View Full Version : Not a dig at Hoddle...honest
SOA Wolf
12-12-2005, 21:36
Thought I had better say that, because people seem to think my every post is an attack.......when it is no more than 9 out of 10 smileys/smiley2.gif
But how do people feel about the idea of giving it till the end of January and then preparing for next season....by then we will be so far adrift even DR and all the dreamers will have to accept that a play-off spot will be gone.
So I'm advocating not wasting a penny in January and then 'blooding' as many of our youngsters as we can (I asked for this last year, but Hoddle seemed keener on protecting the unbeaten run than preparing for the following year) and building a side around the likes of Davies, Cornes, Lescott, etc so they have time to learn, gel and become a proper unit, with speed, skill and enthousiasm.
Maybe then even I would get off Hoddle's back, at least I could see some planning going on and people would not get too wracked off if we lost games.
Thoughts anyone?
League is sooo poor that a playoff place will remain achievable til late March early April IMO. Once it can't be done then yes, pay up the failures and get rid and start the rebuild. It will never happen though, no team ever does it. We will wait til after every-ones had a summer holiday before we consider next season.
Thought I had better say that, because people seem
to think my every post is an attack.......when it is no more than 9 out
of 10 smileys/smiley2.gif
But how do people feel about the idea of giving it till the end of
January and then preparing for next season....by then we will be so far
adrift even DR and all the dreamers will have to accept that a play-off
spot will be gone.
So I'm advocating not wasting a penny in January and then 'blooding'
as many of our youngsters as we can (I asked for this last year, but
Hoddle seemed keener on protecting the unbeaten run than preparing for
the following year) and building a side around the likes of Davies,
Cornes, Lescott, etc so they have time to learn, gel and become a
proper unit, with speed, skill and enthousiasm.
Maybe then even I would get off Hoddle's back, at least I could see
some planning going on and people would not get too wracked off if we
lost games.
Thoughts anyone?
evening all,
i aint no dreamer...
im a realist...
the wolves are going up....
drsmileys/smiley16.gif
Oldgold Wolfcub
12-12-2005, 22:41
SOA Hoddle has been no different than our recent managers. They are so afraid to shake something up and prepare the youngsters and bring them on. Then we wonder why the team lacks that bite.
Of course some of the youngsters should have been brought in instead of the apathy sometimes shown. Instead it is easier to blame another draw on the one miss from Kenny Miller.
Stewarton Wolf
12-12-2005, 22:42
On the 1st January 2003 we had played 26 got 38 pts and a goal
difference of +14 we were 10th in the League 4pts of 6th place and a
massive 21 pts behind the leaders, we still went up though, why give
in. Even if we get the the play-off final and lose we will as a
club be better placed for next season financally. Promotion will
almost certainly come through the play-offs. We are hard to beat
this will be a big advantage in the semi's and if we get to cardiff we
will be alright, lets face it the last time we lost a one off final was
1939.
The seasons not over lets try and lift it a little and get behind the
team. As for blooding youngsters I thought GH was doing well on
this front (Davies, Clarke, Gobern and now Cornes on the fringes of the
squad). The injuries have cost us badly and I admit that to a
degree I thought we had enough strength in depth - wrong. But
january is here and we can and should without a doubt spend.
Keep the faith
whitemouse75
12-12-2005, 22:49
But how do people feel about the idea of giving it till the end of January and then preparing for next season....by then we will be so far adrift even DR and all the dreamers will have to accept that a play-off spot will be gone.how can a playoff spot be gone by january?
So I'm advocating not wasting a penny in January and then 'blooding' as many of our youngsters as we can (I asked for this last year, but Hoddle seemed keener on protecting the unbeaten run than preparing for the following year) and building a side around the likes of Davies, Cornes, Lescott, etc so they have time to learn, gel and become a proper unit, with speed, skill and enthousiasm.we were 7 points off the playoffs at the end,so that was only 2 games to play the youngsters realistically
Maybe then even I would get off Hoddle's back, at least I could see some planning going on and people would not get too wracked off if we lost games.
Thoughts anyone?i'm with daft roger, UP THE WOLVES!!!smileys/smiley11.gif
SOA Wolf
Well done. To start a thread about giving up on the season when we are currently two points out of the play-offs is probably your daftest post yet.
Hibbitt was King
13-12-2005, 10:00
As tempting as SOA's idea is, you can't give up on promotion (via the play-offs only of course). For all the carp the team produce, they could still do it (but I think if they do make the top six, they don't have the determination to come through the 3 matches as Jones' side did).
