View Full Version : Fed up with mediocrity
I am getting really fed up with the mediocrity of this wolves side. We have some talented players but they just dont perform week in week out. We all live in hope that the likes of olofinjana and eastwood will play to their undoubted ability and drive us to promotion but it never happens. We have too many players that either dont perform to their ability or are just an 'ok' sort of player.
Rob edwards, neill collins, gary breen, jody craddock, darren ward, michael gray, darren potter, seyi olofinjana, freddy eastwood, jay bothroyd, stephen elliot... i could keep going but could anyone give me a reason why we should keep on tolerating these sort of players who are either not good enough or just underperforming on a regular basis? Its time we got in a strong manager who will pick players on the strength of performances on the pitch and gets rid of the ones who just dont cut it. We have too many of the latter quite frankly.
Kenny-11
17-04-2008, 08:11
I am getting really fed up with the mediocrity of this wolves side. .
Tough $$$$
Oxford Wolf
17-04-2008, 08:14
Freddie Eastwood - hardly given a fair crack of the whip
Rob Edwards - hardly played all season
Michael Gray - been one of our best players lately
I think you are being unfair to group these players in a section where you say 'have undoubted ability to drive us to promotion but it never happens'.
The likes of Neil Collins I agree completely, but I think you are being unfair to a few people you have mentioned.
The biggest example of mediocrity at WWFC is the manager!
ROVERT47
17-04-2008, 10:31
The biggest example of mediocrity at WWFC is the manager!
Oh i dunno,the big screens and the PA system are dire!
Gray has played well i agree, but eastwood rarely makes any impact from the subs bench, olo should be the best midfield player in this division on ability but he just doesnt have the drive to be the player he should be. We need players who will do the job, not one who continually fail to deliver.
Flitwick Wolf
17-04-2008, 11:21
Freddie Eastwood - hardly given a fair crack of the whip
Wrong.
Has anyone got that list of Freddy's games for us which was posted on here a while back?
Bugsy911
17-04-2008, 11:36
Sticking a guy on with 10mins to go every game is hardly giving him a fair chance...in addtion he is being asked to play in midfield most the time whilst the lump that is KK is taking up a central role alongside EB.
Folks wonder why we looked a bit ragged towards the end of the game against WBA which didnt shock me in the slightest as our midfield consisted of the "non show again Gibson" 2 strikers in Keogh and Eastwood with Olo having to do the work of 4 players.
Until the balance of the squad is addressed then we will continue with this mess of the formation late on in games...for me Keogh isnt worth his place up front and Eastwood deserves the last few games of the season as a central striker.
Flitwick Wolf
17-04-2008, 11:49
Sticking a guy on with 10mins to go every game is hardly giving him a fair chance...in addtion he is being asked to play in midfield most the time whilst the lump that is KK is taking up a central role alongside EB.
Folks wonder why we looked a bit ragged towards the end of the game against WBA which didnt shock me in the slightest as our midfield consisted of the "non show again Gibson" 2 strikers in Keogh and Eastwood with Olo having to do the work of 4 players.
Until the balance of the squad is addressed then we will continue with this mess of the formation late on in games...for me Keogh isnt worth his place up front and Eastwood deserves the last few games of the season as a central striker.
Like I say, the stats are about somewhere which may surprise you.
Bugsy911
17-04-2008, 11:52
Time on the pitch is irrelevant when the guy is not playing as a central striker.
One defeat, even if it is against bitter rivals, does not equal a mediocre side. Of the players you mentioned, only two would get in the side if everyone was fit, the rest are more than adequate squad players.
Florida Wolfey
17-04-2008, 12:37
Oh look.... we've lost another game .... supporters my arse.
The Weasel
17-04-2008, 13:17
Jody Craddock has been a rock since returning from Stoke, he was our MotM on Tuesday.
Gratters
17-04-2008, 13:57
But we're "building a team" !! Arse !
Sozzled Wolf
17-04-2008, 14:21
Jody Craddock has been a rock since returning from Stoke, he was our MotM on Tuesday.
Yes he was but to be honest mate he's still capable of the odd clanger (nowhere near as much as Collins, mind!), and I wouldn't be dismayed if he were replaced in the summer.
Oldgoldwulf
17-04-2008, 14:35
Oh look.... we've lost another game .... supporters my arse.
What...? Just because our anger, consternation, and overall displeasure at the way McCarthy is miss-managing our team doesn't fit in with your utopian view of things - we are apparently crap supporters???
Moron!!!
Next time you are over here - Season Ticket in hand why don't you pop into the Hogshead and we can talk sensibly about the way Wolves have been playing all season long...
Oh - I forgot... you wouldn't know would you?!!!
Wrong.
Has anyone got that list of Freddy's games for us which was posted on here a while back?
You're wrong.
A fair crack of the whip is 5 or 6 games in a row starting with a settled team around you so you can learn how to play with them.
