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Essex Wolf
11-02-2012, 15:37
To the wire (http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/wolverhampton-wanderers-fc/2012/02/11/wolves-survival-fight-will-go-to-the-wire-says-mick-mccarthy/)

This isn't a dig at Mick but I don't know whether to think wow cheers Mick for telling us what we already knew or thank him for his honesty baring in mind certain people at the club were talking about mid table.

I won't say I'm not annoyed at what I see as the clubs total lack of better transfer dealings and firmly believe that a mid table finish may have been a possibility if quality had been signed when it should have been, IE before the seasons start but that's now history and there's no way it can now be changed.

Bottom line is that the club could and should have done a massive amount more so as this current mess would have been more aviodable.

I always accept that buying big names is no guarantee of survival but I feel the club would have been fairing much better had they made a couple of better signings.

Now the club are well in the mire and a repeat of last season looking extremely likely.

Burton Wolf
11-02-2012, 15:39
I agree. I'd have preferred if he'd said let's go and win the next 4 games and then we'll be sorted.

WV10Wolf
11-02-2012, 15:40
In other news Bears have sometimes been know to $$$$ in woods

Ponty
11-02-2012, 15:46
In other news Bears have sometimes been know to $$$$ in woods

Apparently the pope's a catholic, but that probably doesn't warrant a new thread!

Essex Wolf
11-02-2012, 15:46
In other news Bears have sometimes been know to $$$$ in woods

Not sure certain folk at Wolves would acknowledge even that though WV10.

Burton, if Wolves could win the next 4 I'll go as far as to say Mick would deserve to stay in post. I feel confident, sad as it is to say, Wolves won't? How I truly would love to be wrong.

johnybig32
11-02-2012, 15:47
To the wire (http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/wolverhampton-wanderers-fc/2012/02/11/wolves-survival-fight-will-go-to-the-wire-says-mick-mccarthy/)

This isn't a dig at Mick but I don't know whether to think wow cheers Mick for telling us what we already knew or thank him for his honesty baring in mind certain people at the club were talking about mid table.

I won't say I'm not annoyed at what I see as the clubs total lack of better transfer dealings and firmly believe that a mid table finish may have been a possibility if quality had been signed when it should have been, IE before the seasons start but that's now history and there's no way it can now be changed.

Bottom line is that the club could and should have done a massive amount more so as this current mess would have been more aviodable.

I always accept that buying big names is no guarantee of survival but I feel the club would have been fairing much better had they made a couple of better signings.

Now the club are well in the mire and a repeat of last season looking extremely likely.

Unlike you EW...

Burton Wolf
11-02-2012, 15:50
Not sure certain folk at Wolves would acknowledge even that though WV10.

Burton, if Wolves could win the next 4 I'll go as far as to say Mick would deserve to stay in post. I feel confident, sad as it is to say, Wolves won't? How I truly would love to be wrong.

Ah well you never know win tomorrow and then we'll see better than all this negative $$$$.

Essex Wolf
11-02-2012, 15:51
Unlike you EW...

And I don't deny it Johny but this genuinely wasn't a dig at Mick. Just think it's a rather strange thing to say when we all know the reasons as to why things are so bad and this is stating the blatantly obvious which was blantantly obvious several weeks ago. But it is nice that Mick has at long long last admitted things for what they are.

A win tomorrow Burton will see much of the seasons rubbish to date forgotten for a while at least and he MM will be a hive of positive activity.

Nero wolf
11-02-2012, 16:29
WWFC doesnīt owe Mick McCarthy anything.
He has gotten his high salary,and that is what itīs all about nowadays,and given the money they earn at Prem level..McCarthy included.
We donīt owe him anything.

WV10Wolf
11-02-2012, 16:32
WWFC doesnīt owe Mick McCarthy anything.
He has gotten his high salary,and that is what itīs all about nowadays,and given the money they earn at Prem level..McCarthy included.
We donīt owe him anything.

Just out of curiosity who was it that got Wolves in to the Premier League thus enabling everyong to earn their high salaries?

Nero wolf
11-02-2012, 16:36
Just out of curiosity who was it that got Wolves in to the Premier League thus enabling everyong to earn their high salaries?