OGW, I have direct from our CEO that bringing through youngsters at Molineux is particularly difficult because of the pressure exerted by the more "vocal" and "knowledgeable" element of our crowd.
Essex Wolf
13-12-2005, 10:12
I can partly agree with what SOA is saying here and tend to agree with some of it.However there are some previso's I'd considerbefore totally adopting SOA's policy of how to go.
There are 4 games left before the new year of which 3 are at home with our only away game at Sheff Wed. If things go our way for a change Wolves could? pick up max points or as little as 4 but I'm hoping for at least 8 and hopefully 10 and if so I believe Wolves will be in the PO zone.
If that is the case I feel GH should strengthen the squad straight away so as Wolves at least have a good chance of taking a PO place. What I would say here is that the players signed though must also be good enough for next seasons promotion push should we fail this season.
If however the next 4 games see us well of the running then I'd say SOA's idea seems prudent.
Uncle Festa
13-12-2005, 10:13
Just proves that our CEO knows $$$$$$$ all. What are we meant to do when we play away - tell the oppositions fans to be kind on the youngsters as they are a bit frail? Its more difficult to perform in the lower leagues where you hear every word said from the sidelines than the likes of Molineux. If the kids are worried about a bit of heckling then they havn't got the character to make it - simple as that. But what a load of nuts from the pie man anyway - does he not stop and think before he opens his big gob - any problems relating to Wolves are always down to the fans in his eyes - yet without us he wouldn't be picking up his half a million a year.w!$*ER
scottishwolf II
13-12-2005, 10:17
2 points off 5th. i reckon we should sell our most valuable players, ground etc. we're doomed
Essex Wolf
13-12-2005, 10:18
You also have to remember though UF that without Moxey the club wouldn't be saving millions as well.
SOA Wolf
13-12-2005, 13:21
SOA Wolf
Well done. To start a thread about giving up on the season when we are currently two points out of the play-offs is probably your daftest post yet.
But I am not saying that...I am saying wait until the end of january when I am sure we will be at least 4 or 5 points off the play-offs, be in the bottom half of the table and all those on here who were 'confident' of promotion moving the targets even lower ....something that has happened all season....what's the point of that...plan properly, like should have happened last season and didn't.
As for everyone saying 'wait until after the January transfer window'.......why? What do you think is really going to happen...he did nothing last January, nothing in the summer...he's had two shots at buying and done nothing, what is going to change?
Actually, I have used the phrase 'what is going to change?' so many times in the past year, that I cannot understand why people are so blind.....Hoddle is perfectly consistent...we are the same now as after his first few games....boring football, drawing matches, going nowhere.
scottishwolf II
13-12-2005, 13:29
SOA - its been debated before, but do you attach any blame for our draws to the strikers not being able to finish?
But I am not saying that...I am saying wait until the end of january when I am sure we will be at least 4 or 5 points off the play-offs,
What do you think is really going to happen...he did nothing last January, nothing in the summer...
I don't know the stats, but IF we are 4 or 5 points off the play-offs and IF we do exactly the same results-wise as we did last season from Jan onwards, would that not mean we will end up in the play-offs?
SOA Wolf
13-12-2005, 13:37
SOA - its been debated before, but do you attach any blame for our draws to the strikers not being able to finish?
Problem is Scottishwolf is that football is a team game...and only managers who are desperate or failing tend to drag out elements in isolation like this....of course missing chances is an issue, but the reason we are struggling....no. You can improve strikers...look at Miller when he went up to Scotland, specialist coaching, scores regularly, comes back here and cannot find his *rse, never mind the net.
I see us create maybe 4 or 5 chances a game, I see the likes of Arsenal and Man Utd create 10 to 15...our system is poor, our coaching is poor. If the players cannot finish, coach them, if that does not work, change them...do not forget Hoddle was happy enough with them at the start of the season and has had the summer and the loan window to find players...Forest got tyson...so how were we unable to find anyone...it is utter hogwash...if they cannot do this then it shows they are not up to the job.
Last season people did not give Dave Jones much sympathy when missed penalties cost us enough points to have had us in touch with the play-offs, he got blamed (and quite rightly) for not getting players to practice penalties....well shock horror news people, Hoddle got England knocked out of the World Cup for that very reason....his preparation is poor...the blame lies with him.
