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Burnt out, Tired or maybe getting complacent?

Mark Rankines Lovechild

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I am worried about saying this but..are the players burnt out / tired or is it complacency or even a slight lack of desire?

I am worried that Nuno is even having to say we lack speed / tempo, not making runs / turns we should and we need to get on the training pitch. For the first two seasons our work ethic has set us apart from other teams but this now seems to have dropped off a little to me. Surely the things Nuno is talking about should be a given and what our rise from the Championship have been based upon.

Lookman came on Sunday and changed the game for Fulham. I would argue that he isn't technically more gifted than Podence, Traore, Neto but what he brought was a desire and enthusiasm to take the game to the opposition that we seemed to sadly lack. I would say Neto was the least culpable for this accusation but surely Podence (particularly) and Traore shouldnt be tired after sitting on our bench.

I wonder if they dont all need an old fashioned rocket up the **** to shake us out of our malaise. I am not just talking about our wingers either, Boly, Saiss, Neves, Moutinho etc are all looking very casual.
 
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Keyser Soze

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I think we’re more talking about a lack of fitness and some team cohesion from the new approach and confidence, all of which will improve game by game

I think the players remain committed and have the required desire, they’re at the club because they’re those kind of characters
 

WeAreTheWolvesII

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I get your concerns but I don't think Sunday is the time to judge them.

Any failure to win after the ****show at West Ham would've caused uproar, so it was ultimately all about the result and despite Fulham's early season struggles, they weren't as bad as people thought. They played well at Leeds, matched Villa in terms of shots but were weak defensively and had a goal disallowed that could've made things interesting.

Confidence was probably low after West Ham and it's a game we were expected to win but if we had won 4-0 I can be sure people would've said 'it's only Fulham'.

Leeds will be a huge test and a better idea to see if those concerns are justified.
 
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BGreenWolf

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We played a record-setting season last time out, had no pre-season worth speaking of, are trying to embed new players, on top of tweaking the system. Probably fair to say that we're a little tired, yeah.
 
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He also brought fresh legs against a side that had already played 70 minutes of football.
 

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Could it be a mix of all of those, to some degree? Either way, the Leeds match is going to be fascinating, because the Leeds team are the ones currently playing with energy and vibrancy. Even though technically, they are not at our standard. The are nowhere near Man City or Liverpool technical standard either, but gave both a real match.

To me it seems that when you look at whose doing OK and whose falling short of their usual standard, it's those who have been around longest and are most secure. Overall, it's Neto, Podence, Killman, Semedo who have had some energy and drive. Where Raul, Neves, Moutinho, Saiss, Boly.... are the ones running through treacle and going through the motions. Nobody should be beyond dropping for a match or two and if their replacement does well, the ex-established regular needs to wait and fight for their chance to get back in, regardless of lucrative new contracts.
 

sillytuna

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Like all the sides in Europe, we looked tired. Imagine the meltdown here if Villa had done that to us - well they did it to Liverpool!

We also had the longest season of anyone last year.

I do wonder if we need to give the youngsters more of a chance and give Neves and Moutinho in particular a rest.
 

Mark Rankines Lovechild

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Moutinho and then Adama who just stood upfront.

I dont disagree with that but why did it happen?
i would also ask why, when the players were fresh, did we not see Podence make a single run (as I recall) with the directness that Lookman demonstrated?

Wolves, in most of our games thus far look worryingly passive... it almost like we just expect something will happen rather than when we made things happen.
 

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I wouldn't say our legs are fresh though.

To ease your concerns I'd look at how City and United have played since the return, teams in the same position as us.

I think City have had problems for a while. And similar to Liverpool, it's nothing to do with "stale legs". It's that carefull prepared opponents are working out how to play against the ridiculous high press those teams do. And United just have a bad manager. :)
 

those were the days

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I think it simply reflects the fact that we haven't had any sort of pre-season. The majority of our players went straight into the international break and came back for 2-3 days training prior to Sheffield United. An international training camp is nowhere near as intensive as a pre-season camp and most of the players on international duty didn't get 2x90 minutes either. I think only Moutinho started both games in fact.

