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10th

Locks Heath Wolf

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From the position we were in we should be in Europe next season, massive disappointment in the manner of our demise. See you in August when we’ve signed some first team additions.
 

JOSWolf

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Yes 10th is better than 13th but over the last 14 games we have taken 11 points out of a possible 42, if we carry that over into next season then there is only one way we will go and thats down, the backroom ie Shi and Sellers need to take a long hard look at the part that they have played in this, today alone they have cost the club £4+ million, If Bruno wont stand up to these two and demand that he gets what we need he is going to get sacked, thats if the decision hasnt already been made. Bruno has to grow some balls for the sake of the team/club we need players that are ready now not £35 million might be,s.
Ps, I hope Pedros injury is not a recurrence of the kneecap injury because if it is I fear for him and us.

Pedro just posted on Instagram he is fine.
 

jrpb-3

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would have been OK with 10th before season started, and overall it's an improvement, but from where we were end on Jan start of Feb the last few months have been a big disappointment and recent form and results certainly not good enough. If we can find a way of be consistent at the better end of our performances we should be able to challenge for top 6. Lack of goals the main issue to sort, but it's as much the creation and providing of chances from defense/ midfield as it is the front players no scoring taking chances.
 
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Scallywolf

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Christ! Why not sell the club and go and have Bilston Town as the main club in Wolverhampton. Sheesh..

I am in no way even hinting or suggesting that FOSUN sell our great club.

I am pointing out my thoughts over the season which ended so disappointingly. Nothing wrong with that is there?

It is obvious thousands of our fans want answers from the men in charge and FOSUN or haven’t you been reading the Mix, Facebook, the E and S, listening to fans in the stadium or listening to pundits on radio or TV.

By the way, I thought we were magnificent for 85 minutes today but Hwang was awful. Those are my thoughts and opinions on todays game as well!

Sheesh!!!!
 

Scallywolf

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Pedro just posted on Instagram he is fine.
Thank God for that JOS and thanks.

It was worrying that he and the physio’s were pointing and working on his knee at the time. No need to take any chances and just get him 100% fit for the start of next season.

Pedro looked really up for it today and would have caused the Scousers loads of problems if he had stayed on.

Great goal he scored after brilliant run from Raul.
 

those were the days

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At the start of the season I’d have been delighted with a top half finish. Given where we were in January though, it seems like a real missed opportunity.

Points and position don’t tell the full story either. If you look at the Understat expected points table here we’re 17th and the three teams worse than us all went down. We’re 19th on expected goals scored and no great shakes on expected goals conceded. If I were Jeff Shi, that would make quite alarming reading.
 

Sussex Wolf

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Thank God for that JOS and thanks.

It was worrying that he and the physio’s were pointing and working on his knee at the time. No need to take any chances and just get him 100% fit for the start of next season.

Pedro looked really up for it today and would have caused the Scousers loads of problems if he had stayed on.

Great goal he scored after brilliant run from Raul.

He was looking like his old self today for the brief time he was on. Absolutely the right decision to be cautious and ensure he’s fit and roaring for the start of the season. What was also positive, was that at the same time, he and Raul seemed back at it. That’s a major plus if they can pick up like that come the new season.
 

cannockwolves

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I predicted 15th at the start of the season so 10th is beyond my initial expectations, but give the relegation form over the last 17 games I think it's extremely worrying.

I really don't see how we are going to score more goals AND keep as tight at the back as we have with playing a back three.

There will be a big turnover of players, just to fill the loss of quality from losing Neves, Adama, Marcel, and Ruddy is going to take some doing. Then we need to extend the squad and do better than we did this season!

It is doable - with over £100m spend, but I don't see that happening - so I fully expect a relegation fight next season.
 

Wednesbury Wolf

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We've finished below Brighton, ****ing Brighton let that sink in we're a ****ing disgrace.
 

Tring Wolf

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I can honestly say that I won't have a sleepness night tonight stressing over the fact we finished 10th and not 8th

Agreed. That run of 1 point from 6 very winnable games and the throwing away of Europe was the hard part to take. Once that was gone, where we finished was relatively irrelevant from an emotional standpoint.

Obviously £4.5m isn’t insignificant though.
 

northnorfolkwolf

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Just looked at the final table - we finished 20 (yes, ****ing 20 pts) behind Spurs? We were right with them a couple of months back. This just proves that bringing in a quality manager and quality players will make a massive difference over a season. If Fosun are genuine in their desire to make us a top club they need to get in a new manager and rebuild this tired squad with quality. Through not investing in the side we've gone from an average 7th to an average 11th in the past 2 seasons - disgraceful.
 

northnorfolkwolf

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And Arsenal.