Mick McCarthy all by himself you think?
I am not agreeing with you.
Besides,Mick got his fair share of the gold himself.
WWFC doesnīt owe anyone anything..not players,not the manager.

WV10Wolf
11-02-2012, 16:40
Mick McCarthy all by himself you think?
I am not agreeing with you.
Besides,Mick got his fair share of the gold himself.
WWFC doesnīt owe anyone anything..not players,not the manager.

I'm not saying Wolves do, but we're in the Premier League because of MM and the players he signed in the first three seasons in charge.

I don't care if you want him to be sacked, what I care about is not showing him and the players the respect they deserve. Some people forget where we've come from.

Nero wolf
11-02-2012, 16:45
The respect is in the salary envelope.
That is the name of the game nowadays.
I do disagree with your statement as a whole..WWFC would probably have been Prem with or without Mick.We were too big for the Chump to be ever present there.
Mick McCarthy seems vastly overrated by some..IMHO.
Just because he is a better club coach than Glenn Hoddle certainly doesnīt turn him into some kind of messiah for me.

WV10Wolf
11-02-2012, 16:48
The respect is in the salary envelope.
That is the name of the game nowadays.
I do disagree with your statement as a whole..WWFC would probably have been Prem with or without Mick.We were too big for the Chump to be ever present there.
Mick McCarthy seems vastly overrated by some..IMHO.
Just because he is a better club coach than Glenn Hoddle certainly doesnīt turn him into some kind of messiah for me.


Yep because taking over a club with 12 senior players on the books (three of which were goalkeepers) a fortnight before the season started and taking them to the play-offs at the end of that season is the stuff over rated managers are made of.

Let me guess you wanted Paul Ince to be manager after Glenda left.

Tring Wolf
11-02-2012, 17:06
WWFC doesnīt owe Mick McCarthy anything.
He has gotten his high salary,and that is what itīs all about nowadays,and given the money they earn at Prem level..McCarthy included.
We donīt owe him anything.

So you don't think we owe him a debt of gratitude for his role in getting the club promoted. Or giving us successive seasons in the top division? Or even his role in helping to put the pride back into the club after Hoddle's reign?

I actually have no problem with supporters saying they want Mick out. I may personally disagree with them but can understand the view that they just want Wolves to progress further and that a new man could represent the best chance of future success.

But to say we owe Mick nothing after the role he has played in the most successful period in the club's recent history is, in my mind, a little disrespectful. Do we not owe Graham Turner a debt of gratitude because he was earning a decent wage while he managed us? Do we owe Bully nothing because we gave him 15 years worth of steady employment?

At some point, Mick will leave the club but regardless of what happens between now and then, I would hope he gets to leave with dignity, respect and the thanks he deserves for what he has contributed to our club.

Berlin Wolf
11-02-2012, 17:27
So you don't think we owe him a debt of gratitude for his role in getting the club promoted. Or giving us successive seasons in the top division? Or even his role in helping to put the pride back into the club after Hoddle's reign?

I actually have no problem with supporters saying they want Mick out. I may personally disagree with them but can understand the view that they just want Wolves to progress further and that a new man could represent the best chance of future success.

But to say we owe Mick nothing after the role he has played in the most successful period in the club's recent history is, in my mind, a little disrespectful. Do we not owe Graham Turner a debt of gratitude because he was earning a decent wage while he managed us? Do we owe Bully nothing because we gave him 15 years worth of steady employment?

At some point, Mick will leave the club but regardless of what happens between now and then, I would hope he gets to leave with dignity, respect and the thanks he deserves for what he has contributed to our club.

A well balanced post, Tring.

Here is an snipet to help remind us of the mess Hoddle left Wolves in.

The search for a successor threw up some interesting possibilities.

Moxey revealed 45 applications which had been reduced to 12 names commencing towards an interview stage.

The players, meanwhile, flew out to Spain for a pre-season training camp two days later under caretaker boss Stuart Gray who had been installed as an early favourite to succeed his former boss, alongside veteran midfielder Paul Ince, who was out of contract.

A patched-up travelling squad bulked up by a number of youngsters set off for the sunshine.

Take a look at the mess Hoddle had left them in.