He has NOT been given a fair crack of the whip, just been expected to come in cold and score or he's dropped.
He needs to find himself a good club, with a decent manager and he could well get over 20 goals a season in the ccc.
He will be an asset to somone in this division, probably as they outperform us in a McIndoe style.
OCD Wolf
17-04-2008, 14:58
Indeed, Frankowski was given a 'fair crack of the Whip' and came up immensley short. The Jury will still be out on Freddy until he's given a decent run of 6+ full games in a settled and competitive side.
Unfortunatley, I don't think this will come at Wolves...
Indeed, Frankowski was given a 'fair crack of the Whip' and came up immensley short. The Jury will still be out on Freddy until he's given a decent run of 6+ full games in a settled and competitive side.
Unfortunatley, I don't think this will come at Wolves...
I think you might be right - if McCarthy remains in charge. If however, we get a decent manager in ...
Sozzled Wolf
17-04-2008, 15:24
By saying we should get a decent manager in, you're obviously saying MM is a failure as a manager.
He may not be good enough for us (we'll know in a few games' time as the final league position is the ultimate performance measure), but he could still do a decent job for another club, as he has done previously. I'm purposefully sitting on the fence at the moment until the end of the season (sometimes having to bite my lip, admittedly), but until then let's support the club and see where it takes us.
Let those hay-chewing tractor boys quiver with fear on Sat when confronted with the noise of united Wolves fans.
Flitwick Wolf
17-04-2008, 15:36
You're wrong.
A fair crack of the whip is 5 or 6 games in a row starting with a settled team around you so you can learn how to play with them.
He has NOT been given a fair crack of the whip, just been expected to come in cold and score or he's dropped.
He needs to find himself a good club, with a decent manager and he could well get over 20 goals a season in the ccc.
He will be an asset to somone in this division, probably as they outperform us in a McIndoe style.
Scoring 20 goals is fantastic, but if it means that we've been playing with virtually 10 men all game and lose 2-1, it means $$$$ all.
Eastwood is a lazy arse of a player.
He will score goals at some club, no doubt about it, but only if they are happy for him to do nowt for the other 89 minutes.
By saying we should get a decent manager in, you're obviously saying MM is a failure as a manager.
He may not be good enough for us (we'll know in a few games' time as the final league position is the ultimate performance measure), but he could still do a decent job for another club, as he has done previously. I'm purposefully sitting on the fence at the moment until the end of the season (sometimes having to bite my lip, admittedly), but until then let's support the club and see where it takes us.
Let those hay-chewing tractor boys quiver with fear on Sat when confronted with the noise of united Wolves fans.
I guess it's too early to say whether he is a failure - but he will be if he hasn't taken us forward over two seasons. If he get's us up then that's another story. Irrespective of that though I was sceptical when he was appointed and he hasn't done anything so far to make me alter my opinion.
An interesting four games coming up, for sure.
wolvesman
17-04-2008, 15:45
Scoring 20 goals is fantastic, but if it means that we've been playing with virtually 10 men all game and lose 2-1, it means $$$$ all.
Eastwood is a lazy arse of a player.
He will score goals at some club, no doubt about it, but only if they are happy for him to do nowt for the other 89 minutes.
I don't know why so much effort is spent on talking about Eastwood.
I wanted him here, but admit I was wrong. Nothing personal and wish him well somewhere else in the future.
He has no future here whatsoever and the sooner hes gone the better it will be for us all.
PS I find it difficult to see a future for Gibson anywhere in football if he plays many times as he did on Tuesday.
Sozzled Wolf
17-04-2008, 15:54
Irrespective of that though I was sceptical when he was appointed and he hasn't done anything so far to make me alter my opinion.
Ditto - I too wasn't overly-enamoured at his appointment, but let's judge him when the time comes. If he doesn't succeed with promotion then many people will be justified in saying he hasn't cut the mustard at our club.
Flitwick Wolf
17-04-2008, 15:55
I don't know why so much effort is spent on talking about Eastwood.
I wanted him here, but admit I was wrong. Nothing personal and wish him well somewhere else in the future.
He has no future here whatsoever and the sooner hes gone the better it will be for us all.
PS I find it difficult to see a future for Gibson anywhere in football if he plays many times as he did on Tuesday.
I was also chuffed when Eastwood signed, purely because I had seen his goal record in this league. What I should have done is listen to the Southend supporters in my office you said he was a lazy so and so whose goals hide his inabilities to play in a team.
Gibson (and Potter) should be sent packing in the summer IMO.
Sozzled Wolf
17-04-2008, 15:57
Gibson (and Potter) should be sent packing in the summer IMO.
I'll tear my hair out if that dead wood is still at our club by the start of the 08/09 campaign.
Florida Wolfey
17-04-2008, 16:39
What...? Just because our anger, consternation, and overall displeasure at the way McCarthy is miss-managing our team doesn't fit in with your utopian view of things - we are apparently crap supporters???
Moron!!!