That is part of his job, that is why he gets paid so much, if he doesn't like the responsibility I suggest he gets a job digging holes....well actually he does that already.
SOA Wolf
13-12-2005, 14:53
But I am not saying that...I am saying wait until the end of january when I am sure we will be at least 4 or 5 points off the play-offs,
What do you think is really going to happen...he did nothing last January, nothing in the summer...
I don't know the stats, but IF we are 4 or 5 points off the play-offs and IF we do exactly the same results-wise as we did last season from Jan onwards, would that not mean we will end up in the play-offs?
NO....at the end of Jan we were 10 points off the POs and we finished 7 behind, so we only caught up 3 points....which is another reason why I find the optimism of some so starnge, they point to the run of last season as something tremendous, but the average points for Hoddle has remained consistent....well below what Jones achieved, so how he is SUDDENLY going to change our fortunes when he has done nothing to date is bewildering...I ask people to supply evidence for their reasoning, just like the statistics I continually produce and all I get is vague Hoddlespeak, or Moxeyspeak regurgitated as if it fact with no supporting facts.
Right. It deosn't seem very likely that Hoddle will turn it around then it, does it? Especially if Miller goes and is replaced by a more inexperienced striker as seems likely.
However, I don't see the point of writing the season off because I suspect that as soon as the players detect that there's nothing to play for they'll just start dreaming about their summer holidays and prancing around the pitch in February instead of waiting until April like they usually do.
Anyway, of the three you mention, one started playing in the first team before he got injured and the other doesn't really have anything left to learn at this level. And of the other youngsters, don't you think it better to introduce them slowly so they can play alongside experienced pros like Ganea, Anderton &Ince and learn the ropes from their experience?
scottishwolf II
13-12-2005, 17:02
But I am not saying that...I am saying wait until the end of january
when I am sure we will be at least 4 or 5 points off the play-offs,
What do you think is really going to happen...he did nothing last January, nothing in the summer...
I don't know the stats, but IF we are 4 or 5 points off the
play-offs and IF we do exactly the same results-wise as we did last
season from Jan onwards, would that not mean we will end up in the
play-offs?
NO....at the end of Jan we were 10 points off the POs and we
finished 7 behind, so we only caught up 3 points....which is another
reason why I find the optimism of some so starnge, they point to the
run of last season as something tremendous, but the average points for
Hoddle has remained consistent....well below what Jones achieved, so
how he is SUDDENLY going to change our fortunes when he has done
nothing to date is bewildering...I ask people to supply evidence for
their reasoning, just like the statistics I continually produce and all
I get is vague Hoddlespeak, or Moxeyspeak regurgitated as if it fact
with no supporting facts.
right now we are 2 points off, so if we turn around that +3 points then we are in the playoffs right?
scottishwolf II
13-12-2005, 17:08
SOA - its been debated
before, but do you attach any blame for our draws to the strikers not
being able to finish?
Problem is Scottishwolf is that football is a team game...and only
managers who are desperate or failing tend to drag out elements in
isolation like this....of course missing chances is an issue, but the
reason we are struggling....no. You can improve strikers...look
at Miller when he went up to Scotland, specialist coaching, scores
regularly, comes back here and cannot find his *rse, never mind the net.
I see us create maybe 4 or 5 chances a game, I see the likes of
Arsenal and Man Utd create 10 to 15...our system is poor, our coaching
is poor. If the players cannot finish, coach them, if that does
not work, change them...do not forget Hoddle was happy enough with them
at the start of the season and has had the summer and the loan window
to find players...Forest got tyson...so how were we unable to find
anyone...it is utter hogwash...if they cannot do this then it shows
they are not up to the job.
Last season people did not give Dave Jones much sympathy when missed
penalties cost us enough points to have had us in touch with the
play-offs, he got blamed (and quite rightly) for not getting players to
practice penalties....well shock horror news people, Hoddle got England
knocked out of the World Cup for that very reason....his preparation is
poor...the blame lies with him.
That is part of his job, that is why he gets paid so much, if he
doesn't like the responsibility I suggest he gets a job digging
holes....well actually he does that already.
all good points mate, but mine wasn't a pro or anti-hoddle question. i
just wonder if youre at a match and you see seol/cort/miller/etc spank
an easy chance over the bar what you think. do you go - oh that's
hoddle's fault or do you think - for gods sake can one of you please
stick it in the net, after all its what you get paid to do!
