Things I care about more than eSports:

[Japan Wulf]

e-sports? Load of old *******s... Just like that internet thingy, i-phone wotsits and all that digital streaming tomfoolery. Never catch on.

 

[JadeWolf]

Kinda feel like Jeff could do worse than to actually publish more of the journey into other areas.

The content wouldn’t need to come from him directly, but it would be great to behind the scenes and see this thing grow.

That might be the thing that keeps the local fans semi-involved in the progress/potential. We deserve insight at the very least.

Tbf when Wolves have published stories about eSports, Wolves records or the fashion, the response is usually “who cares, sign some players”.

 

[Flea]

e-sports? Load of old *******s... Just like that internet thingy, i-phone wotsits and all that digital streaming tomfoolery. Never catch on.

Okay,how does it work then and how can it generate significant income for us..the football club that is?
My experience with games is basically Space Invaders over a couple of SuperMarios,Zelda and some Final Fantasy games way back when.

Way I understand it...it is teams plying some game against each other and if they are good at it they win some prize money?
Kinda like playing Texas Hold´em tourneys?

How much income are we supposed to anticipate this will generate for WWFC?

What does the strategy looks like in a little bit more detail?

 

[Munich_Wolf]

That's a problem with modern football unfortunately. If you don't want that, understandable, go lower league.

Re: eSports - I'm dealing with some of this professionally, lightly at least. It's super tricky to monetise and the chances of a wolves brand being huge are very slim indeed. To be meaningful it'd be a massive and risky exercise.

As long as it's not sucking resources then it's not really an issue. The real problem lies in PR. while youngsters may lap it up, football has an aging audience and this is being seen as a major problem by clubs now. This is why you're seeing esports discussed so much but also why not considering your existing fan base is a real PR faux pas.

So in reality it's as hard and expensive to reach the top in esports as it is the top 6 in the PL right? So where does Shi put any money, into our team or into his baby the esports team - it appears both need it no?

Why alienate the local fans by insulting them instead of realising they are the lifeblood of this football club?

And as for signing players so we get more viewers in the far east - that's nothing short of outrageous

 

[sillytuna]

I understand shi's position and why they consider this as it's a very long term view but communicating that to the average fan is never going to end well.

When you have a non performing player from korea, and he non performs in terns of views as well as a terrible second half of the season, then don't come out in the media with these kind of comments. It just begs the question - why did we pay 12m unnecessarily and why is he playing week in week out?

 

[SingYourHeartsOut]

I understand shi's position and why they consider this as it's a very long term view but communicating that to the average fan is never going to end well.

When you have a non performing player from korea, and he non performs in terns of views as well as a terrible second half of the season, then don't come out in the media with these kind of comments. It just begs the question - why did we pay 12m unnecessarily and why is he playing week in week out?

This. If Lage is under pressure to play Hwang and it meant we didn't get a win that would have got us to 8th, then it's probably already cost more than Korean support will ever give us.

 

[TheConcourse]

Tbf when Wolves have published stories about eSports, Wolves records or the fashion, the response is usually “who cares, sign some players”.

Yeah, they need to go big into content production to take fans on the journey IMO.

I also think all of these initiatives could act as a unique way to attract players. They aren’t just part of a club, they’re part of something much bigger - that could become a thing to further enhance player brands within Wolves’ commercial network.

And whilst we’re on that, players coming in need to be happy. I heard from Sellars yesterday that a couple of the lads in scouting team “sell the club really well”. Again, we should be giving young and experienced pros full, behind-the-scenes access to help make more informed decisions about their future.

Everyone should play a part in this, but the club specifically need to increase their content capability ten fold.

 

[YouGottaRaulWithIt]

I really struggle to see why the whole e-sports thing has apparently caused so much upset? I get the impression some people would have been happier if they had said the future strategy was to generate funds through narcotics and people trafficking. (As long as they gave assurances it would remain a local club, for local people, of course.)

For me it is because esports and the brand are terms used by Shi as a deflection from the real issues facing Wolves.

"Don't look at the lack of investment in the team, look at the great work we are doing on the Internet to develop the brand, and esports will generate cash to help finance the club".

It's lies and *******s, perpetuated by our own cheerleaders. When I see players bought and picked because they can generate some clicks on a Korean website then something is wrong.

I want my Football team back.

