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New CL Format confirmed

sc91

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Uefa will allow two clubs to enter the Champions League from 2024 based on historical performance, it has been agreed, but with the rankings determined by country and not club.

The deal, struck at a meeting of Uefa’s executive committee on Tuesday, is a compromise which will also see the number of fixtures in the revamped Champions League reduced to eight matches per club in the ‘league stage’, down from a proposed 10.

Under previous plans, two clubs who failed to reach the Champions League by league qualification would have still made the tournament based on their coefficient, a rating determined by performance in Europe over the previous five years.

The new approach will also see two places determined by coefficient, but that of the country as a whole, and only over the past year. If the new rules were applied this season, the two extra places would go to clubs from England and the Netherlands.

The numbers are based on points obtained by all a country’s clubs in a given season in the Champions League, Europa League and Europa Conference League.


Sigh.
 

WolfLing

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Uefa will allow two clubs to enter the Champions League from 2024 based on historical performance, it has been agreed, but with the rankings determined by country and not club.

The deal, struck at a meeting of Uefa’s executive committee on Tuesday, is a compromise which will also see the number of fixtures in the revamped Champions League reduced to eight matches per club in the ‘league stage’, down from a proposed 10.

Under previous plans, two clubs who failed to reach the Champions League by league qualification would have still made the tournament based on their coefficient, a rating determined by performance in Europe over the previous five years.

The new approach will also see two places determined by coefficient, but that of the country as a whole, and only over the past year. If the new rules were applied this season, the two extra places would go to clubs from England and the Netherlands.

The numbers are based on points obtained by all a country’s clubs in a given season in the Champions League, Europa League and Europa Conference League.


Sigh.

I'm massively against this.

Until this change in rules sees us qualify for the Champions League through the back door, then I will be massively in favour of it!
 

Big Saft Kid

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This is utterly anti-sport, and only about money for UEFA and its European lackeys. They can stick it up their well greased arses as far as I am concerned. If we ever qualified for the CL. I wouldn't want us to compete in this anti-football travesty.
 

Kashmire Hawker

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Format Summary

Taking the total number of teams from 32 to 36 in the UEFA Champions League, the biggest change will see a transformation from the traditional group stage to a single league phase including all participating teams. Every club will now be guaranteed a minimum of 8 league stage games against 8 different opponents (four home games, four away) rather than the previous six matches against three teams, played on a home-and-away basis.

The top eight sides in the league will qualify automatically for the knockout stage, while the teams finishing in ninth to 24th place will compete in a two-legged play-off to secure their path to the last 16 of the competition.

Similar format changes will also be applied to the UEFA Europa League (8 matches in the league stage) and UEFA Europa Conference League (6 matches in the league stage) and both will also include 36 teams in the league phase.

 

marrs-guitar

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I don't quite see the objections and the "closed shop" accusations, to be honest.

It's effectively just one potential extra CL spot at most for England, but only on the basis that English clubs have performed well in the previous season. If they haven't then the spot goes to another country.

The only major change is that it's one single league in the group stage rather than umpteen groups of 4.

Overall, Wolves have got a better chance of playing European football as a result.
 
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sc91

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I don't quite see the objections and the "closed shop" accusations, to be honest.

It's effectively just one potential extra CL spot at most for England, but only on the basis that English clubs have performed well.

The only major change is that it's one single league in the group stage rather than umpteen groups of 4.

Overall, Wolves have got a better chance of playing European football as a result.
And the rest of Europe suffers? It's more and more a competition between 5 leagues and **** the rest.

Also, 36 team groups in a league? How big of a squad do you want. Remember this applies for CL, EL and EC.
 

marrs-guitar

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And the rest of Europe suffers? It's more and more a competition between 5 leagues and **** the rest.

Also, 36 team groups in a league? How big of a squad do you want. Remember this applies for CL, EL and EC.
It's not really any different to now though. In fact, one extra champion from a "small league" will get to take part than at present, and Ligue 1 will get an extra spot too.