Scottishwolf, you're right! Yay, we're gonna make it after all! For a short while there I was taken in by SOA Wolf and his "statistics I continually produce" to prove his argument, not realising that his statistics were based on him seeing into the future and knowing we will in fact be 4 points out of the playoffs in January.
SOA Wolf
13-12-2005, 19:48
Scottish, Fenella, my point was that should we be 4 or 5 points away then we have little chance of making up the difference based on anything that has happened before...that even includes the great run by Jones' team 3 years ago. I am saying that based on the way we are playing, the teams we are up against and the way the teams above us are performing, I will be surprised at us being any nearer than 4 or 5 points adrift.
My point about my stats is that I do, at least, provide figures, evidence and stats...not just 'I believe Hoddle will do it' asthe only support for an argument.
Scottish with regard to what do I think when a striker misses...of course I think 'what a silly billy', but for as long as I can remember I have also thought that when I see it happen on a regular basis I have asked...'do they practice shooting in training?' I always think that if I was in charge they would be in at 9am Sunday morning and shooting 100 times at a target and would not be going home until they hit it 20 times in a row....I think players are pampered (there's a word, eh?) and I have been an advocate of afternoons being spent on skill training...most of the best players have done this of their own accord (e.g. Beckham with free kicks)...which means it has little to do with luck on a match day.....as the saying goes (Gary Player said it as I was corrected to admitting) the more I practice the luckier I get...if Hoddle is not happy, then do something about it man...instead he seems happy to have scapegoats to cover his own failings and this has been something he has a history of.
SOA believe you me, GH does not pamper players. In fact I would go as far as to say they probably feel inferior to him.
I asked a club insider - not a steward BTW - a few days ago regarding the level of $$$$$$$ings the players got when performances were not good. He replied he even found it difficult to be in the same room as them - it was that bad!
Hence my feeling why GH is so frustrated. Now, if anyone says GH's attitude is why we are not achieving then I say nuts becuase one thing I would love to do as a player, is to put one over my own Boss and show him how its done. The sad thing is, I don't think many of our players can...hence the current malaise!
SOA Wolf
14-12-2005, 12:27
SOA believe you me, GH does not pamper players. In fact I would go as far as to say they probably feel inferior to him.
I asked a club insider - not a steward BTW - a few days ago regarding the level of $$$$$$$ings the players got when performances were not good. He replied he even found it difficult to be in the same room as them - it was that bad!
Hence my feeling why GH is so frustrated. Now, if anyone says GH's attitude is why we are not achieving then I say nuts becuase one thing I would love to do as a player, is to put one over my own Boss and show him how its done. The sad thing is, I don't think many of our players can...hence the current malaise!
Few points 7X, first if what you are saying is correct (not denying it, but always have to be careful of what someone else tells you) it shows Hoddle must be cr*p at man management...just shouting at someone is not how to b*ll*ck them, there are different ways...frankly the scariest people I know rarely raise their voices....the point is it has to be effective....so i still say they are pampered...because it is clear that shouting has no effect, because clearly they feel 'safe'...why? Because (a) it is having no effect, and (b) all the players keep saying how they love Glenn....read the WM fans forum comments and numerous other reports....it looks like they are still on easy street....I would sooner the players were just plain quiet, knowing they were actually 'working' and feeling like they have to prove themselves.
Second as for a player proving himself, well again you make the incorrect assumption (read books by past managers for comment after comment on this) that most players have any intelligence of note, you have to just tell them what to do, not expect them to think or prove themselves....Hoddle seems to have failed to grasp this.
Man management is all about knowing how to deal with individuals, I see little evidence of this.
RoffeyWolf
14-12-2005, 12:47
building a side around the likes of Davies, Cornes, Lescott, etc so they have time to learn, gel and become a proper unit, with speed, skill and enthousiasm.
Thoughts anyone?
Just one - where the $$$$$$$ is the speed coming from?
scottishwolf II
14-12-2005, 13:37
Scottish, Fenella, my point was that should we be 4
or 5 points away then we have little chance of making up the difference
based on anything that has happened before...that even includes the
great run by Jones' team 3 years ago. I am saying that based on
the way we are playing, the teams we are up against and the way the
teams above us are performing, I will be surprised at us being any
nearer than 4 or 5 points adrift.
My point about my stats is that I do, at least, provide figures,
evidence and stats...not just 'I believe Hoddle will do it' asthe
only support for an argument.