 

[Fenrir_]

Okay,how does it work then and how can it generate significant income for us..the football club that is?
My experience with games is basically Space Invaders over a couple of SuperMarios,Zelda and some Final Fantasy games way back when.

Way I understand it...it is teams plying some game against each other and if they are good at it they win some prize money?
Kinda like playing Texas Hold´em tourneys?

How much income are we supposed to anticipate this will generate for WWFC?

What does the strategy looks like in a little bit more detail?

It's not about winning the eSports events as such (although it helps). Treat it as an advertisement for the Wolves head emblem that can reach a massive audience that would otherwise never know of its existence. Then offer these people the kind of thing they might buy for their games at a couple of quid a pop, but emblazoned with a Wolves head emblem somewhere and licensed by Wolves, and you've reached a brand new market and revenue stream that you were never going to touch on the football side of things. The people buying your product still know sod all about the club, but they're contributing to its finances

To be fair this is just how I see it and I might be wrong, but if you look at the micro transactions that go on in video games the potential is there, the market is massive, and in all reality it's just starting out. Wolves tap into that and it could end up being extremely lucrative

 

[YouGottaRaulWithIt]

It's not about winning the eSports events as such (although it helps). Treat it as an advertisement for the Wolves head emblem that can reach a massive audience that would otherwise never know of its existence. Then offer these people the kind of thing they might buy for their games at a couple of quid a pop, but emblazoned with a Wolves head emblem somewhere and licensed by Wolves, and you've reached a brand new market and revenue stream that you were never going to touch on the football side of things. The people buying your product still know sod all about the club, but they're contributing to its finances

To be fair this is just how I see it and I might be wrong, but if you look at the micro transactions that go on in video games the potential is there, the market is massive, and in all reality it's just starting out. Wolves tap into that and it could end up being extremely lucrative

OK, let's go with that idea. Say some kids in Korea like playing the online games and want to buy a NFT or a t shirt in Wolves colours. Who sells it to them? Who makes the profit? When I start to see a revenue stream coming to the club from this then maybe I will believe it. But I have a feeling any revenue will go into Fosun's other businesses. We are being used.

 

[Eastern Wolf]

Its all well and good finding different sources of new "fans" but when we serve the type of boring, uninspiring and losing football we've been playing recently, I would say we've probably lost potential new fans as quickly as winning them. The product just hasnt generally been good enough to gain us new fans this and last season I'm afraid.

 

[Eastyorksyeltz]

For me it is because esports and the brand are terms used by Shi as a deflection from the real issues facing Wolves.

"Don't look at the lack of investment in the team, look at the great work we are doing on the Internet to develop the brand, and esports will generate cash to help finance the club".

It's lies and *******s, perpetuated by our own cheerleaders. When I see players bought and picked because they can generate some clicks on a Korean website then something is wrong.

I want my Football team back.

I get the sentiment, but didn't we loose football to corporate greed twenty or thirty years ago? I would rather we hadn't as well. However, as long as we want Wolves to compete at this level I think we have to accept the methods that go with that. In comparison to what props up Man City and now Newcastle I think I prefer owners who are at least trying to run things as a business and trying inovative way to compete on a far from level playing field. I also think that Fosun show more respect for the club than the owners of Man United, for example, and they brought into a business that were already guaranteed a measure of success. Do I really want to be part of the whole corrupt game? I don't really know. I would still support the Wolves if we weren't in this elevated position, but the fact is we are and there are clearly some good things about that. I don't see a realistic and palatable alternative. I also don't really believe Hwang is picked to generate Korean interest, though I do concede he was purchased for that reason and I would have no problems with that...if he was better!

 

[Aurum Lupus]

Thats a fallacy. Tourists come to look at the buildings - Buck Palace, Windsor, Balmoral. A bit like (considerably more) tourists go to France to look at Versailles, the Chateaux on the Loire, Avignon etc...

They also hope to see the Royals too. Its a forlorn hope, but nonetheless a reason.

 

[Wednesbury Wolf]

I don't really believe Hwang is picked to generate Korean interest.

You're in a small minority there then, it's quite obvious with his poor form and lack of the basics he's being played for a reason and it's not for the benefit of the team.

 

[Adrian_Monk]

I quite like the shirt

 

[Sussex Wolf]

Let’s put this into context.

