CB's and a midfielder you say?

[Lisas Husband]

I say no.
I see we'll lose Saiss and Boly to the Afcon, which will leave us short for a few games, but bejayzus, our midfield has minimal idea on how to start an attack and our forwards have minimal idea how to deal with one.
For me we need at least ONE starting attacking midfielder and at least ONE striker.
Raul is of God status, I get that, but I also see that he needs competition.
We're not scoring, scoring brings the chance of 3 points. Defending doesn't.
Our front line needs work badly and we also need to realise that an out ball doesn't need to keep coming back at us. Keep ball Ffs

 

[Antonline1987]

I agree we need a midfielder that can carry the ball forward and needing a striker but I don't think the forward line needs major work if we had a more attack minded midfield there would be less of a gap between the midfield and forward line meaning raul wouldn't need to drop as deep and could be in the box more don't think trincao is gonna cut it imo

 

[Deleted member 8455jwf]

I say no.
I see we'll lose Saiss and Boly to the Afcon, which will leave us short for a few games, but bejayzus, our midfield has minimal idea on how to start an attack and our forwards have minimal idea how to deal with one.
For me we need at least ONE starting attacking midfielder and at least ONE striker.
Raul is of God status, I get that, but I also see that he needs competition.
We're not scoring, scoring brings the chance of 3 points. Defending doesn't.
Our front line needs work badly and we also need to realise that an out ball doesn't need to keep coming back at us. Keep ball Ffs

CB isn't a big issue for me either, CM absolutely huge issue although all 3 did well today and always would in a game like that they don't do nearly enough against teams who defend

 

[OLDGOLD]

I say no.
I see we'll lose Saiss and Boly to the Afcon, which will leave us short for a few games, but bejayzus, our midfield has minimal idea on how to start an attack and our forwards have minimal idea how to deal with one.
For me we need at least ONE starting attacking midfielder and at least ONE striker.
Raul is of God status, I get that, but I also see that he needs competition.
We're not scoring, scoring brings the chance of 3 points. Defending doesn't.
Our front line needs work badly and we also need to realise that an out ball doesn't need to keep coming back at us. Keep ball Ffs

Raul sadly is currently a shadow of his former self. Let's hope he gets his mojo back. That said he is feeding on scraps.

 

[Matt]

CB is an issue though, in that we play 3 centre backs and have 3 centre backs fit. Boly back now but his injury record is shocking over the past couple of years.

 

[RMNottm]

Still think we need a pacey centre back, this game plays to Coady's strengths and he was immense today. In an expansive game it is a different story. Same for Mouts. CM is the big issue; RAN, Traore and Kilman drove forward but not midfielders really.

We will have to make additions as there are few players over 30 or 35 (almost).


Might not be too bad next season if we can keep the crown jewels and add a few.

 

[Bugsy911]

We have issues front to back and really need about 4/5 first 11 players in to shake it up with 2 or 3 having proven scoring records.

 

[JOSWolf]

Who plays at the back with Coady and Kilman then? We need another defender on top of the midfield options and another attacking player.

 

[Deleted member LP 3925]

What a silly thread. Let’s not mess about, let’s buy a pacey centre back, dynamic midfielder AND a striker as competition for Raul, Hwang, Silva, Neto, Trincao and Adama.

Positive thoughts encourage positive purchases.

 

[BCWolf]

Need another CB if only because we lose Boly and Saiss for a month. Unless Sanderson is brought back and we utilize Hoever/Marcal, none of whom is good enough for a team allegedly desiring a top 6 finish.

Definitely need a midfielder in the Sanches style and wouldnt say no to a striker either given Raul's struggles.

 

[Contrarian]

I say no.
I see we'll lose Saiss and Boly to the Afcon, which will leave us short for a few games, but bejayzus, our midfield has minimal idea on how to start an attack and our forwards have minimal idea how to deal with one.
For me we need at least ONE starting attacking midfielder and at least ONE striker.
Raul is of God status, I get that, but I also see that he needs competition.
We're not scoring, scoring brings the chance of 3 points. Defending doesn't.
Our front line needs work badly and we also need to realise that an out ball doesn't need to keep coming back at us. Keep ball Ffs

I agree! On the Afcon, we have enough cover already. It's only a few weeks. Transfer dealings just to cover a tournament is ridiculous. The Afcon finishes. Then what for the rest of the season? Back to 0-0 v Norwich and Burnley? The midfield to front line - it's certainly not getting better. Watching other teams win their 50/50s and make neat passes, we manage that so rarely, I'm not even sure its the tactics. Our midfield 3, for example, good defensively, but rarely play an incisive ball forward. Then when they do, our forwards are second to it, or miscontrol it. Safe passes seem fine, key passes are non-existant.

