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The same old, same old, repeated arguments transfer thread

TheConcourse

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So Jeff pulled out of the deal because he didn’t want to spend £18m or because he didn’t want to lose 25% of the future sale value?

Perhaps the problem isn’t in the football org side of the business. They identified a player at relatively low cost with an incredibly high ceiling and Jeff has decided against it, inexplicably, after sending a colleague around the world to negotiate the deal.

There’s a big difference between innovating and being cheap, as he’ll find out when we’re scrapping around for survival next season. So so close to great things. What a shame.
 

Northampton_wolf

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So Jeff pulled out of the deal because he didn’t want to spend £18m or because he didn’t want to lose 25% of the future sale value?

Perhaps the problem isn’t in the football org side of the business. They identified a player at relatively low cost with an incredibly high ceiling and Jeff has decided against it, inexplicably, after sending a colleague around the world to negotiate the deal.

There’s a big difference between innovating and being cheap, as he’ll find out when we’re scrapping around for survival next season. So so close to great things. What a shame.
Ill get my pitchfork out and start the rant on shi/fosun etc once its July 10th with still no signings.

If we are at last week of july, we can fully burn them.

We can only surmise unless we were their we do not know. Sounds like shi, said no due to money and not immediately here. Thats all we can say. But real reason who knows>
 

sc91

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Pedro Sepúlveda been on Sky just, was asked about Nunes to Wolves.

Said Nunes initially didn't even want to hear from Wolves as had no interest whatsoever in joining. Eventually agreed to listen to proposal made but no agreement was reached. Player waiting for other options later in the window.

The journalists opinion was that he could not see Nunes going to Wolves as feels he suits a much 'bigger project'.

Without saying it in as many words he made it sound like we have absolutely no chance.


One interesting bit was on Palhinha though. Said Fulham have it all agreed with Sporting CP and it's simply down to the player saying yes, with Fulham constantly pushing him to sign now.

Unlike reports on Twitter he didn't make it sound it's inevitable Palhinha says yes, instead saying we will find out his decision in a week or two.

No mention of Wolves but my interpretation was that the journalist was indicating Palhinha is still holding out for another club and will give it as long as possible to see if something comes up.
Sums up my fears above, players aren't shut off from the world, the perception of Wolves isn't as a project but as a window shop.
 

TheConcourse

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Ill get my pitchfork out and start the rant on shi/fosun etc once its July 10th with still no signings.

If we are at last week of july, we can fully burn them.

We can only surmise unless we were their we do not know. Sounds like shi, said no due to money and not immediately here. Thats all we can say. But real reason who knows>
You’re being totally rational, and I absolutely think that’s the right approach in most cases.

This window is just a micro part of Fosun’s ownership so far. The more worrying trends for me are:

- The last 2 summer windows
- The level of performances for 2 years

Mitigating factors in performances, but most of which can be traced back to squad size/quality.

Perhaps Fosun are happy to just survive in the PL right now whilst they build additional revenue streams, and the only way we sign is when we sell. But I’m staggered that when a player comes along who is so highly rated for £10m + add ons that we don’t seemingly have enough cash to take that gamble.

We have no room, it seems, to gamble in the market. But when our track record over the last couple of years has been patchy at best that in itself is a huge concern. Imagine Neves leaves and they get it wrong? We’re done.
 

sc91

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not really, hobbs lined it up - river plate encouraged us to go there and discuss (to push benfica) - and we backed off when they said they wanted £18m but to retain 25% of his rights

trouble is jeff, we need to sign someone at some point. i'm very pro the club but we do seem to need some football trading nous if mendes' influence is receding
So why not follow benfica's offer.
 

Northampton_wolf

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You’re being totally rational, and I absolutely think that’s the right approach in most cases.

This window is just a micro part of Fosun’s ownership so far. The more worrying trends for me are:

- The last 2 summer windows
- The level of performances for 2 years

Mitigating factors in performances, but most of which can be traced back to squad size/quality.

Perhaps Fosun are happy to just survive in the PL right now whilst they build additional revenue streams, and the only way we sign is when we sell. But I’m staggered that when a player comes along who is so highly rated for £10m + add ons that we don’t seemingly have enough cash to take that gamble.

