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Chiquinho

jwolfie91

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While that's part of the problem, it's not going to have that huge a difference. Not with our current forwards, anyway. What was it in those first 3 games? 65 shots and no goals? Of course it's true "Haaland would struggle to score in our team". But keep everything else the same, if we had him, he would be our top scorer.

Our forwards don't have to do everything. Hold off a defender and get a powerful shot in. That's what they need to do. They are given opportunities for that, yet just don't do it enough, because they can't do it. Being able to make and/or find space and/or winning a battle with a defender when there is no space. Our forwards are inconsisent and below par at all of this. . Swap Jota for Fabio, leave everything else the same, and Liverpools goals total drops and ours increases.

What midfielder is going to thrive when told "oh, don't put the ball in the air, we have no aerial presence"? And "don't play the ball in behind, our forwards can't keep up and haven't got the anticipation and will probably be way out wide anyway". "Just take long shots yourself, that's your best bet". :)
Our midfielders have plenty of opportunities to play players in and never do. Game after game they turn down hard passes for sideways ones
 

Contrarian

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Our midfielders have plenty of opportunities to play players in and never do. Game after game they turn down hard passes for sideways ones

Yes, that doesn't help. But our forwards have all played with other midfielders at other clubs and still been far from prolific. Even Raul, when we signed him, was a bit of a gamble. We seem to shop for out-of-favour forwards, in the hope that we will strike lucky. You know how some striker that's hardly noticed for years, suddenly becomes the next big thing? Like Vardy, perhaps. Rather than fork out the big money, it's like they would rather buy 5 lesser known players and hope one turns into the next Raul.

I think the sideways/backward is so deeply ingrained in the players who have been here years. Donk is the worst at it, regularly pinging the ball back where it came from. But they all do it, to an extent. It's not even safety first football as opponents who are pressing high can win the ball back and frequently do, hence turning a possible counter attack into us last ditch defending.
 

RMNottm

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Yes, that doesn't help. But our forwards have all played with other midfielders at other clubs and still been far from prolific. Even Raul, when we signed him, was a bit of a gamble. We seem to shop for out-of-favour forwards, in the hope that we will strike lucky. You know how some striker that's hardly noticed for years, suddenly becomes the next big thing? Like Vardy, perhaps. Rather than fork out the big money, it's like they would rather buy 5 lesser known players and hope one turns into the next Raul.

I think the sideways/backward is so deeply ingrained in the players who have been here years. Donk is the worst at it, regularly pinging the ball back where it came from. But they all do it, to an extent. It's not even safety first football as opponents who are pressing high can win the ball back and frequently do, hence turning a possible counter attack into us last ditch defending.
Should not be so bad if there was much more movement so pass back had options but we are so risk adverse we invite the pressure we are trying to avoid
 

Bawtry Wolf

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Should not be so bad if there was much more movement so pass back had options but we are so risk adverse we invite the pressure we are trying to avoid
When we first started with Nuno the pass back to the Centre Half or Neves was in order to switch the play quickly from one side to another and pull the opposition out of shape. Ot also helped being a counter attacking team so we’d try to pull teams onto us to attack the space behind. Often in the Championship we were facing 10 men behind the ball. However it has become completely ineffective because a) players are not finding space b) the opposition know what we are trying to do so simply stay in shape and don’t allow us to get behind. Our lack of mobility in midfield means that no one has to track runners from deep and therefore just mark the forwards and hey presto we’re completely nullified and have to hope one player has an inspirational moment.
 

WolfLing

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When we first started with Nuno the pass back to the Centre Half or Neves was in order to switch the play quickly from one side to another and pull the opposition out of shape. Ot also helped being a counter attacking team so we’d try to pull teams onto us to attack the space behind. Often in the Championship we were facing 10 men behind the ball. However it has become completely ineffective because a) players are not finding space b) the opposition know what we are trying to do so simply stay in shape and don’t allow us to get behind. Our lack of mobility in midfield means that no one has to track runners from deep and therefore just mark the forwards and hey presto we’re completely nullified and have to hope one player has an inspirational moment.