I'm not sure what squad sizes have to do with anything as a team will only play - at most - 2 extra games than at present, and potentially exactly the same number. Realistically, this should be the right time to scrap the League Cup, which is completely outdated and long since devalued with the reserve teams that sides put out in it.
 
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sc91

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It's not really any different to now though.

In fact, one extra champion from a "small league" will get to take part than at present, and Ligue 1 will get an extra spot too.

I'm not sure what squad sizes have to do with anything as a team will only play 2 extra games than at present. Realistically, this should be the right time to scrap the League Cup, which is completely outdated and long since devalued with the reserve teams that sides put out in it.
Also, remember this is again coefficient base so that'll be more teams getting regular funds, least we not forget how hard it has been for us to break into the top 6.

I could understand if you were a Newcastle fan why you'd like this? But as a Wolves fan, it's just got even harder.
 

marrs-guitar

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Also, remember this is again coefficient base so that'll be more teams getting regular funds, least we not forget how hard it has been for us to break into the top 6.

I could understand if you were a Newcastle fan why you'd like this? But as a Wolves fan, it's just got even harder.
How when England will potentially get more clubs has to become harder for Wolves?

8th would almost certainly have brought European football this year under the future system. As it is will we get no European football despite finishing 8th in the strongest league in the world. And 7th sure as hell would have been in 2020 - so 3 European campaigns in 4 years for us potentially.

It opens a great chance for Wolves to regularly get into Europe and earn revenue from that path and as fans it offers more European trips, new opponents, more exposure in other countries.
 
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old wittonian

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I don't quite see the objections and the "closed shop" accusations, to be honest.

It's effectively just one potential extra CL spot at most for England, but only on the basis that English clubs have performed well in the previous season. If they haven't then the spot goes to another country.

The only major change is that it's one single league in the group stage rather than umpteen groups of 4.

Overall, Wolves have got a better chance of playing European football as a result.
I see it as a closed shop because it's based on historical results which in reality benefits a few big sides. Wasn't it a few years before the FA agreed to enter.
I wonder how many points teams like Rheims have accrued.
In the late 50's and early 60's they regularly appeared in the European Cup but have been in oblivion since it seems.
Perhaps we could apply this criteria to the FA Cup and allow Wanderers (if they still exist) into the competition at Round 3. After all they have won it 5 times, including 3 times on the trot.
History should count for nothing in my view.
 
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sc91

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How when England will potentially get more clubs has to become harder for Wolves?

8th would almost certainly have brought European football this year under the future system. As it is will we get no European football despite finishing 8th in the strongest league in the world. And 7th sure as hell would have been in 2020 - so 3 European campaigns in 4 years for us potentially.

It opens a great chance for Wolves to regularly get into Europe and earn revenue from that path.
How? We struggle now we have 6 clubs with greater revenue streams than others, we have one club waiting in the wings (Newcastle) to take those others spots. Then we have a raft of other clubs that are going to fight it out... and that's making it better?

8th, so you think with a squad our size the league style system that is being replicated in Europa Conference (which 8th would see us fall into), would be a good thing?
 

Black Country Wanderer

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Its a back door Super League,just what the big clubs wanted
Guaranteed CL for most of them as pretty much all have the best records in the competition over the last 5 years
Making it into a league gives them exactly what they wanted,a European Super League in all but name
The rest of it is to keep other clubs quiet
What value is it if half the league qualifies for European competition?
It should be earned not given
Personally i couldnt care less if we get into europe now or not,its been totally devalued imo
 

Jawwfc

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"Uefa will allow two clubs to enter the Champions League from 2024 based on historical performance, it has been agreed, but with the rankings determined by country and not club."

I'm guessing that will mean ourselves (as one of the pioneers of European Football) Forest ( more wins than Spurs, Arsenal and Man City combined) and Aston Villa as previous winners may all get a shot at it?