Esports is a way to push the Wolves brand further and through that, increase the value of commercial deals related to Wolves. It’s unlikely to generate significant revenue directly, but by making Wolves a household name, will indirectly bring more money into the club and help us close the gap with the more established top clubs. All good, and I can support that. But, in one of his earlier videos, Jeff said he was spending more time on the esports business than Wolves. He was almost proud of it. I could understand the commercial manager Russell Jones saying that, that’s his job. But the Chairman, Jeff Shi? That is either seriously messed up, or Jeff is using esports as a distraction, and neither is good.

 

[TheConcourse]

For me it is because esports and the brand are terms used by Shi as a deflection from the real issues facing Wolves.

"Don't look at the lack of investment in the team, look at the great work we are doing on the Internet to develop the brand, and esports will generate cash to help finance the club".

It's lies and *******s, perpetuated by our own cheerleaders. When I see players bought and picked because they can generate some clicks on a Korean website then something is wrong.

I want my Football team back.

But this football team has probably been more successful under Fosun than any other time of your life - assumption from me..

You’ve got your football team. They’re not just going to throw good money to make it much better.

We need some context here about what Wolves actually are in the football world. Basically irrelevant for the last few decades pre-Fosun.

We’re all desperate for more, and we don’t want to go backwards. I’d be happy where we are right now providing the football improves tbh.

 

[Bill S Preston Esq.]

Just the wording of "e-sports" irrationally annoys me. It's computer games/gaming, not a sport. Nerds and screens (no porn) would be just as apt a description.

I'd have to deduce you're at least fifty from that statement.

"Computer games" are no longer for nerds only, everyone's doing it.

 

[Bill S Preston Esq.]

No, it's competitive gaming. Nothing more than that.

What you've done is describe it perfectly while defending an ignorant description of it.

That makes no sense.

 

[Fenrir_]

OK, let's go with that idea. Say some kids in Korea like playing the online games and want to buy a NFT or a t shirt in Wolves colours. Who sells it to them? Who makes the profit? When I start to see a revenue stream coming to the club from this then maybe I will believe it. But I have a feeling any revenue will go into Fosun's other businesses. We are being used.

The platform (game developer) sells it to them, Wolves/Fosun take the commission

It's possible the emblem is being used, won't know for a while. I do think though, if Fosun sold up like some want them to, they'd want to take that emblem with them

 

[Bill S Preston Esq.]

No, it's competitive gaming. Nothing more than that.

What you've done is describe it perfectly while defending an ignorant description of it.

That makes no sense.

 

[kiddywolves26]

Esports doesn’t interest me but if it makes money then I’m all for it and it certainly makes the club money even if you can’t directly put your finger on it.

Increased sponsorship opportunities- monster for example. No way would they have sponsored us if it wasn’t for esports.

YouTube ads. You will all have seen the quantity of ads in the ask wolves videos, the club directly receives a % if income YouTube makes through these. Why do you think being a YouTuber is a job these days- which pays Handsomely. More people follow wolves esports in China than follow wolves social media world wide. Every time a esports fan in China watches a video we benefit.

Online game revenue- they stated we sold 2k replica esports shirts in 24 hours, wouldn’t have made that without it. I’m sure we make money from in game purchases as well. I bought nba2k 22 just because wolves are on it, I don’t even understand the rules of basketball. There’s an argument that we don’t receive much for this at present, maybe a small % but as the esports brand grows these games will come to us wanting us to be involved.

Marketing- I’m sure we massively benefit from our badge being seen world wide, we have esports fans from America stating they will follow wolves now as they think it’s cool we have an esports team. Some of these will follow our main social media pages and do things mentioned above. There are gamers claiming what an honour it is to sign for such a large esports team and be connected to the FC. I’m sure we even ranked 5th last year in Europe.

Now there is an argument that wolves don’t put a penny towards any of the above as it comes under fosun sports, which also means we may receive nothing too. But if this was the case I would certainly guarantee we receive royalty fee from fosun. Also let’s remember fosun are an investment group, if they can make 100’s of millions from our brand then they are more likely to stick around and see investment in the team worthwhile.

 

[Eastyorksyeltz]

You're in a small minority there then, it's quite obvious with his poor form and lack of the basics he's being played for a reason and it's not for the benefit of the team.