I think it's also now become a bit of a comfort blanket for our players. Easier to keep possession and knock it back than look for that difficult ball down the channel, or taking on an opponent.

It's why the likes of Chiquinho have been so refreshing. He plays with a youthful enthusiasm (and naivety) that's great to see. He hasn't had all the adventure coached out of him!!
 

NewOrder306

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I think it's also now become a bit of a comfort blanket for our players. Easier to keep possession and knock it back than look for that difficult ball down the channel, or taking on an opponent.

It's why the likes of Chiquinho have been so refreshing. He plays with a youthful enthusiasm (and naivety) that's great to see. He hasn't had all the adventure coached out of him!!
Him and Toti will be regulars next season, mix that with 3-4 new names and Semedo/Kilman back, Neto/Podence fully fit, it will look more positive....:p
 

jwolfie91

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Yeah he is a player for sure, wide attackers ain't really a big concern for me vs midfield/CB and a central ST option.

Hwang deal being cancelled would be good news though.
 

YouGottaRaulWithIt

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When Traore comes back for pre-season, Chiquinho can teach him about decision making, how to pass, when to pass, when to take a player on, when to keep going and not slow play, how to cross etc.
You've got to hold and give
But do it at the right time
You can be slow or fast
But you must get to the line
They'll always hit you and hurt you
Defend and attack
There's only one way to beat them
Get 'round the back
 

Lupo Italiano

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Mighty Thor

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Who needs him when the Korean Maradona is creeping around with his mind altering cookies?
Lage is surely an undercover baggie on an undercover mission? I can’t see how he can get so much, so wrong, so much of the time.

It’s like he is no doing it deliberately just to cause me stress.

Bruno, **** off mate.
 

Chris H

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Why the hell would you loan this guy out. I despair.

There are no quotes where he says that, he talks more generally about the younger players and whether they could/should be loaned out, about what is the right decision for each of them for their development and for the club.
 

Chisels_n_ommers

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If you read Bruno comments he is talking about how well Chiqinho has done in glowing terms. He then talks about other youngsters and says about loans in reference to "them" e.g Chem Campbell.

He doesn't say about loaning him (Chiqinho) out, he talks about loans of youngsters (them) in general.

He was clearly talking after watching the U23s win the play off.

Poor headline, misleading article.
 

Golden_Wolf

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If you read Bruno comments he is talking about how well Chiqinho has done in glowing terms. He then talks about other youngsters and says about loans in reference to "them" e.g Chem Campbell.

He doesn't say about loaning him (Chiqinho) out, he talks about loans of youngsters (them) in general.

He was clearly talking after watching the U23s win the play off.

Poor headline, misleading article.

I think those quotes are from a different interview, like last week or something. Could swear I've seen them before, just not sure in what article.

Typical E&S bull**** headline though.
 

steve vena

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You've got to hold and give
But do it at the right time
You can be slow or fast
But you must get to the line
They'll always hit you and hurt you
Defend and attack
There's only one way to beat them
Get 'round the back
The quite brilliant New Order of course.
 

LosgallardosWolf

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Read today that Lage is considering sending him on loan next season. If this is true it just confirms he should get the chop
 

Chisels_n_ommers

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Anyway, Bruno might be looking at coaching Chiqinho to be the new Trent (playing him at wingback as he has done), with the terrific whipped cross from deeper positions ;)
 

JOSWolf

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Why the hell would you loan this guy out. I despair.


Madness. Keep him here. An exciting talent who will get better and better and should be part of our squad yet they consider loaning him out.
 

Rangiora Wolf

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There are no quotes where he says that, he talks more generally about the younger players and whether they could/should be loaned out, about what is the right decision for each of them for their development and for the club.
You are right. I should've actually read the article and not just the headline.
 

Hoganstolemywife

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Why do people not read the actual article instead of just the headline? Especially before commenting?