Scottish with regard to what do I think when a striker misses...of
course I think 'what a silly billy', but for as long as I can remember
I have also thought that when I see it happen on a regular basis I have
asked...'do they practice shooting in training?' I always think
that if I was in charge they would be in at 9am Sunday morning and
shooting 100 times at a target and would not be going home until they
hit it 20 times in a row....I think players are pampered (there's a
word, eh?) and I have been an advocate of afternoons being spent on
skill training...most of the best players have done this of their own
accord (e.g. Beckham with free kicks)...which means it has little to do
with luck on a match day.....as the saying goes (Gary Player said it as
I was corrected to admitting) the more I practice the luckier I
get...if Hoddle is not happy, then do something about it man...instead
he seems happy to have scapegoats to cover his own failings and this
has been something he has a history of.
SOA, i think you provide some good value to the board with your use of stats and argument.
however, you are surely hoisted by your own petard here? (first time
that's ever been used on this board?). you are using the stats and
argument to build something that then speculates we are 100% in your
view going to be too far off the playoffs in January to make it.
going on wolves recent history (except the season we imploded) we have
tended to make a stronger finish than start (e.g. the last 2 seasons).
so if you take that into account and we do get that +3 points you have
described from last season on our competitors for the play-off place
then we are in there. This argument may seem weak to you but it is made
up of similar stats and logic to those you are using.
also - how do you know that Hoddle isn't making them do that in
training? Again, you say you back up your arguments - but this is just
pure speculation. As such you should surely not use it? Or at least not
use it if you are going to claim in a lot of posts that you are
providing evidence and stats to back it up.
SOA Wolf
14-12-2005, 14:11
Scottish, you are correct I do not know everything that Hoddle does in training and can only go on what feedback I have had...the majority of which is that training starts at 10am and finished around midday...so if there are problems there is plenty of opportunity to deal with them and surely a good coach could do this....and that is, if you wish, my evidence.....I have seen no improvement in the players, in fact we seemed to be getting worse in most areas...look at the results, the same players are producing worse results than last season.
What greater evidence do you need....bad luck can be pulled out as an excuse for one or two games, but after 10, 15, 20 it really points to bigger issues...he was happy with the squad and he is responsible for training and tactics.
By the way, the chances that Hoddle does anything to help the players in training these days should come under doubt, Miller said on Soccer AM recently that he rarely takes training these days and has been doing less and less.....frankly that is a disgrace, if true, with the current problems he should be looking at this area with a microscope to find out what the problems are.
As for the second half of the season, agreed we do have a better second half generally, although how do you know if that is going to happen. The point I made is that even using the great run under Jones...when at the nd of Dec we were 10th 25gms 37 points and the end of Jan 28gms 42points and we hauled 39 points from 21 matches...we only just scraped in (1 defeat I believe...away at Brighton). Last season the so called 'great run' under Hoddle yielded 38 points from 23 matches.....even if we matched these we are talking a very close thing to get into the play-offs.
My point was IF and I keep saying IF at the end of Jan we are 4 or 5 points or more (and I personally believe it will be more) then we are probably wasting our time and should work towards next year.
Who wants to have a bet on us getting to the play-offs then.....not even promotion which I was happy to have bet with people.
Del Woppio
14-12-2005, 14:17
£10 right now. hand snatched off.
SOA Wolf
14-12-2005, 14:23
£10 right now. hand snatched off.
OK. how about £10...going to charity just for the play-offs, are you up for another £20 from me against £10 from you for promotion on top...after all weren't you convinced we were going up automatically at the start of the season and still convinced we would get promoted?
Happy if the mods look after the money on this.....there'll be no welching from me...what do you reckon Del?
Del Woppio
14-12-2005, 14:28
i'll leave it at just the tenner for the play offs if its all the same - not that confident!!
no problem with some one holding the money either.
I can see it now, last minute of the last game, we need a point to reach the playoffs, SOA prays for an Ashton hattrick.....
SOA Wolf
14-12-2005, 14:35
i'll leave it at just the tenner for the play offs if its all the same - not that confident!!
no problem with some one holding the money either.
I can see it now, last minute of the last game, we need a point to reach the playoffs, SOA prays for an Ashton hattrick.....