I choose not to doubt Bruno's integrity on that one. I do accept he was purchased for the benefit of the brand, but not that he is selected for that reason. I think Bruno has taken the decision to play him because of what he sees as a particular fit to his plans in particular games, an ability to score goals in a team where that is a premium and perhaps a misjudged belief that he could play through the lack of form. I think he was wrong, but don't think he lacks the integrity to stand up to any pressure to select for non football reasons.

 

[lobodelsur]

They also hope to see the Royals too. Its a forlorn hope, but nonetheless a reason.

I doubt that. France has no royal family but has considerably more tourists than the UK, (a situation which is only going to get worse from the UKs pov).

 

[Fenrir_]

Esports doesn’t interest me but if it makes money then I’m all for it and it certainly makes the club money even if you can’t directly put your finger on it.

Increased sponsorship opportunities- monster for example. No way would they have sponsored us if it wasn’t for esports.

YouTube ads. You will all have seen the quantity of ads in the ask wolves videos, the club directly receives a % if income YouTube makes through these. Why do you think being a YouTuber is a job these days- which pays Handsomely. More people follow wolves esports in China than follow wolves social media world wide. Every time a esports fan in China watches a video we benefit.

Online game revenue- they stated we sold 2k replica esports shirts in 24 hours, wouldn’t have made that without it. I’m sure we make money from in game purchases as well. I bought nba2k 22 just because wolves are on it, I don’t even understand the rules of basketball. There’s an argument that we don’t receive much for this at present, maybe a small % but as the esports brand grows these games will come to us wanting us to be involved.

Marketing- I’m sure we massively benefit from our badge being seen world wide, we have esports fans from America stating they will follow wolves now as they think it’s cool we have an esports team. Some of these will follow our main social media pages and do things mentioned above. There are gamers claiming what an honour it is to sign for such a large esports team and be connected to the FC. I’m sure we even ranked 5th last year in Europe.

Now there is an argument that wolves don’t put a penny towards any of the above as it comes under fosun sports, which also means we may receive nothing too. But if this was the case I would certainly guarantee we receive royalty fee from fosun. Also let’s remember fosun are an investment group, if they can make 100’s of millions from our brand then they are more likely to stick around and see investment in the team worthwhile.

Pretty much what I wanted to say, only better!

People don't have to like eSports or follow it, but it's big, it's full of money and if our club gets a piece of the pie then it can't be bad

 

[RMNottm]

Confession Time.

I have found watching my son playing FIFA more enjoyable than watching Wolves and it does not involve a 160 mile round trip!

If it contributes to sorting out the excitement on the pitch bring it on!

 

[Wall heath Wanderer]

I'd have to deduce you're at least fifty from that statement.

"Computer games" are no longer for nerds only, everyone's doing it.

I'm 42, and a lifelong gamer, I'm a nerd.

 

[YouGottaRaulWithIt]

Esports doesn’t interest me but if it makes money then I’m all for it and it certainly makes the club money even if you can’t directly put your finger on it.

Increased sponsorship opportunities- monster for example. No way would they have sponsored us if it wasn’t for esports.

YouTube ads. You will all have seen the quantity of ads in the ask wolves videos, the club directly receives a % if income YouTube makes through these. Why do you think being a YouTuber is a job these days- which pays Handsomely. More people follow wolves esports in China than follow wolves social media world wide. Every time a esports fan in China watches a video we benefit.

Online game revenue- they stated we sold 2k replica esports shirts in 24 hours, wouldn’t have made that without it. I’m sure we make money from in game purchases as well. I bought nba2k 22 just because wolves are on it, I don’t even understand the rules of basketball. There’s an argument that we don’t receive much for this at present, maybe a small % but as the esports brand grows these games will come to us wanting us to be involved.

Marketing- I’m sure we massively benefit from our badge being seen world wide, we have esports fans from America stating they will follow wolves now as they think it’s cool we have an esports team. Some of these will follow our main social media pages and do things mentioned above. There are gamers claiming what an honour it is to sign for such a large esports team and be connected to the FC. I’m sure we even ranked 5th last year in Europe.

Now there is an argument that wolves don’t put a penny towards any of the above as it comes under fosun sports, which also means we may receive nothing too. But if this was the case I would certainly guarantee we receive royalty fee from fosun. Also let’s remember fosun are an investment group, if they can make 100’s of millions from our brand then they are more likely to stick around and see investment in the team worthwhile.

If we are benefiting from esports then we should see a revenue stream appearing in the report and accounts. There is isnt one now, and I doubt there ever will be.