Most of the teams we've faced had completed at least 3 pre-season friendlies before the first international break and so their players were far closer to full match sharpness. Worth bearing in mind that pre-season is usually about a month long and with 3-4 friendlies at least. If the Wolves players are currently only at 90-95% fitness levels it can make a huge difference in terms of tempo, pace, intensity, etc. and I think that's largely responsible.

Why the Nations League wasn't binned off this year I don't know. I also think Wolves should have had an extra weeks break like Man United and Man City but that's another matter,

I think most of the other stuff the OP raises on complacency or a lack of desire is a red herring myself
 

Mark Rankines Lovechild

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Like all the sides in Europe, we looked tired. Imagine the meltdown here if Villa had done that to us - well they did it to Liverpool!

We also had the longest season of anyone last year.

I do wonder if we need to give the youngsters more of a chance and give Neves and Moutinho in particular a rest.

Again thats all very true but there was again two months lay off with zero football. I do think new faces and an absence of pre-season has not helped.
 

sc91

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I think City have had problems for a while. And similar to Liverpool, it's nothing to do with "stale legs". It's that carefull prepared opponents are working out how to play against the ridiculous high press those teams do. And United just have a bad manager. :)
I think its fully on a high press on tired/unprepared legs.
 

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Like all the sides in Europe, we looked tired. Imagine the meltdown here if Villa had done that to us - well they did it to Liverpool!

We also had the longest season of anyone last year.

I do wonder if we need to give the youngsters more of a chance and give Neves and Moutinho in particular a rest.

Like all sides in Europe apart from Red Bull Leipzig, Sevilla, Inter Milan, Bayern., PSG, Lyon, Real etc etc... ?

And Atalanta are the form team in Europe at the moment. Sorry, but this is just a myth and the evidence doesn't back up the theory that teams playing late in Europe last season are all struggling now. Only us. With Man C and Liverpool arguably, each having lost only 1 match, not that dismal. "You can't look at the table now". Just watch one or both of them embark on a 25 match unbeaten run...
 
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wallace

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We needed traore to get himself about rather than trundle around when he came on. Podence wasn't his usual sharp self after injury operating on 75% of his know ability while jimenez was a bit lost without his usual service from the wingbacks and no one to play through the opposition defence with one twos. A game we needed to win and we did with things set to improve after internationals when Nuno can get his players together again. Much better to come when this happens. The future is Wolves.
 

sedgwolf1980

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As I pointed out on another thread, in the next month we only have 3 games. It’s effectively our pre season.
 

modenawolf

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I think it's a combination of a really long season last year, no pre-season this year and a lack of time on the training pitch for new signings to integrate and learn the system.
 
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I dont disagree with that but why did it happen?
i would also ask why, when the players were fresh, did we not see Podence make a single run (as I recall) with the directness that Lookman demonstrated?

Wolves, in most of our games thus far look worryingly passive... it almost like we just expect something will happen rather than when we made things happen.

Because Adama doesn't make intelligent runs off the ball or give and go, he just stands still until the ball is passed to him.

Podence looked like he was still injured to me.
 

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I think its fully on a high press on tired/unprepared legs.
You should be a diplomat for balancing all sides! Glad you agree that Utd's problem is their awful manager. :)
 

TrueWolf

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Lack of preseason. Or more precisely, lack of a preseason after a mammoth season.
 

Direwolf

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I think people need to settle down and have a little patience. The quality in our squad will in time see a rise in our performances. Its always a pressure game when you only have 3 points and are playing a so called poor side at home knowing that a relegation place threatens before the international break if you don't get a result. The players were well aware Sunday was a must win hence the nervy performance the important thing was they got the job done. The squad needs more game time together to gel again as a working unit and a couple of decent results will help. We didn't wing it on Sunday against better opposition we got through with graft eventually the flair will inevitably be back and we will all be singing this players and that players praises but its going to take us a while.
 