Am not going to get too bothered by the last two 1-0 defeats. But the next match becomes crucial. Poor performance there, and our season starts sinking in a similar alarming way to last season. It's 95% the same players, after all, so can't expect too different.

 

[tamwolf]

I think we need another centre back to allow us to play 4 at the back and help us be more expansive. We also need midfielders as well as we lack creativity in this area.

To me it's not an either/or situation. To improve we need players front to back. Teams regularly stagnate in the Premier League as they accept what they have.

 

[Pengwern]

Still think we need a pacey centre back, this game plays to Coady's strengths and he was immense today. In an expansive game it is a different story. Same for Mouts. CM is the big issue; RAN, Traore and Kilman drove forward but not midfielders really.

We will have to make additions as there are few players over 30 or 35 (almost).


Might not be too bad next season if we can keep the crown jewels and add a few.

mosquero is rapid

 

[VancouverWolf]

Raul sadly is currently a shadow of his former self. Let's hope he gets his mojo back. That said he is feeding on scraps.

Play Raul with Silva and Podence. Silva will work as hard as Hwang but can hold onto the ball better.
And Podence is our most creative attacking player……he’ll lay on the balls for Raul or Silva.

 

[Krispy Kreme]

Everyone praising Kilman rightly so.

But if people think we could just start playing like Liverpool and our defenders would look as solid as they do then they are wrong.

It's a gradual process if we want to become more attacking and I feel Bruno is doing all he can with the lack of investment.

 

[Contrarian]

I think we need another centre back to allow us to play 4 at the back and help us be more expansive. We also need midfielders as well as we lack creativity in this area.

To me it's not an either/or situation. To improve we need players front to back. Teams regularly stagnate in the Premier League as they accept what they have.

Agreed that we can improve everywhere. Though I do think we have the foundation of a top defence already in place and I would rather build on it than tear it up and throw it away. I think they have little to do with our not scoring, this season. Once they move the ball on, it's the rest of the team that fails to deliver. Off ball movement doesn't look good, too many players with questionable (or zero) decision making, poor passing, lightweight, no composure when finishing, bad positioning and so on.

 

[Novawolf1]

Agreed that we can improve everywhere. Though I do think we have the foundation of a top defence already in place and I would rather build on it than tear it up and throw it away. I think they have little to do with our not scoring, this season. Once they move the ball on, it's the rest of the team that fails to deliver. Off ball movement doesn't look good, too many players with questionable (or zero) decision making, poor passing, lightweight, no composure when finishing, bad positioning and so on.

As I said on the Verdict thread our coaching has been excellent in the defensive side of the game.. but we’re falling down in the speed and accuracy of our pass and move combinations going forward. It’s not about replacing or bringing in individuals in my view, we need to develop accuracy, know-how and confidence in the forward momentum of the whole team..UTW

 

[Contrarian]

As I said on the Verdict thread our coaching has been excellent in the defensive side of the game.. but we’re falling down in the speed and accuracy of our pass and move combinations going forward. It’s not about replacing or bringing in individuals in my view, we need to develop accuracy, know-how and confidence in the forward momentum of the whole team..UTW

I've kind of given up hope of them doing it, after what seems like more than a year of speed and accuracy mostly gone to pieces! As you say, though, these are top level footballers, they *should* be able to manage it. I don't quite get what's going wrong. Sometimes, it's lack of movement or predictable movement, leaving nothing for the passer. Sometimes (and this happened a few times today) we just seem to get out-battled, which is not like us.

Maybe there is a lack of confidence in that forward momentum. The other thing we do often is not take the chance to get forward, choosing to slow things down just inside our own half instead. I think that is where we used to be much better, accelerating forward, not slowing.

 

[WolfInSheep'sClothing]

Everyone praising Kilman rightly so.

But if people think we could just start playing like Liverpool and our defenders would look as solid as they do then they are wrong.