If you think about it Del, I'm on a win win...if we get to the play-offs I'll be happy (well...if we win then anyway!!!!) and if not then I win a bet....you have all the pressure!!smileys/smiley2.gif
I can honestly say that if we went up I would be really happy....just have not been able to see why people have been so confident since this man took over.....we look pants to me....I wish he WOULD prove me wrong and turn us into a winning attractive team...at least all those saturdays, tuesdays, fridays, sundays, etc would not feel so gloomy.
I'll pm you to sort out.
scottishwolf II
14-12-2005, 15:14
SOA, again mate i do value your contribution, but i think this is a bit of a swiss cheese debate.
In terms of evidence - suddenly what Miller says on Soccer AM is
gospel, but Hoddle is talking the same old twaddle. Surely you'd
believe the more committed Wolves man as a rule?
In terms of same players, worse results. well there not all the same
are they? miller, cort, ince played the majority of the second half of
last season but have been out injured a lot this season. so its
actually not the same players - the evidence shows us that.
SOA Wolf
14-12-2005, 17:43
SOA, again mate i do value your contribution, but i think this is a bit of a swiss cheese debate.
In terms of evidence - suddenly what Miller says on Soccer AM is gospel, but Hoddle is talking the same old twaddle. Surely you'd believe the more committed Wolves man as a rule?
In terms of same players, worse results. well there not all the same are they? miller, cort, ince played the majority of the second half of last season but have been out injured a lot this season. so its actually not the same players - the evidence shows us that.
Scottish, actually do not want to get bogged down too much in the predicting the second half of the season...I will say this, I did predict our current position even though 80-90% on here were saying we would be top 6 or even top 2 by now...none of this is a surprise to me and a few others....all of whom were pilloried for being negative...again I will say we were realistic and have, so far, been proven to be correct. I find it hard to understand why people are holding their heads in their hands saying they cannot fathom what has gone wrong...it has all been so predictable....I even said we would struggle against teams at home because we would be unable to break them down and would not score against them.....obvious really, it was happening last season and nothing has changed.
Again, my question was a 'what if' and what would people want us to do...the reason for asking it now was before the January window...should we be spending the money on a player for the latter half of the season hoping we make it, or build long term?
HazelGroveWolf
14-12-2005, 18:01
SOA you are quickly becoming the thinking man's Essex. Nothing will sway your conviction that Glenn Hoddle is not the man for the job. At the same time you refuse to see other contributing factors such as injuries andplayers failing to score sitters.
I hope I'm a bit more measured, as a manager I give him until the end of next season. My reason is, as you say, he needs to educate himself. If promotion is achieved this season then it is job done if not give GH the opportunity to prove himself.
My understanding is that GH's renumeration is highly incentivised. If he gets £1m on promotion then I see that as money well spent. I think you will find that if he fails then GH's salary will fall far short of the headline rate. I challenge everyone to dispute that.
I challenge everyone to dispute that.
I dispute it.
What do I win?
RoffeyWolf
14-12-2005, 18:09
I challenge everyone to dispute that.
I dispute it.
What do I win?
Nicely argued, I can see your point.
SOA Wolf
14-12-2005, 19:14
SOA you are quickly becoming the thinking man's Essex.
WOW that does reduce my appeal on this board then doesn't it? smileys/smiley2.gif
scottishwolf II
14-12-2005, 19:57
SOA, on the struggling to break teams down at home - i said that would
happen when we got relegated from the prem! no-one believed me then....
i am starting to agree with HGW - you are tending to repsond to me by
trotting out the view you want to get across, rather than coming back
on my comments. Are you an MP? smileys/smiley2.gif
oh and fair point - you have been putting what if's in there.
SOA Wolf
15-12-2005, 01:32
SOA, on the struggling to break teams down at home - i said that would happen when we got relegated from the prem! no-one believed me then....
i am starting to agree with HGW - you are tending to repsond to me by trotting out the view you want to get across, rather than coming back on my comments. Are you an MP? smileys/smiley2.gif
oh and fair point - you have been putting what if's in there.
But which comments have I not addressed?...oh by the way one I didn't was about taking the word of the more committed Wolves person...Miller and Hoddle....tough call, never felt Hoddle has been committed particularly and many on here preferred to take his word over anyone else even when he was on a 6 month contract....even now he is only on a 12 month one effectively.
Miller was talking casually and not in a pre-prepared statement, so I have no reason to doubt what he said, plus Hoddle has never made any comment about the amount of time he spends on training, certainly not recently....all I can ever recall is, we must work harder (a phrase that has always p!$*ed me off no matter what manager says it....indicates they have not been working hard enough already...surely they should mean try some alternatives) and the other was the recent public attack on the players saying they were in for a hard week, but at no time did he say he was going to be running any, most or all of the sessions.....so Miller's statements are the only ones available.