Experienced men like Michael Oakes, Jody Craddock, Jackie McNamara, Carl Cort and Seyi Olofinjana standing out from a congested crowd. The good: Matt Murray. The bad: Denes Rosa, Tomasz Frankowski and the young: Rob Edwards, Lee Naylor, Mark Davies, Mark Clyde, Keith Lowe, Wayne Hennessey, Leon Clarke, Lewis Gobern, Stephen Gleeson, Mark Little, Martin Riley, Daniel Jones, Carl Ikeme and Kevin O’Connor.

Moxey immediately set the parameters for the new man.

MK Panther
11-02-2012, 18:14
I thought it was the fans who voiced their opinions about what type of team we wanted, young and hungry was the name of the game. Jez has no idea what type of team can make it happen. If he did we would not have ended up with some of the poor footballers we have been lumbered with.

Nero wolf
11-02-2012, 18:53
So you don't think we owe him a debt of gratitude for his role in getting the club promoted. Or giving us successive seasons in the top division? Or even his role in helping to put the pride back into the club after Hoddle's reign?

I actually have no problem with supporters saying they want Mick out. I may personally disagree with them but can understand the view that they just want Wolves to progress further and that a new man could represent the best chance of future success.

But to say we owe Mick nothing after the role he has played in the most successful period in the club's recent history is, in my mind, a little disrespectful. Do we not owe Graham Turner a debt of gratitude because he was earning a decent wage while he managed us? Do we owe Bully nothing because we gave him 15 years worth of steady employment?

At some point, Mick will leave the club but regardless of what happens between now and then, I would hope he gets to leave with dignity, respect and the thanks he deserves for what he has contributed to our club.

We donīt owe Mick McCarthy a thing.Evidence is that he wonīt leave here,no matter what.I am stating right here and now we will have to sack the guy in order to get rid..just like Sunderland had to.
We are Micks last resort,and we are paying him royally month after month to be here.
The results last one and a half season might not add up to his hefty salary,some might agree.
I will never say thank you to Mick McCarthy.It would be an indignified thing to do given the money he has earned from WWFC..IMO.
I will be WWFC after Mick is gone..and after EVERY player in the squad is gone.
I donīt owe them anything.I am the lifelong supporter.Where were Mick during the Bhatti years?
Not in sight,that was the spot he were at.
I donīt owe Mick nought..neither does my club.

WV10Wolf
11-02-2012, 19:07
The results last one and a half season might not add up to his hefty salary,some might agree.


Quite right, I mean after beating Man City, Man Utd, Chelsea and Liverpool during the last season and a half why should any of us thank him

Hoganstolemywife
11-02-2012, 19:11
I foresee a banner:

'YOU DO NOT HAVE OUR GRATITUDE'

Tring Wolf
11-02-2012, 19:49
We donīt owe Mick McCarthy a thing.Evidence is that he wonīt leave here,no matter what.I am stating right here and now we will have to sack the guy in order to get rid..just like Sunderland had to.
We are Micks last resort,and we are paying him royally month after month to be here.
The results last one and a half season might not add up to his hefty salary,some might agree.
I will never say thank you to Mick McCarthy.It would be an indignified thing to do given the money he has earned from WWFC..IMO.
I will be WWFC after Mick is gone..and after EVERY player in the squad is gone.
I donīt owe them anything.I am the lifelong supporter.Where were Mick during the Bhatti years?
Not in sight,that was the spot he were at.
I donīt owe Mick nought..neither does my club.

Absolutely agree that the fans are the lifeblood of the club and the supporters like you and I, who were there during the Bhatti years will continue to be there long after Mick (or any other manager) have gone.

Just not sure I get the argument that because we pay him a wage, he doesn't deserve our gratitude for what he has done. By the same logic that you say we were a last resort for Mick, you could say we were the last resort for Bully after the Albion said he wasn't good enough. And I can't think of any fan who doesn't thank Bully for his contribution to the club and the countless wonderful memories he gave us on the grounds that we paid him a wage.

Similarly, regardless of what happens to Mick in the future, he and his team has given a generation of Wolves fans some of the happiest memories in the club's recent history and for that alone, I will always be grateful.

Those memories are worth more than a wage (to me anyway).

Burton Wolf
11-02-2012, 20:01
Absolutely agree that the fans are the lifeblood of the club and the supporters like you and I, who were there during the Bhatti years will continue to be there long after Mick (or any other manager) have gone.