It's a gradual process if we want to become more attacking and I feel Bruno is doing all he can with the lack of investment.

To play like Liverpool would require a lot more athleticism in the middle of the park, athleticism we don't really have.

 

[Novawolf1]

Yes…. I seem to notice it most when the full backs do ..or don’t…get involved as effectively as they should. I guess we could also point to the fact we don’t maximise goals from midfielders from the edge of the penalty area…Neves loss of his shooting mojo hasn’t helped compared to the early Nuno years..

 

[WolfInSheep'sClothing]

CB is an issue though, in that we play 3 centre backs and have 3 centre backs fit. Boly back now but his injury record is shocking over the past couple of years.

Take the opportunity to move to 4 at the back over that period. We are gonna have to live without Saiss for a bit, let's see what we are like with a back 4. Let's see if we should be getting another centre back or a centre forward.

 

[Matt]

Take the opportunity to move to 4 at the back over that period. We are gonna have to live without Saiss for a bit, let's see what we are like with a back 4. Let's see if we should be getting another centre back or a centre forward.

I disagree. I don’t really understand the desire for a back 4, and if we do switch to a back 4 there are question marks over all of our current centre backs.

 

[Bugsy911]

I disagree. I don’t really understand the desire for a back 4, and if we do switch to a back 4 there are question marks over all of our current centre backs.

We need an extra body going forward, without proper centre backs it can't happen so without a radical player turn over were stuck.

It should have happened in the summer.

 

[Matt]

We need an extra body going forward, without proper centre backs it can't happen so without a radical player turn over were stuck.

It should have happened in the summer.

Totally agree. The problem we’ve left ourselves with is that it’s not that we need one or the other, we need signings in defence, midfield and attack because we’ve left ourselves so short for so long.

 

[Jd132]

It's not really a case of one or the other. We need genuine upgrades across the pitch if we are going to improve. My choices would be:

Milenkovic (6'5", 24, right footed, Serbian who would allow Kilman to move to LCB)

Renato Sanches (5'9", 24, dynamic midfielder with some defensive instincts)

Matheus Nunes (6'0", 23, Portuguese attacking midfielder who will start unlocking defences)

Darwin Nunez (6'1", 22, Uruguayan, Striker who can also play on the left and has 11 goals in 18 games this year)

That would leave us with a team looking something like this in a 352: Sa, Milenkovic, Coady, Kilman, Semedo, Neves, Ait-Nouri, Sanches, Nunes, Raul, Nunez.

And, if we ever needed to switch to a back four to break down a team, it would mean simply Neto in for Coady for 433: Sa, Semedo, Milenkovic, Kilman, Ait-Nouri, Neves, Sanches, Nunes, Neto, Raul, Nunez.

Having Sanches and Nunes would completely remould the relationship between our midfield and attack which is where the breakdown is currently occuring. Plus Nunez might actually start putting the ball in the back of the net.

 

[Jamwolf]

There is no way that Lage is dropping Coady this season.

 

[NewarkWolf]

mosquero is rapid

Not now he won't be with his twisted hamstrings about to ping everytime!

 

[hollo]

What about the braga midfielder musrati as he would be cheaper?

 

[WolfInSheep'sClothing]

I disagree. I don’t really understand the desire for a back 4, and if we do switch to a back 4 there are question marks over all of our current centre backs.

In the past I shared your sentiment, when it felt like we were taking apart a succesful approach, with a squad that had been built around a 3-4-3/ 5-2-3/5-4-1.Currently we are second worst in the division when it comes to goalscoring. This isn't all due to the impotency of our front three, although it has played a part. For me the biggest factor around why I think we should change is that our wingbacks are more suited to playing full back; and they've added a positional discipline to their game that they maybe lacked last time we tried to make the change.
Roy Keane made a comment when we first made the switch last year, that we were a better watch because we were essentially swapping a defender for an extra attacker. I don't agree with this in principle; if the system is working properly the wingbacks are every bit as much wingers as they are full backs. But currently for us it isn't. They don't offer enough attacking threat.
Then we have the make up of the squad.
Mosquera, Boly, Saiss, Coady, Kilman are all centre-backs. Coady Kilman and Saiss have all performed admirably this year.
As discussed many times on this forum we are due to lose Saiss and Boly to the ACON. We can spend money in getting cover, but really any money to spend in January needs to address the problem of scoring goals, and getting in another midfielder.
Ideally, for us to be playing attacking football in a 3-4-3 with the 2 players per position mantra we would need one attacking wing back, one central midfielder, a some ins/outs with regards to the 3 forwards as well as cover for centre half.
If we switch to a 4-4-2/4-2-4 it becomes 1 central midfielder, one striker and some shuffling around of the wingers we have.
I do worry about our midfield for us in transition with us in a 4 but Brighton represents a good team to test it out defence. They don't score many themselves, especially on the counter. Their patient possesion football hinders them in that regard a little. Chelsea represents another to push the wingers forward to pin them back to a back 5 , in a similar way that mancini did in the final of the euros.
I don't know how it will go, but given the lack of scoring, and the timing with regards to ACON and the transfer window, the time seems right to give it another go.