Basically it means if if one of the sky 6 under perform in the league then they'll be put in

We all know that UCL has a massive impact on financial revenue for clubs, so how will the league look at it from an FFP perspective? The team what gets put in would not have performed very well they will then get a huge boost to finance via the UCL.... doesn't seem very "Fair" to me.
 

WolfLing

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I see it as a closed shop because it's based on historical results which in reality benefits a few big sides. Wasn't it a few years before the FA agreed to enter.
I wonder how many points teams like Rheims have accrued.
In the late 50's and early 60's they regularly appeared in the European Cup but have been on oblivion since it seems.

Yes, if it were being done based on a club's individual performance.

My understanding of this system is that it's country based, not club based, which makes a huge difference.

What that means (if my understanding is correct) is that if England are one of the countries that gets an extra Champions League spot, but Man United have a terrible season and finish 10th, the 5th placed league side would get the extra space, not Man United based on their own individual historical coefficient.
 

marrs-guitar

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I see it as a closed shop because it's based on historical results which in reality benefits a few big sides. Wasn't it a few years before the FA agreed to enter.
I wonder how many points teams like Rheims have accrued.
In the late 50's and early 60's they regularly appeared in the European Cup but have been in oblivion since it seems.
Perhaps we could apply this criteria to the FA Cup and allow Wanderers (if they still exist) into the competition at Round 3. After all they have won it 5 times, including 3 times on the trot.
History should count for nothing in my view.
You're talking about ancient history that is completely detached from the current situations of clubs though.

The proposed system is merely whatever league performs best in the previous season gets 1 extra spot for its next best side (i.e. 5th place in England). Playing in Europe is already based on what you achieved in the previous season in any case.

When we played in the Europa League in 2019/20, it wasn't because of how we were performing in the PL in that same season, but on the historical result of our performance in 2018/19.
 
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Ned

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It’s safeguarding against reduced viewing figures and sponsorship if a “big” club fail to qualify. Sponsors want teams like Utd and players like Ronaldo in the competition that they’re sponsoring… so they’re going to get just that.
 

Timberwolf

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Lol…some of the frothing on this thread is hilarious.
It’s nothing like the Super League, it rewards a country’s performance in the previous year and not a ‘club coefficient’ and, increases Wolves chances of Euro qualifying if two of the big 6 make the previous years final.
If I’m not mistaken, this isn’t new. I’m sure this was the rule in the 80’s. If English clubs won the European Cup and Cup Winners Cup or UEFA Cup, the league was awarded extra places in the UEFA Cup (now Europa League)
 

Timberwolf

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It’s safeguarding against reduced viewing figures and sponsorship if a “big” club fail to qualify. Sponsors want teams like Utd and players like Ronaldo in the competition that they’re sponsoring… so they’re going to get just that.
Not if United finish 6th/7th or lower. It’s not an arbitrary award. It goes to the next team down so if its Wolves in 5th, we’d get Champions League.
 

Matt

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Yeah I don’t share the negativity tbh. As the PL is so strong it’s more likely to benefit us than disadvantage us imo. Getting to the CL, although still very unlikely, is easier to do in 5th than it is 4th! I’m glad they’ve ****ed off the club coefficient, that was nonsense.
 

jwolfie91

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I don't quite see the objections and the "closed shop" accusations, to be honest.

It's effectively just one potential extra CL spot at most for England, but only on the basis that English clubs have performed well in the previous season. If they haven't then the spot goes to another country.

The only major change is that it's one single league in the group stage rather than umpteen groups of 4.

Overall, Wolves have got a better chance of playing European football as a result.
Yeah it's just a way of adding in the extra teams to get the number up. Much better than before and not at all anti competitive. Anti competitive would be allowing more 3rd placed teams from lower leagues imo
 

jwolfie91

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Its a back door Super League,just what the big clubs wanted
Guaranteed CL for most of them as pretty much all have the best records in the competition over the last 5 years
Making it into a league gives them exactly what they wanted,a European Super League in all but name
The rest of it is to keep other clubs quiet
What value is it if half the league qualifies for European competition?
It should be earned not given
Personally i couldnt care less if we get into europe now or not,its been totally devalued imo
Try reading what the actual changes are
 

sedgwolf1980

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Firstly, one of the spots will go to an English side every single year, without fail. Secondly, how many times in the last 20 years has the top 5 featured any side other than the sky six? You can probably count it on one hand.