Just not sure I get the argument that because we pay him a wage, he doesn't deserve our gratitude for what he has done. By the same logic that you say we were a last resort for Mick, you could say we were the last resort for Bully after the Albion said he wasn't good enough. And I can't think of any fan who doesn't thank Bully for his contribution to the club and the countless wonderful memories he gave us on the grounds that we paid him a wage.

Similarly, regardless of what happens to Mick in the future, he and his team has given a generation of Wolves fans some of the happiest memories in the club's recent history and for that alone, I will always be grateful.

Those memories are worth more than a wage (to me anyway).

Even though I'm no Mick fan that post is bang on :congrats:

SimplyTheWolves
11-02-2012, 20:36
Absolutely agree that the fans are the lifeblood of the club and the supporters like you and I, who were there during the Bhatti years will continue to be there long after Mick (or any other manager) have gone.

Just not sure I get the argument that because we pay him a wage, he doesn't deserve our gratitude for what he has done. By the same logic that you say we were a last resort for Mick, you could say we were the last resort for Bully after the Albion said he wasn't good enough. And I can't think of any fan who doesn't thank Bully for his contribution to the club and the countless wonderful memories he gave us on the grounds that we paid him a wage.

Similarly, regardless of what happens to Mick in the future, he and his team has given a generation of Wolves fans some of the happiest memories in the club's recent history and for that alone, I will always be grateful.

Those memories are worth more than a wage (to me anyway).



Well said Tring Wolf. In the future nobody can look back and say that Mick doesn’t deserve some kind of recognition for his contribution in helping us get back to where we once dreamed of. Regardless of what opinions we may have of him at this point as our manager, it would only be a complete insult not to acknowledge the contribution the man has made towards our clubs recent history.

We at least owe him gratitude for doing what he has achieved where many have tried and failed.

kennyB
11-02-2012, 20:55
Stan Cullis gave me my best Wolves memories by a long, long way. All McCarthy has done (with very few exceptions) is give me apoplexy!

Tring Wolf
11-02-2012, 21:09
Stan Cullis gave me my best Wolves memories by a long, long way. All McCarthy has done (with very few exceptions) is give me apoplexy!

You're a lucky man KennyB. I just wish I'd have been around to see our great teams of the 50's. My first three seasons supporting Wolves were when we fell from Division One to Division Four so I'm not quite as spoiled for choice as you are :)

Adrian_Monk
11-02-2012, 21:11
You're coming across a bit jealous Nero, salaries have always been paid in return for work and generally those who achieve earn well. McCarthy contrary to your 'last chance saloon' nonsense would be a very attractive option for many clubs, it takes a hell of a lot of hard work to arrest a slide which is what he did on his arrival, he hasn't cheated the club out of a wage like so many have over the years and deserves respect for his achievements.

Sadly you are sounding like the sort of Wolves fan I'm not keen on and the type that sees other clubs fans looking down on our support. You don't have to support him unconditionally and it's fine even if you think he should go, but you're showing disrespect he doesn't deserve and the reason is quite pitiful

Nero wolf
11-02-2012, 21:22
Absolutely agree that the fans are the lifeblood of the club and the supporters like you and I, who were there during the Bhatti years will continue to be there long after Mick (or any other manager) have gone.

Just not sure I get the argument that because we pay him a wage, he doesn't deserve our gratitude for what he has done. By the same logic that you say we were a last resort for Mick, you could say we were the last resort for Bully after the Albion said he wasn't good enough. And I can't think of any fan who doesn't thank Bully for his contribution to the club and the countless wonderful memories he gave us on the grounds that we paid him a wage.

Similarly, regardless of what happens to Mick in the future, he and his team has given a generation of Wolves fans some of the happiest memories in the club's recent history and for that alone, I will always be grateful.

Those memories are worth more than a wage (to me anyway).

Regarding Bull,unlike Mick..he had far better offers on the table if he had wanted to.I do have respect for the Steve Bulls and Matt Le Tiss in a WHOLE different aspect than what I got for Mick.It is a different ballgame whatsoever.WWFC wasnīt Bullys last resort by any shape or means.He was national when we were division three.Nuff said on that particular matter.