 

[MasWolf]

I don't care what position they play as long as we get a player who can actually shoot. I'm getting sick of all this pass it round outside the box but not ever have any shots or put the ball in.

 

[reanswolf]

I've kind of given up hope of them doing it, after what seems like more than a year of speed and accuracy mostly gone to pieces! As you say, though, these are top level footballers, they *should* be able to manage it. I don't quite get what's going wrong. Sometimes, it's lack of movement or predictable movement, leaving nothing for the passer. Sometimes (and this happened a few times today) we just seem to get out-battled, which is not like us.

Maybe there is a lack of confidence in that forward momentum. The other thing we do often is not take the chance to get forward, choosing to slow things down just inside our own half instead. I think that is where we used to be much better, accelerating forward, not slowing.

I don't feel its complicated.
I know its flippin obvious, but we simply have not got the mobility in any of our central midfielders, tho technically gifted they are too slow to transition from defence to attack and if they try to move forward with the ball they get picked off like flies.

 

[Bacon Sandwich]

It's not really a case of one or the other. We need genuine upgrades across the pitch if we are going to improve. My choices would be:

Milenkovic (6'5", 24, right footed, Serbian who would allow Kilman to move to LCB)

Renato Sanches (5'9", 24, dynamic midfielder with some defensive instincts)

Matheus Nunes (6'0", 23, Portuguese attacking midfielder who will start unlocking defences)

Darwin Nunez (6'1", 22, Uruguayan, Striker who can also play on the left and has 11 goals in 18 games this year)

That would leave us with a team looking something like this in a 352: Sa, Milenkovic, Coady, Kilman, Semedo, Neves, Ait-Nouri, Sanches, Nunes, Raul, Nunez.

And, if we ever needed to switch to a back four to break down a team, it would mean simply Neto in for Coady for 433: Sa, Semedo, Milenkovic, Kilman, Ait-Nouri, Neves, Sanches, Nunes, Neto, Raul, Nunez.

Having Sanches and Nunes would completely remould the relationship between our midfield and attack which is where the breakdown is currently occuring. Plus Nunez might actually start putting the ball in the back of the net.

Mate, could you stop dicking about on the Forum and get your **** down the Mol? Find a door with "Director of Football" on it and sit behind the desk. If some ******** called Shi tries to interfere tell him to **** off

 

[Mile End Wanderer]

We need a snotter and some creativity as for our cb issue I’d recall Sanderson it will save us millions

I’d personally go all out for Konrad Laimer of RB Leipzig he can play all across the middle and rb or …. Richard Sanchez at Club AMERICA box to box midfielder and Paraguay international he certainly would be cheaper option at 10m

 

[Contrarian]

I don't feel its complicated.
I know its flippin obvious, but we simply have not got the mobility in any of our central midfielders, tho technically gifted they are too slow to transition from defence to attack and if they try to move forward with the ball they get picked off like flies.

Yes, it's the players. 3 midfielders with similar weaknesses. Which is why when we've gone 4 at the back, or any other attempt at a more positive formation... the goals still don't flow. Rapid breaks or long balls, mroe "incisive" attacks, rather than sustained pressure has always been how we played. Because thats's what we have the players for. Any significant change of style needs a significant change of players. Perhaps a gradual evolving as we don't want to throw away the good parts of what we already have. It's a pipe dream to expect any manager could come in and turn our squad into free scoring footballing style by some formation adjustment.