Manitoba Wolf
15-12-2005, 03:39
If Cooper still played here we'd find out how long the training was and who was there actually supervising the training!!
Thinking of Cooper made me realize how DJ squandered all those millions again......
scottishwolf II
15-12-2005, 09:32
SOA, on the struggling to
break teams down at home - i said that would happen when we got
relegated from the prem! no-one believed me then....
i am
starting to agree with HGW - you are tending to repsond to me by
trotting out the view you want to get across, rather than coming back
on my comments. Are you an MP? smileys/smiley2.gif
oh and fair point - you have been putting what if's in there.
But which comments have I not addressed?...oh by the way one I
didn't was about taking the word of the more committed Wolves
person...Miller and Hoddle....tough call, never felt Hoddle has been
committed particularly and many on here preferred to take his word over
anyone else even when he was on a 6 month contract....even now he is
only on a 12 month one effectively.
Miller was talking casually and not in a pre-prepared statement, so
I have no reason to doubt what he said, plus Hoddle has never made any
comment about the amount of time he spends on training, certainly not
recently....all I can ever recall is, we must work harder (a phrase
that has always p!$*ed me off no matter what manager says
it....indicates they have not been working hard enough already...surely
they should mean try some alternatives) and the other was the recent
public attack on the players saying they were in for a hard week, but
at no time did he say he was going to be running any, most or all of
the sessions.....so Miller's statements are the only ones available.
well you didnt address either point in fact. you just banged your usual
drum. "Mr SWII thats not the point, I'd like to ignore them and talk
about this....."
how on earth could you know he wasnt prepared for the interview? anyone
with an agent who goes on a live show is no lemon mate (well some are,
but at least prepped lemons smileys/smiley2.gif). hate to
shatter your illusions, but they know the questions.....easier to look
casual if thats the case eh? Also, if miller has ben injured for the
last 5-6 weeks, wouldn't it be a better idea for him not to train??? or
was this programme on before then? if so when - when dave jones was
manager?
and when you were saying it was the same team performing badly, i said
it wasnt as ince/cort/miller have all been out and were mainstays of
the 2nd half of the season
2 points - both ignored. that was my point....
SOA Wolf
15-12-2005, 09:47
well you didnt address either point in fact. you just banged your usual drum. "Mr SWII thats not the point, I'd like to ignore them and talk about this....."
how on earth could you know he wasnt prepared for the interview? anyone with an agent who goes on a live show is no lemon mate (well some are, but at least prepped lemons smileys/smiley2.gif). hate to shatter your illusions, but they know the questions.....easier to look casual if thats the case eh? Also, if miller has ben injured for the last 5-6 weeks, wouldn't it be a better idea for him not to train??? or was this programme on before then? if so when - when dave jones was manager?
and when you were saying it was the same team performing badly, i said it wasnt as ince/cort/miller have all been out and were mainstays of the 2nd half of the season
2 points - both ignored. that was my point....
OK to answer the two points...I happen to know the SoccerAM team...it is the business I am in....so I know all about pre-preapared questions...ad-libs that are not ad-libs etc. So without getting into specifics on here...it was a casual remark.
Miller's answer was that Hoddle was not taking much of the coaching these days, nothing to do with him personally, so his being out was not relevant, but he had said he had started light training, to the surprise of Mr Lovejoy who thought the injury would have kept him away longer.
As for our run being based on 3 players....are we determined to clutch at straws on this.....first if you look at our form with those players available (and I have done the figures before, when I am back from London I will attempt to dig them out) the sequences have been no better...I did a thread called sequences if you wish to look it up....so frankly I see no great change in them returning....Hoddle's return on points is remarkably consistent.....just good enough for play-off or well below in any 6 match sequence....so overall not good enough. Second, how do we know they are going to be available for the second half of the season...Cort's 5 or 6 weeks is dragging out isn't it? Third two of those three have histories of being injury prone...Cort was even out at the start of last season if you recall, so if that is what anyone's hope was based on then it indicates pretty poor planning. 4th I would even argue that they were the main reasons...I thought, for example, that most people on here thought the form of Naylor was a major factore...so what's happened to him under 'mr wonderful coach' Hoddle?
Perhaps you would like to anser my points?smileys/smiley2.gif
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