Similar..I do think we would have been Prem 2012 without Mick.
It isnīt an unlogical way of thinking..more the other way around.
We were..and still is some might say..underachievers.
Mick has done an okay job uptil start of 2011 season IMO.He isnīt the manager that rocks any worlds..he hasnīt re invented the wheel..and it is common knowledge.
Other way around,you would have found him at a top club by now.

Thing is,Mick has reasons to be very grateful to WWFC.We gave him the resources to reach his full limit..relegation fight all seasons.

If it hadnīt been for us his wallet would have been ALOT lighter,and he might have still been at The New Den.

Tring Wolf
11-02-2012, 21:38
Ok, I'll bite....again....

Can you tell me what better offers Bully had on the table in 1986 when West Brom told him he wasn't good enough?

Did he have other offers during his time at the club? Absolutely. And quite rightly too as the man was scoring 50 goals a season and went onto be an absolute legend for us. But to suggest that (a) he had better offers at the time he joined and (b) that another club wouldn't have taken a chance on Mick is dubious at best.

I do agree with you that Mick does have reasons to be grateful to Wolves (and I'm pretty sure his recent interviews have said how grateful and privileged he feels to be manager of Wolves). I just think that the man deserves some credit and thanks for what he has given us.

PS...I'm also pretty sure we didn't rescue Mick from obscurity at the New Den but am happy to be corrected.

Nero wolf
11-02-2012, 21:43
Ok, I'll bite....again....

Can you tell me what better offers Bully had on the table in 1986 when West Brom told him he wasn't good enough?

Did he have other offers during his time at the club? Absolutely. And quite rightly too as the man was scoring 50 goals a season and went onto be an absolute legend for us. But to suggest that (a) he had better offers at the time he joined and (b) that another club wouldn't have taken a chance on Mick is dubious at best.

I do agree with you that Mick does have reasons to be grateful to Wolves (and I'm pretty sure his recent interviews have said how grateful and privileged he feels to be manager of Wolves). I just think that the man deserves some credit and thanks for what he has given us.

PS...I'm also pretty sure we didn't rescue Mick from obscurity at the New Den but am happy to be corrected.

I agree..we rescued Mick from unemployment.
The new den was figurally speakin since his debacle at Sunderland had his managerial stock lowered til that level..and he was indeed there beforehand.Darren oh dear!

If you want to say a personal thank you to Mick when indeed he is getting sacked(he wonīt leave before that)then it is your personal choice,and I have no trouble with it..on emotional grounds.
On logical grounds though..it is a whole different matter IMO...

PeteWolf
11-02-2012, 21:51
Cards on the table, I'll go with Nero banned before March.

Haggstone
11-02-2012, 21:55
Cards on the table, I'll go with Nero banned before March.

I call that and raise you the word newbie to be replaced by the word banned by this time tomorow.

Its a shame because I think he is hillarious, in a simple sort of way.

Nero wolf
11-02-2012, 22:02
You're coming across a bit jealous Nero, salaries have always been paid in return for work and generally those who achieve earn well. McCarthy contrary to your 'last chance saloon' nonsense would be a very attractive option for many clubs, it takes a hell of a lot of hard work to arrest a slide which is what he did on his arrival, he hasn't cheated the club out of a wage like so many have over the years and deserves respect for his achievements.

Sadly you are sounding like the sort of Wolves fan I'm not keen on and the type that sees other clubs fans looking down on our support. You don't have to support him unconditionally and it's fine even if you think he should go, but you're showing disrespect he doesn't deserve and the reason is quite pitiful

I do think you are a decent poster A monk.
This piece..well,I am not so sure of.
The amount of the salary should reflect the weight it has on society in a well balanced world..so yes,I give you the full amount of respect in that matter.
Footballers overall(including a certain Mick McCarthy at Wolves is grossly overpaid..sick to the stomach overpaid).It is not Micks fault..but he ainīt walking either..so at some point you have to question the overall situation in general and as such McCarthy in particular..especially given if you hold the opinion he has done a very average job in the last..say one and a half year.
I want what is best for WWFC.Given the gold we are obliged to give McCarthy,I do think the club would do better otherwise.

I donīt even expect that McCarthy expects a thank you when sacked.He is a pro..and will go where the money is largest.
If Mick is thinking about wanting a thank you..then by all means..he shouldnīt turn this into another Sunderland situation.
And Mick wonīt quit,Iīm telling you right now.He will hang on.He is a pro.