Hard to see an opportunity to break into the top 6 coming round again as realistically as this campaign was.
Agreed. You have to see Toon go past us and even possibly Villa and Everton. With Lage in charge, Neves gone I can't see us making the progress we need. Hope I'm wrong.
 
D

Deleted member 8455jwf

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Could someone post the table from after we beat Villa? Think we were a lot of points clear of 9th

Also - @jwolfie91 - I know our stats are bad for this season. How do they compare to last year?
Pre Liverpool game, but spoiler alert that ain't going to help us out much

Ignore if you hate xG and the like + it is a massive post with lots of numbers.

Disclaimer!
One thing I'd note on advanced numbers is they don't say you what you deserved from a game, they are purely about each individual shot as an event. Football is too dynamic, too many factors so xG is just a guide on chance creation + chances given up. I've used them very poorly on here in the past and am trying to improve my understanding as I am a data nerd.

Shouldn't be used as the be all and end all, and the "eye test" is still more important. Obviously they match up a loads though.

N.B
I didn't include expected points, more I read about that stat the more I hate it. Doing xG on game per game basis to try to work out points is just not a big enough sample, punishes teams who take the lead early for e.g which naturally makes you less expansive for the rest of game.

Explainer for xG, I know people hate it which is fine but read it with an open mind maybe (it is pretty long).

Key:
xGoals
xGoalsAgainst
XGoalDifference

2020/21
xG: 40 (5th worst in the league)
Actual 36 (5th worst in the league)

xGa: 46 (7th best in the league)
Actual: 52 (9th best in the league)

xGd: -6 (13th worst in the league)
Actual: -16 (13th worst in the league)

2021/22
xG: 35 (2nd worst in the league)
Actual: 38 (4th worst in the league)

xGa: 57 (5th worst in the league)
Actual: 40 (4th best in the league)

xGd: -22 (4th worst in the league)
Actual: -3 (11th worst in the league)

YoY Comparison:
xG: Down by 5
xGa: Down by 11 (!)
xgD: Down by 16

Numbers compare terribly, worse across the board by a pretty decent margin too. I probably underrated the job Nuno did slightly, and **** me sideways our advanced numbers are horrific.

Few headlines
  • Our expected vs actual goals conceded has a difference of 10. Next highest is United with 7. No one else is above 5. Sa had a belter of a year, as is obvious without the stats. Probably some poor finishing, but his post shot xG is the 2nd best across the big 5 leagues in Europe

  • The xGD showing us as the 4th worst team in the league is horrible but that, like actual goal difference, can be skewed so that you can easily get thumped a 2x times then win 2x low scoring ones that you controlled which we did basically any time we won with relative ease, and get 6 points out of 12 but the two losses would be dramatically worst on xGD/GD - so that isn't saying we are the 4th worst team in the league but maybe 10th flattered us a little bit.
Source
 

VancouverWolf

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At the start of the season I’d have been delighted with a top half finish. Given where we were in January though, it seems like a real missed opportunity.

Points and position don’t tell the full story either. If you look at the Understat expected points table here we’re 17th and the three teams worse than us all went down. We’re 19th on expected goals scored and no great shakes on expected goals conceded. If I were Jeff Shi, that would make quite alarming reading.
10th is better than 13th obviously but taking 2 points out of the last 21 is just criminal. If we had managed to get 10 points out of those 21, we would have finished 6th. That’s how bad the end of season capitulation has been.
Hopefully Jeff is looking at the stats from the two posts I’ve included here. They are really alarming.
 

Hoganstolemywife

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Pre Liverpool game, but spoiler alert that ain't going to help us out much

Ignore if you hate xG and the like + it is a massive post with lots of numbers.

Disclaimer!
One thing I'd note on advanced numbers is they don't say you what you deserved from a game, they are purely about each individual shot as an event. Football is too dynamic, too many factors so xG is just a guide on chance creation + chances given up. I've used them very poorly on here in the past and am trying to improve my understanding as I am a data nerd.

Shouldn't be used as the be all and end all, and the "eye test" is still more important. Obviously they match up a loads though.

N.B
I didn't include expected points, more I read about that stat the more I hate it. Doing xG on game per game basis to try to work out points is just not a big enough sample, punishes teams who take the lead early for e.g which naturally makes you less expansive for the rest of game.

Explainer for xG, I know people hate it which is fine but read it with an open mind maybe (it is pretty long).

