learning their trade, they are (potentially) the best centre back pairing I can remember at the Mol - I said potentially..

    I think most of us have been crying out for pace at centre back since Joleon left. Now we have it, plus skill and ability and youth. And I think that's bloody great.
     
  19. WolvesAreBoringOnCeefax

    WolvesAreBoringOnCeefax Moderator

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    northnorfolkwolf's point was that despite all that, a team that tries long ball against them will get an occasional chance because neither of them are 6 foot 6 bruisers who'll win every ball in the air. They're by no means bad, and it doesn't make sense to pass up the chance of getting Mancienne just because of this, when he brings so much more to the table, but it is a valid concern.
     
  20. The Bear

    The Bear Just doesn't shut up

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    Let there be stats:


    Plymouth – Craddock and Stearman – 2 conceded
    Wednesday – Collins and Stearman – 1 Conceded ( Craddock off after 7 minutes )
    Ipswich – Collins and Stearman – 0 conceded
    Forest – Collins and Stearman – 1 conceded
    Charlton – Collins and Stearman – 1 conceded
    Forest – Collins and Stearman – 1 conceded
    Preston – Collins and Stearman – 1 conceded
    Bristol City – Collins and Stearman – 0 conceded
    Reading – Collins and Stearman – 3 conceded
    Swansea – Collins and Stearman – 3 conceded
    Cov – Collins and Stearman – 1 conceded
    Norwich – Collins and Stearman – 5 conceded
    Watford – Shackell and Collins – 2 conceded
    Swansea – Shackell and Collins – 1 conceded
    Cardiff – Mancienne and Stearman – 1 conceded
    Burnley – Mancienne and Stearman – 0 conceded
    Southampton – Mancienne and Stearman – 1 conceded
    Blackpool – Collins and Stearman – 0 conceded
    Sheff Utd – Collins and Stearman – 1 conceded
    Birmingham – Mancienne and Stearman – 1 conceded
    QPR – Mancienne and Stearman – 1 conceded
    Derby – Mancienne and Stearman – 0 conceded

    THE FACTS ARE AS FOLLOWS;

    Overall starts versus goals conceded –
    Stearman – 20 starts – 24 conceded – 1.14 goals per game
    Collins – 15 starts – 20 conceded – 1.33 goals per game
    Mancienne – 6 starts – 4 conceded – 0.66 goals per game
    Shackell – 2 starts – 3 conceded – 1.5 goals per game ( though credit has to go to him for an excellent second half at Bramall Lane )

    PARTNERSHIP FACTS

    Craddock and Stearman – 1 game – 2 conceded – 2 goals per game
    Shackell and Collins – 2 games – 3 conceded – 1.5 goals per game
    Stearman and Collins – 13 games – 18 conceded – 1.38 goals per game
    Stearman and Mancienne – 6 games – 4 conceded – 0.66 goals per game

    POINTS PER PARTNERSHIP FACTS

    Craddock and Stearman – 1 ppg
    Shackell and Collins – 1.5 ppg
    Stearman and Collins – 2.30 ppg
    Stearman and Mancienne – 2.16 ppg
     
  21. wanderer24

    wanderer24 Just doesn't shut up

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    I'd agree with that, Scolari doesn't think he's ready and neither do i. He's shown in the last few games that although he's silky smooth, he's still got a lot to work on with his game.
     
  22. northnorfolkwolf

    northnorfolkwolf Just doesn't shut up

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    A very interesting debate this one. Funnily enough I think a RS/MM combination will be more effective in the Prem where they will usually have more time to play and where the need to pass/move is a requirement - not the need to hoof the ball up the pitch. Collins and Shackell will assist us in our desire for the Prem but cannot see them getting many games then esp if we can sign MM.
     
  23. WolvesAreBoringOnCeefax

    WolvesAreBoringOnCeefax Moderator

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    Agree, different attributes are needed in the Prem, in the Championship a good header of the ball and decent on the ground will be good enough, whereas a Prem player needs to be top notch playing with the ball and not so much defending long balls, though of course it is still an attribute to have.
     
  24. LG Wolf

    LG Wolf Has a lot to say

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    Cracking stuff Bear!
     
  25. Sozzled Wolf

    Sozzled Wolf Just doesn't shut up

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    My gut feel is that I think Shackell will have a part to play before the season's end. He hasn't yet had a prolonged spell in the first team but from the little I've seen of him, he provides welcome strength to the back four. And he's less 'heart in the mouth' error-prone than our Neil.

    If I were to choose the current best pairing though, I'd stick with MM & RS. Pace and ability on the ball make for less stressful watching! Those stats provide good justification for their inclusion, too - thanks Bear - top work.
     
  26. Del Woppio

    Del Woppio Guest

    Mancienne recalled. Alex has a hamstring strain, and Terry is suspended, while Carvalho is just back.

    Not disasterous by any means. But not ideal, either.
     

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