We have no room, it seems, to gamble in the market. But when our track record over the last couple of years has been patchy at best that in itself is a huge concern.
Completely agree, we have no room to gamble, and we need to pull the trigger on deals.
 

Sussex Wolf

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We are dismissing the possibility that deals are already set up or even done. Maybe on Tuesday signings will be announced when they report for training.

Remember while we were all poopooing the Neves signing as unrealistic he suddenly released the new away kit?

"Wolves hay we"

I will be happy if that’s what happens!

I’m a bit burned by the last two windows. Last summer in particular I was prettt bullish and defended the club’s activity right up to deadline day. But when it became clear that none of the rumoured deals were happening, it was a massive let down, and compounded by Jeff’s backtracking in his later interview.
 

Hoganstolemywife

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not really, hobbs lined it up - river plate encouraged us to go there and discuss (to push benfica) - and we backed off when they said they wanted £18m but to retain 25% of his rights

trouble is jeff, we need to sign someone at some point. i'm very pro the club but we do seem to need some football trading nous if mendes' influence is receding
Completely agree.

It's very easy to sign top players when the world's foremost football agent tells then to sign for you.

Thelwell presided over Neves, Jota, Boly etc. But one imagines he had nothing to do with the reason they were signed.

If the Mendes influence has waned, we need to rely on our network and initiative. My fear is that we have become complacent and aren't up to scracth on that front. Then again we did locate and sign Chiqinho and Mosquera last season, so it's not completely cut and dry

It's just noticeable that we do not seemingly have an individual in the club who can draw in established players.
 

Padraig

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If Jeffs the one doing the deals what is Scotty boy doing? Polishing the frame around his degree and telling all the lads down the pub how well he is thought of in football?
In the camping section at the Wergs finding a new tent to wear
 

CologneWolf

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No but there are credibility issues based on the multiple inconsistencies from Jeff and also between Jeff and others. It’s almost as if they don’t know what they’re doing. ‘Trust us’ says Jeff. Not a hope mate.

I think that was the point I was trying to make. They’re just meaningless words. Either don’t be as gullible as to fall for it, or don’t get upset when it doesn’t pan out the way they have said.
 

VancouverWolf

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So Jeff pulled out of the deal because he didn’t want to spend £18m or because he didn’t want to lose 25% of the future sale value?

Perhaps the problem isn’t in the football org side of the business. They identified a player at relatively low cost with an incredibly high ceiling and Jeff has decided against it, inexplicably, after sending a colleague around the world to negotiate the deal.

There’s a big difference between innovating and being cheap, as he’ll find out when we’re scrapping around for survival next season. So so close to great things. What a shame.
We don’t actually know why we pulled out this rumoured deal.
If it’s true, then there might be a good reason for it……..being cheap is hardly the reason.
 

wwbug

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The thing is they do do a lot of social media and comms. Probably get an email a day at least and several Twitter notifications from preparing the new pitch, goals scored on this day, etc etc. but because, as fans, we are only interested in transfers at this time it goes over our head. The club (Jeff) said last year he’s not going to do a weekly or monthly press interview or press release.
PR is much more than that.
Do you know where we are planning to head next year and how we are going to get there ?
I have no idea , and reading MM, I am joined by almost everyone on here, so how can we get players to join us without a clear purpose.
 

Eastyorksyeltz

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Sums up my fears above, players aren't shut off from the world, the perception of Wolves isn't as a project but as a window shop.
I have to admit this is an aspect I take more seriously than some of the speculation about the motives and capabilities of our own negotiators. The playersphere is indeed a small world and one driven by the interests of an even smaller network of international agents. We are always going to struggle competing with established "Big Clubs", where they can offer the media exposure and prestige that builds careers, as well as more fashionable locations, on top of the basic economic package. It is all very well being able to attract young unproven talent for a shot at the "best league in the world.", but what have we got to attract those players who are just that next step up in the pecking order?
 

VancouverWolf

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You’re being totally rational, and I absolutely think that’s the right approach in most cases.