If Fosun need us stay in the premier league, to support these other ventures, then we should see them buying quality players. Again, no evidence of that yet.

 

[Bill S Preston Esq.]

I'm 42, and a lifelong gamer, I'm a nerd.

I'm 43, a lifelong gamer and not a nerd.

To prove this, I'm struggling to reset my Alexa account and delete all devices right now.

 

[Wall heath Wanderer]

I'm 43, a lifelong gamer and not a nerd.

To prove this, I'm struggling to reset my Alexa account and delete all devices right now.

To be fair I would have the same trouble, but I hate the idea of having a device constantly listening to me, my tinfoil hat can't protect against it.

 

[Black Country Wanderer]

Okay,how does it work then and how can it generate significant income for us..the football club that is?
My experience with games is basically Space Invaders over a couple of SuperMarios,Zelda and some Final Fantasy games way back when.

Way I understand it...it is teams plying some game against each other and if they are good at it they win some prize money?
Kinda like playing Texas Hold´em tourneys?

How much income are we supposed to anticipate this will generate for WWFC?

What does the strategy looks like in a little bit more detail?

Things have moved on a bit since Zelda lol,and no i dont pretend to know everything about it, probably the opposite in fact

What Fosun are planning/doing is using our brand/Logo/strip colours as in game purchases, or skins as they are called,a very lucrative global market
If you have a successful esport team/teams that of course gives greater exposure

We are at a very early stage with this and other avenues of commercial income so dont expect millions to flood into the coffers overnight

If i can give a broad comparison as i see it i would offer Red Bull as an example
They are first and foremost an energy drink company have been for 30 years or so
They decided on a similar strategy with extreme sports,then F1,and football
They now own 10 clubs in 5 different countries,have huge exposure in many different areas of sport,but are still an energy drink company at its core

Thats where i see Wolves going many years down the line
We use the "brand" in different areas and the exposure to sell merchandise on a global scale,something we as a football club could never do on that scale
We remain Wolverhampton Wanderers but with a potentially huge income stream and self sufficiency
It wont happen overnight but thats the rough idea as i see it

 

[YouGottaRaulWithIt]

Things have moved on a bit since Zelda lol,and no i dont pretend to know everything about it, probably the opposite in fact

What Fosun are planning/doing is using our brand/Logo/strip colours as in game purchases, or skins as they are called,a very lucrative global market
If you have a successful esport team/teams that of course gives greater exposure

We are at a very early stage with this and other avenues of commercial income so dont expect millions to flood into the coffers overnight

If i can give a broad comparison as i see it i would offer Red Bull as an example
They are first and foremost an energy drink company have been for 30 years or so
They decided on a similar strategy with extreme sports,then F1,and football
They now own 10 clubs in 5 different countries,have huge exposure in many different areas of sport,but are still an energy drink company at its core

Thats where i see Wolves going many years down the line
We use the "brand" in different areas and the exposure to sell merchandise on a global scale,something we as a football club could never do on that scale
We remain Wolverhampton Wanderers but with a potentially huge income stream and self sufficiency
It wont happen overnight but thats the rough idea as i see it

Thank you. But...who is Zelda? Did she take over from Doris?

 

[Flea]

It's not about winning the eSports events as such (although it helps). Treat it as an advertisement for the Wolves head emblem that can reach a massive audience that would otherwise never know of its existence. Then offer these people the kind of thing they might buy for their games at a couple of quid a pop, but emblazoned with a Wolves head emblem somewhere and licensed by Wolves, and you've reached a brand new market and revenue stream that you were never going to touch on the football side of things. The people buying your product still know sod all about the club, but they're contributing to its finances

To be fair this is just how I see it and I might be wrong, but if you look at the micro transactions that go on in video games the potential is there, the market is massive, and in all reality it's just starting out. Wolves tap into that and it could end up being extremely lucrative

Thanks for the answer.
So...some people will take a liking to Wolves when playing or watching E-sport.
This will lead to them wanting to watch the club play a match of football..or two perhaps.
They will watch a team that is midtable at best.Perhaps on the end of another 1-5 beating by the hands of City.
Since they are not football fans to begin with,is this supposed to get them hooked?
Is this supposed to work?
Or is it other merchandise we are talking about?
Some E sport related merchandise perhaps?
Fosun can put the clubs logo on anything they want I suppose..but that money will go into that segment of market I would presume.