JadeWolf

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I wouldn’t be judging our performances too much for the next month if I’m honest, the whole situation with no proper pre-season, covid protocols, no fans, if you’re judging our team against how they did in previous years you’re bound to be disappointed.
 

VancouverWolf

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I wouldn't say our legs are fresh though.

To ease your concerns I'd look at how City and United have played since the return, teams in the same position as us.
Hardly City......they were fast, hungry and full of zest.
 

sillytuna

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Like all sides in Europe apart from Red Bull Leipzig, Sevilla, Inter Milan, Bayern., PSG, Lyon, Real etc etc... ?

And Atalanta are the form team in Europe at the moment. Sorry, but this is just a myth and the evidence doesn't back up the theory that teams playing late in Europe last season are all struggling now. Only us. With Man C and Liverpool arguably, each having lost only 1 match, not that dismal. "You can't look at the table now". Just watch one or both of them embark on a 25 match unbeaten run...

Several of the teams are looking iffy, including both liverpool and man city, and we're in a very competitive league. We also played a crazy number of games with the smallest squad.

The covid break wasn't a proper break - mentally or physically.
 

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Hardly City......they were fast, hungry and full of zest.
Good point. And then got held to 1-1 by Leeds in a truly memorable match of full on attacking intensity from both sides.

BTW Atalanta, also in the European quarters at the same time as us have won their first 3 matches 4-2, 4-1 and 5-2. They would have run up cricket scores if they weren't so tired!
 
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I listened to the molineux view podcast last week and Matt Jarvis was on there. He basically said that we would struggle this season with not having a proper pre-season. Sounds obvious I know, but hearing it from a professional footballer who would know, really made me think more and more about the decision to switch styles. Moutinho in particular looks like he has concrete boots on.
As others have said maybe having some decent breaks between fixtures will build fitness up.
 

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Several of the teams are looking iffy, including both liverpool and man city, and we're in a very competitive league. We also played a crazy number of games with the smallest squad.

The covid break wasn't a proper break - mentally or physically.

It was the same for all teams. Don't think our squad is that much smaller, just that we seem to have a lot of young players, who while apparently are full of potential, are not considered for the first team.
 
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WW1963

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Again thats all very true but there was again two months lay off with zero football. I do think new faces and an absence of pre-season has not helped.
For two month lay off read two months of being stuck in a house like the rest of us, unable to see family/friends, unable to go on holiday.

They are miserable and do not have a crowd to lift them.

As I said the other day, there are clubs that will prosper without crowds. Everton, Man United, Villa, West Ham, Newcastle all have misery guts support bases that suck the life out of the players when the slightest thing goes wrong.
 
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Did Adama actually touch the ball?

Don't think so, we were sitting so deep which in part isn't his fault I suppose but he's just so frustratingly talented but just doesn't have the brain to go with his physical and technical gifts it does my head in.
 

Halesowen wwfc

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I dont think its lack of fitness as in they are knackered. More to do with lack of preseason and match sharpness. A small margin in sharpness sees results like against west ham.
 

AlexWolvesHD

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Nuno said because of the pandemic, the rushed finish to the season, no break, internationals being crammed in, no proper preseason ect that there was a lack of intensity.

Basically right now for us and several teams its a bit like preseason for the players at the minute, teams and the crazy results should start going back to normal after 10 games i would have thought
 

SA Wolf

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I think it's a combination of a really long season last year, no pre-season this year and a lack of time on the training pitch for new signings to integrate and learn the system.
Which system? The 'old' system is being ripped-up as I understand it. If that's the case, then all of our players need to be schooled in the 'new' system; both new and established players!
 

5150

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Agree on the lack of a break and pre season. We are basically completing our pre season in front of the cameras.

As for the 2 month break, it is a tough one.
If they knew exactly when they were coming back the whole time, fitness etc could have been built to a specific date but they didn't ,so it was all bit "stay in shape and don't eat macdonalds"...
 

Oh When the Wolves

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It’s the lack of pre season

those near the top now can enjoy their time up their for a few more weeks but come the end of November , the better teams from last season will start taking their positions up there
 
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