This window is just a micro part of Fosun’s ownership so far. The more worrying trends for me are:

- The last 2 summer windows
- The level of performances for 2 years

Mitigating factors in performances, but most of which can be traced back to squad size/quality.

Perhaps Fosun are happy to just survive in the PL right now whilst they build additional revenue streams, and the only way we sign is when we sell. But I’m staggered that when a player comes along who is so highly rated for £10m + add ons that we don’t seemingly have enough cash to take that gamble.

We have no room, it seems, to gamble in the market. But when our track record over the last couple of years has been patchy at best that in itself is a huge concern. Imagine Neves leaves and they get it wrong? We’re done.
There is no way that Jeff is not very concerned about the last two seasons’ performances and the serious lack of goals. He’s not blind…..and he knows how easy a club can start circling near the drain.
I doubt that Wolves will accept that again so I presume we’ll get players in to help address that.
 

old wittonian

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There is no way that Jeff is not very concerned about the last two seasons’ performances and the serious lack of goals. He’s not blind…..and he knows how easy a club can start circling near the drain.
I doubt that Wolves will accept that again so I presume we’ll get players in to help address that.
Never presume anything.
 

VancouverWolf

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If you admit we don't know the reason how can you be so certain it wasn't "being cheap"?
Ok, fair question and I don’t know for certain but it’s reasonable to assume that a top 10 PL club won’t be cheap in the transfer market. Clubs, players, agents etc would stop taking your calls.

I also don’t think Wolves are cheap. There a huge difference between being cheap and frugal, prudent, competent and business like.
 

WalsallWolf

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More great recruitment and ambition I see. At least it was a different story last window. Oh wait, it wasn't.. The one before that then.. Oh **** no that ****ed that one up.. Just same same.

Such a missed opportunity these last few years have been. Such a missed opportunity.
 

Rhoswolf

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Ok, fair question and I don’t know for certain but it’s reasonable to assume that a top 10 PL club won’t be cheap in the transfer market. Clubs, players, agents etc would stop taking your calls.

I also don’t think Wolves are cheap. There a huge difference between being cheap and frugal, prudent, competent and business like.
Prudent and competent are not words that immediately spring to mind, business like is a stretch, was lack of investment in January and actually weakening the squad whilst confirming the premature signing of Hwang, which resulted in missing out on Europe and a higher league position business like? Frugal, cheap, I get.
 

WickedWolfie

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Alex Crooks @ TalkSport just reported it was "Shi who pulled out of the Enzo deal." His exact words. He usually fairly reliable.
If that is true l can only imagine that we were not prepared to wait until January for him to join.
 

WickedWolfie

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not really, hobbs lined it up - river plate encouraged us to go there and discuss (to push benfica) - and we backed off when they said they wanted £18m but to retain 25% of his rights

trouble is jeff, we need to sign someone at some point. i'm very pro the club but we do seem to need some football trading nous if mendes' influence is receding
Re your first para PL rules preclude third party ownership. The best that we could do is a sell-on clause.
 

Alex Rae The Substitute

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The signs are all quite worrying to be completely honest.

All we can do is speculate as none of us are certain of anything. But, I think it is fair to look at previous windows for trajectory of signings, and doing that does set off a few alarm bells.

For the last two windows at least we’ve heard exactly the same, linked with exciting players but none of them materialize. Sanches, Botman, Nunes, Enzo…… we seem to be here again. If we can no longer sell the ‘project’ then we quite simply have to shift our transfer strategy. Fosun’s model doesn’t work if we’re not in the PL, and surely signing a few ready made first teamers (not even mega buck ones) is going to at least keep us up for a season before we can strike up the young exciting route again.

I remain convinced Nuno walked, he took one look at how we were going to operate as a club and said “thanks, but no thanks” and the club agreed an amicable split. Up rocks an unproven Mendes client, who to be fair has been fine and for 2-3 months had us with a glimpse of Europe. Lage stated quite vocally he wants his new squad set for pre-season, Fosun so far haven’t delivered on this. Talk about undermining your manager.
 
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