It doesn’t give clubs like Wolves, or even Newcastle more of a chance of qualifying, it helps to ensure that the status quo is even more confirmed.

UCL qualification = more money = greater FFP wiggle room = more money = UCL qualification

Thus the cycle continues.
 

Matt

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Firstly, one of the spots will go to an English side every single year, without fail. Secondly, how many times in the last 20 years has the top 5 featured any side other than the sky six? You can probably count it on one hand.

It doesn’t give clubs like Wolves, or even Newcastle more of a chance of qualifying, it helps to ensure that the status quo is even more confirmed.

UCL qualification = more money = greater FFP wiggle room = more money = UCL qualification

Thus the cycle continues.
So, same as it is now then?
 

jwolfie91

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"Uefa will allow two clubs to enter the Champions League from 2024 based on historical performance, it has been agreed, but with the rankings determined by country and not club."

I'm guessing that will mean ourselves (as one of the pioneers of European Football) Forest ( more wins than Spurs, Arsenal and Man City combined) and Aston Villa as previous winners may all get a shot at it?

Basically it means if if one of the sky 6 under perform in the league then they'll be put in

We all know that UCL has a massive impact on financial revenue for clubs, so how will the league look at it from an FFP perspective? The team what gets put in would not have performed very well they will then get a huge boost to finance via the UCL.... doesn't seem very "Fair" to me.
How I'd it possible people can quote a passage then read the complete opposite. Bolded somethings to help you out.
 

Sedgley Gold N Black

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From my understanding of this, in the past three seasons Leicester would have twice been the one to benefit from CL football, Arsenal once with ourselves, Arsenal and Spurs having gained a EL campaign in that time.

Even this season if you throw in potentially Spurs it hasn’t favoured the ‘six’ any more than the best of the rest.

It’s not great for the rest of Europe though with it being almost guaranteed an additional space for the PL with Spain and Germany squabbling over the other. Presumably something for the PL clubs being the first to pull out the super league.
 

jwolfie91

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From my understanding of this, in the past three seasons Leicester would have twice been the one to benefit from CL football, Arsenal once with ourselves, Arsenal and Spurs having gained a EL campaign in that time.

Even this season if you throw in potentially Spurs it hasn’t favoured the ‘six’ any more than the best of the rest.

It’s not great for the rest of Europe though with it being almost guaranteed an additional space for the PL with Spain and Germany squabbling over the other. Presumably something for the PL clubs being the first to pull out the super league.
Holland got the extra space this time
 

sc91

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Yeah I don’t share the negativity tbh. As the PL is so strong it’s more likely to benefit us than disadvantage us imo. Getting to the CL, although still very unlikely, is easier to do in 5th than it is 4th! I’m glad they’ve ****ed off the club coefficient, that was nonsense.
So with 6 super rich clubs we've managed to get 7th, with the door open for another super rich club able to gain more traction... we are going to make 5th?

I'm struggling with this logic.
 

Ian

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As there wouldn’t be a champions league/ European cup without us being directly involved in its formation , we should be in it every season on “ historical’ basis.
 

Hanbury_Wolf

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So with 6 super rich clubs we've managed to get 7th, with the door open for another super rich club able to gain more traction... we are going to make 5th?

I'm struggling with this logic.
No. The point is the rule changes don't particularly hinder wolves. We're hindered already by the things you mentioned

All this means in reality is that 5th place now becomes a regular champions league spot for England with EL and ECL going down a place as a result.

5th is still a long shot for Wolves but surely people must see that gives us a slightly increased chance?

Newcastle may emerge regardless of any change so they don't need to be part of this debate
 
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