Genuinely interested
Information generation. We've all got very small attention spans. A good heurestic is that the headline summarises the article and can thus save valuable time
 

Minimalist

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I don’t really see what what’s wrong with a loan for him. Obviously depends on what the rest of our squad looks like; but if we plan, for example, to play 343 and in our squad we have Neto, Podence, MGW, Guedes, Traore and yes- even this weeks devil incarnate/scapegoat himself- Hwang...
Then sending Chiquinho out on loan for the first half of the season wouldn’t be anything but a sensible decision. In fact if Chiquinho was considered anything’s below the 4th choice wide player then I’d be happy if he went on loan, can always come back in January.
Same kind of scenario applies to Mosquera. imo.
 

SoCal_Wolf

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I don’t really see what what’s wrong with a loan for him. Obviously depends on what the rest of our squad looks like; but if we plan, for example, to play 343 and in our squad we have Neto, Podence, MGW, Guedes, Traore and yes- even this weeks devil incarnate/scapegoat himself- Hwang...
Then sending Chiquinho out on loan for the first half of the season wouldn’t be anything but a sensible decision. In fact if Chiquinho was considered anything’s below the 4th choice wide player then I’d be happy if he went on loan, can always come back in January.
Same kind of scenario applies to Mosquera. imo.
It’s a very sensible position to take as we’re developing young players. The season before this one was a complete waste for MGW…I’ve always supported the decision to go and get regular minutes with Sheffield Utd. Chiquinho is an exciting player, direct and fearless with a good whip of a cross; but, he’s raw in terms of positioning. So, if he’s blocked from regular minutes, then it might make sense for him to go to a good Championship side.

I hope that he isn’t blocked and we have a good target man in the box for him to aim at next season. We need the physical presence that he brings!
 

Zico

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Absolutely typical of the E&S, it's a tabloid rag that runs clickbait headlines. The actual reference to a loan in the article is a throwaway opinion by the alleged journalist. Don't know why anybody reads it any more.

Of course, if they actually were to consider loaning him out, that would be madness! But I'll wait until that happens before hitting the roof.
 

lets all have a disco

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People need to wait and see what happens...if Bruno does only want 4 or 5 wide forwards options and it's Guedes, Rafa Silva , Neto, Gibbs and one of podence or hwang , the chiquhino may go on loan....
 

1972 i began

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Why the hell would you loan this guy out. I despair.


I've bin a supporter of Bruno,but if this comes to fruition.He can DO ONE..Must admit I've not read the article,just responded to posts.
 

Bognor_Wolf

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Some real over the top reaction to this... Chiquinho is a talent but still has a lot to learn, a loan wouldn't be the worse thing for him go away and play regularly and develop also options next season might be stronger if we bring someone else in plus with Gibbs-White hopefully coming back his game time here might be abit more limited....
 

Black Country Wanderer

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An article taken out of context and jumped on before really understanding what Bruno has actually said
All he has said is if young players can progress and get adequate game time with the first team then great,if not a loan to play more games is beneficial
I see nothing wrong with that at all
On Chico in particular he is still very raw,although a very exciting prospect,if he can learn the basics with the first team fine, but as Bruno says,not just with Chico, it may just benefit the team and the player to have a spell on loan,it all depends on how the squad shapes up over the summer
 

wolvesjoe

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From following the development of younger players at Wolves, it does seem to me that we need to make greater
use of loans for talented players who are just not getting enough time at Wolves to develop.

Fabio and Hoever are the obvious players this last season, who would have benefitted. Next season I would
also include Cundle and Mosquera in desperate need to that rites of passage.

It will require a bigger shift of perspective, however, towards carrying a bigger squad and getting used to more
player trading each summer as younger players come back ready to compete for a first team place. At the moment
we seem very passive on this front, preferring to fill up the squad with younger players, rather than allowing them
to properly develop.

It seems that it was MGW himself who addressed his own situation, rather than any pro-active policy by the club. If
they had had their way, then he would have been included as a squad player for the season.

Sometimes, however, players just seem ready, as with Chiquinho, Kilman, RAN, Lescott and Keane to go back a bit. Maturity
is linked to physical development and age, of course, but more often than not, I would argue, its just too big a jump and
that developmental year is required.

More generally, one can also see that this is indicative of how the club is run: conservatively, as few risks as possible, stick with
what you have than try anything new. Its a worrying pattern.
 
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