SimplyTheWolves
11-02-2012, 22:02
Without sounding disrespectful Nero, but the word baffling doesn’t seem inappropriate.

Penk Wolf
11-02-2012, 22:07
Nero, by your own omission you started to support Wolves at the start of the slide, so Mick is the best manager you have seen at the club.

Nero wolf
11-02-2012, 22:07
Without sounding disrespectful Nero, but the word baffling doesn’t seem inappropriate.

Ok..why?
I have stood my corner I think..argumenting away.

Nero wolf
11-02-2012, 22:08
Nero, by your own omission you started to support Wolves at the start of the slide, so Mick is the best manager you have seen at the club.

Sorry,another lie.
I started supported WWFC in 1977..it is stated on "your" forum.

PeteWolf
11-02-2012, 22:12
I call that and raise you the word newbie to be replaced by the word banned by this time tomorow.

Its a shame because I think he is hillarious, in a simple sort of way.
I'll offer ulvenodds of 7/3 banned by Monday 5pm.

Hamlet
11-02-2012, 22:13
Sorry,another lie.
I started supported WWFC in 1977..it is stated on "your" forum.

I'm curious now - is it true that you can't say 'wolvesforum' on here? Nope - cool! :P

Backing out of the little debate on here by the way - agree with the first poster that it's more or less stating the obvious!

Nero wolf
11-02-2012, 22:14
Nero, by your own omission you started to support Wolves at the start of the slide, so Mick is the best manager you have seen at the club.


Besides simple facts easily proved..who has been the best manager since the slide..and I remember it very well thank you..it included building new stands BTW..it is a matter of opinion.
I will always hold Turner in greater regard than McCarthy.
Why?
Simple fact is that allmighty Mick wouldnīt have touched the club with even the largest pole if founding us in the 86 situation.
Turner did.
The rest is history..and respect to the man it truly belongs to.

SimplyTheWolves
11-02-2012, 22:14
Ok..why?
I have stood my corner I think..argumenting away.


Just read through your posts and see if you are actually making sense? Just what point(s) are you trying to get across?

PeteWolf
11-02-2012, 22:15
I'll offer ulvenodds of 7/3 banned by Monday 5pm.
Will add in a special of 4/1 for causing 5 threads to get locked by the same time. 12/1 for ten threads

Tring Wolf
11-02-2012, 22:18
A contradiction wrapped up in an enigma.

Welcome to the site anyway Nero :)

Nero wolf
11-02-2012, 22:21
A contradiction wrapped up in an enigma.

Welcome to the site anyway Nero :)

Thank you.
I am not argumentative for arguments sake..and you will find that I am always honest in my opinions.
Lieing(or is it lying..I am sweedish!) is for losers.
You will probably not agree all the time..and if that is the case..I am looking forward towards a decent debate..on topic..

Ogerp
11-02-2012, 22:26
A contradiction wrapped up in an enama



Corrected it for you Tring

OldWolvesfart
11-02-2012, 22:26
To the wire (http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/wolverhampton-wanderers-fc/2012/02/11/wolves-survival-fight-will-go-to-the-wire-says-mick-mccarthy/)

This isn't a dig at Mick but I don't know whether to think wow cheers Mick for telling us what we already knew or thank him for his honesty baring in mind certain people at the club were talking about mid table.

I won't say I'm not annoyed at what I see as the clubs total lack of better transfer dealings and firmly believe that a mid table finish may have been a possibility if quality had been signed when it should have been, IE before the seasons start but that's now history and there's no way it can now be changed.

Bottom line is that the club could and should have done a massive amount more so as this current mess would have been more aviodable.

I always accept that buying big names is no guarantee of survival but I feel the club would have been fairing much better had they made a couple of better signings.

Now the club are well in the mire and a repeat of last season looking extremely likely.

Friends, Romans, countrymen - I come to bury Mick not to praise him.
The evil that men do lives after them,
The good is oft interred with their bones.

Nero wolf
11-02-2012, 22:40
Friends, Romans, countrymen - I come to bury Mick not to praise him.
The evil that men do lives after them,
The good is oft interred with their bones.

I am Claudius..really.