Key:
xGoals
xGoalsAgainst
XGoalDifference

2020/21
xG: 40 (5th worst in the league)
Actual 36 (5th worst in the league)

xGa: 46 (7th best in the league)
Actual: 52 (9th best in the league)

xGd: -6 (13th worst in the league)
Actual: -16 (13th worst in the league)

2021/22
xG: 35 (2nd worst in the league)
Actual: 38 (4th worst in the league)

xGa: 57 (5th worst in the league)
Actual: 40 (4th best in the league)

xGd: -22 (4th worst in the league)
Actual: -3 (11th worst in the league)

YoY Comparison:
xG: Down by 5
xGa: Down by 11 (!)
xgD: Down by 16

Numbers compare terribly, worse across the board by a pretty decent margin too. I probably underrated the job Nuno did slightly, and **** me sideways our advanced numbers are horrific.

Few headlines
  • Our expected vs actual goals conceded has a difference of 10. Next highest is United with 7. No one else is above 5. Sa had a belter of a year, as is obvious without the stats. Probably some poor finishing, but his post shot xG is the 2nd best across the big 5 leagues in Europe

  • The xGD showing us as the 4th worst team in the league is horrible but that, like actual goal difference, can be skewed so that you can easily get thumped a 2x times then win 2x low scoring ones that you controlled which we did basically any time we won with relative ease, and get 6 points out of 12 but the two losses would be dramatically worst on xGD/GD - so that isn't saying we are the 4th worst team in the league but maybe 10th flattered us a little bit.
Source
Great post - the stats you've been posting have really changed my take on things. I feel we are a bit like last season's Villa. Their defence looked excellent thanks to Martinez having an unsustainably good season.
 

BlahBlah

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Well the happy clappers who a week or so ago were adamant we'd get 8th... um, about that...

I think most people thought we'd come 10th, Leicester and Brighton both had home matches against teams who could drop no lower and whose season's were finished.
 

jonesy

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Still find it hard to judge him with out a proper tx window or 2 to implement his style of play.

Results have been very very poor since the villa game. Can understand if he gets the chop but it’s very harsh considering the last 12 months.
 
D

Deleted member drgr12429

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I am in no way even hinting or suggesting that FOSUN sell our great club.

I am pointing out my thoughts over the season which ended so disappointingly. Nothing wrong with that is there?

It is obvious thousands of our fans want answers from the men in charge and FOSUN or haven’t you been reading the Mix, Facebook, the E and S, listening to fans in the stadium or listening to pundits on radio or TV.

By the way, I thought we were magnificent for 85 minutes today but Hwang was awful. Those are my thoughts and opinions on todays game as well!

Sheesh!!!!
We finished 10th, which on average over the season is where we deserved to be. Is it acceptable? Overall yes, but over the last third we all agree no.
It really doesn't matter what anyone thinks though, because the fate of the manager and the players is not in our hands. And reams of posts bleating about it won't do a damn thing. All it does is pit fans against fans. And Fosun are for sure not scouring the forums for a manager or players, although it seems some on here think they could be one or the other!
Best thing to do is we all wait and see what happens over the summer and judge from there. It'll be a much better place here if that happens.
 

we love jez moxey

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That combined with the xG stats from the other thread has convinced me Lage should probably go.

I just can't see this mythical new style of play everyone is expecting appearing, even with a few new players.
XG stats FFS.
Absolute ****ing nonsense.
If you're gonna sack him, do it because the football is awful, not because some playstation addicted virgin made up some bogus stats.
 

Loefah

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XG stats FFS.
Absolute ****ing nonsense.
If you're gonna sack him, do it because the football is awful, not because some playstation addicted virgin made up some bogus stats.
Fair enough, the football isn't great either. Those expected goals against (5th worst in the league) and the disparity to the actual amount conceded make sense considering Sa's form this season.
 

we love jez moxey

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Fair enough, the football isn't great either. Those expected goals against (5th worst in the league) and the disparity to the actual amount conceded make sense considering Sa's form this season.
If you're going to be a football fan, watch football. Don't watch football, and then change your mind of what you have seen because some geeky kid is saying " ahhh but the expected goals...." It's just absolute stupidity.
 

Fifty Niner

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That combined with the xG stats from earlier in the thread has convinced me Lage should probably go.

I just can't see this mythical new style of play everyone is expecting appearing, even with a few new players.
Absolutely. I think this is the concern for many fans. There’s not even a hint of how he wants his team to play. It has been very much the 20/21 Nuno MkII for most of this season.
 

NewarkWolf

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From the position we were in we should be in Europe next season, massive disappointment in the manner of our demise. See you in August when we’ve signed some first team additions.
The position we were in was false. We over achieved.
 

Surrey Wolf

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would have taken it at the start of the season but now it seems very disappointing
 
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