Things have moved on a bit since Zelda lol,and no i dont pretend to know everything about it, probably the opposite in fact

What Fosun are planning/doing is using our brand/Logo/strip colours as in game purchases, or skins as they are called,a very lucrative global market
If you have a successful esport team/teams that of course gives greater exposure

We are at a very early stage with this and other avenues of commercial income so dont expect millions to flood into the coffers overnight

If i can give a broad comparison as i see it i would offer Red Bull as an example
They are first and foremost an energy drink company have been for 30 years or so
They decided on a similar strategy with extreme sports,then F1,and football
They now own 10 clubs in 5 different countries,have huge exposure in many different areas of sport,but are still an energy drink company at its core

Thats where i see Wolves going many years down the line
We use the "brand" in different areas and the exposure to sell merchandise on a global scale,something we as a football club could never do on that scale
We remain Wolverhampton Wanderers but with a potentially huge income stream and self sufficiency
It wont happen overnight but thats the rough idea as i see it

Thanks.
I understand a little bit more now I think..at least I know what Red Bull is..
Still,Red Bull wasn´t a midtable football team so to speak..I just still cannot see it work but I definetly understand that I might be wrong here.If not,then Jeff is wrong I guess.

 

[Fenrir_]

Thanks for the answer.
So...some people will take a liking to Wolves when playing or watching E-sport.
This will lead to them wanting to watch the club play a match of football..or two perhaps.
They will watch a team that is midtable at best.Perhaps on the end of another 1-5 beating by the hands of City.
Since they are not football fans to begin with,is this supposed to get them hooked?
Is this supposed to work?
Or is it other merchandise we are talking about?
Some E sport related merchandise perhaps?
Fosun can put the clubs logo on anything they want I suppose..but that money will go into that segment of market I would presume.

Might not be into the football side of things at all, but let's just say Wolves do become a top name in eSports, people always want to be associated with stuff like that and if someone played R Factor then they might want their car and driver to look like this



They'd have to pay a small fee for the privilege, and as long as the right licensing money makes its way to WWFC then it's all good. My feeling is if it goes well, in a few years you'll see that Wolves head emblem everywhere, and most of the time it won't have much to do with the football team. I'm slightly uneasy about how that might feel, and it's definitely similar to the Red Bull model, but if we're successful as a result? I can handle it

 

[Wall heath Wanderer]

A thought, don't know where else to put this and didn't really want to start a new thread, however, should fosun sell wolves what would happen with all the other stuff such as escorts, record label, clothing?
Would it be a case of it all being included in the sale, sold off piece by piece, or would fosun look to sell the club whilst retaining the 'brand' i.e the wolves head logo and colours?

 

[Fenrir_]

A thought, don't know where else to put this and didn't really want to start a new thread, however, should fosun sell wolves what would happen with all the other stuff such as escorts, record label, clothing?
Would it be a case of it all being included in the sale, sold off piece by piece, or would fosun look to sell the club whilst retaining the 'brand' i.e the wolves head logo and colours?

Not sure they're into escorts just yet but it might please a few if they were!

Personally I think if Fosun sold Wolves, they'd want to retain that emblem. Also think they'd keep the other ventures that are under it

Said it a while back that we could be in a very strange situation where in essence, the badge we own, ends up owning us

 

[Wall heath Wanderer]

Not sure they're into escorts just yet but it might please a few if they were!

Personally I think if Fosun sold Wolves, they'd want to retain that emblem. Also think they'd keep the other ventures that are under it

Ha I missed that typo, think I shall leave it for funsies though.

 

[Wolf in the sun]

i was just thinking do profits from the esports and the record label actually show in the wwfc accounts or do they show in fosun accounts ? if we dont get the profit from them then surely we will never become more profitable and its just about brand awareness and will have very little help towards us moving forward

sorry if i am being naive

 

[WickedWolfie]

You're in a small minority there then, it's quite obvious with his poor form and lack of the basics he's being played for a reason and it's not for the benefit of the team.

Re your first seven words: evidence of that assertion please.

 

[WickedWolfie]

Ha I missed that typo, think I shall leave it for funsies though.

What with that and another elsewhere of "girls" rather than "goals" last night (not by you) a bit of a pattern seems to be emerging..... lol

No wonder we aren't scoring on the pitch lol...