Next time you are over here - Season Ticket in hand why don't you pop into the Hogshead and we can talk sensibly about the way Wolves have been playing all season long...
Oh - I forgot... you wouldn't know would you?!!!
Well it took 2 hrs before the inevitable boring b/s that because a person is 4,000 miles away he doesn't know what is going on.
MM is miss-managing the team is he? Let's examine that... last season he took a bare outfit and turned them into play off contenders. Bet he regrets that now for all the bloody gratitude he's received this season from so called supporters who turn at the first run of bad results.
Yes, he's made mistakes. It happens but it looks like he's learned from it and we've now played reasonably well in our last few matches. Also, it might have escaped your notice that the current miss management has us on the verge of the play offs again...not that the thick numbskulls will ever understand that football has its ups and downs and that the real time a team needs support is when things aren't going so well.
Every week some of us listen via internet / radio or whatever other means available to us and whilst we will always be second place to those who can attend that doesn't mean we aren't allowed our opinion.
My opinion is that some of our supporters have been an absolute disgrace this season. Note: I said some, not all. Those that start threads like this one are in that bracket IMO and the club is better off without them and their destructive nature. If that offends so be it.
Hatch End Wolf
17-04-2008, 17:15
Sorry Florida, Mick hasn't learned anything new this season. Hence following the Boggies defeat he said his usual mantra: "we put a shift in"!
His teams certainly do. Unfortunately it takes more than that to consistantly win football games. If the teams you play against have more skill and better tactics and also put in the famous shift you will generally lose.
It may have been said before ( a few times! ) but you are too far away to comment on the way Wolves have been playing and you are a cheeky sod to critisise fans who do attend matches.
Since the New Year Wolves have played 17 league matches, won 7, lost 5, drawn 5. Looks fairly good on the surface but that disguises the fact that of the wins only Charlton could be discribed as a prospective play-off club. Putting a shift in can get points against struggling treams but the better teams invariably show us up. I wish it was different, but that's how it is this side of the Atlantic.
Plus the fact that for most of the season the football Wolves have been playing has been mediocre and on occasions even dire!
No. 7 George Bowen
17-04-2008, 17:31
Well it took 2 hrs before the inevitable boring b/s that because a person is 4,000 miles away he doesn't know what is going on.
MM is miss-managing the team is he? Let's examine that... last season he took a bare outfit and turned them into play off contenders. Bet he regrets that now for all the bloody gratitude he's received this season from so called supporters who turn at the first run of bad results.
Yes, he's made mistakes. It happens but it looks like he's learned from it and we've now played reasonably well in our last few matches. Also, it might have escaped your notice that the current miss management has us on the verge of the play offs again...not that the thick numbskulls will ever understand that football has its ups and downs and that the real time a team needs support is when things aren't going so well.
Every week some of us listen via internet / radio or whatever other means available to us and whilst we will always be second place to those who can attend that doesn't mean we aren't allowed our opinion.
My opinion is that some of our supporters have been an absolute disgrace this season. Note: I said some, not all. Those that start threads like this one are in that bracket IMO and the club is better off without them and their destructive nature. If that offends so be it.
Having 4 home games is by no means an advantage for them, what with their thoroughly unpleasant fans ready to turn on them at a moment's notice.
As the Palace fan said. For people to pretend that any club engages in comparable behaviour is simply wrong. Its unique to Wolves. http://forums.cpfc.org/showthread.php?threadid=168260&perpage=20&highlight=&pagenumber=1
When Sir Alex Ferguson said there is something fundamentally wrong with this club that has stopped this club achieving, he was right and I could tell him its the supporters without a doubt. There is a reason we always have promotion level away form but disctinctly average home form. To barrack a highly promising young player like Andy Keogh is disgusting. If players have no loyalty and leave this summer then congratulate yourselves, there is a reason all the players talked about the Freddy chants and it wasn't favourable to the club and the supporters (often grown men twice the players age). Vile.
Florida Wolfey
17-04-2008, 17:32
Sorry Florida, Mick hasn't learned anything new this season. Hence following the Boggies defeat he said his usual mantra: "we put a shift in"!
His teams certainly do. Unfortunately it takes more than that to consistantly win football games. If the teams you play against have more skill and better tactics and also put in the famous shift you will generally lose.
It may have been said before ( a few times! ) but you are too far away to comment on the way Wolves have been playing and you are a cheeky sod to critisise fans who do attend matches.
Since the New Year Wolves have played 17 league matches, won 7, lost 5, drawn 5. Looks fairly good on the surface but that disguises the fact that of the wins only Charlton could be discribed as a prospective play-off club. Putting a shift in can get points against struggling treams but the better teams invariably show us up. I wish it was different, but that's how it is this side of the Atlantic.
Hatch,
To me that suggests to me that we are exactly what we all think we are... an average team.
I think we're all disappointed that if we had had a decent team we would be walking away with the league but even Albion who are much better than us haven't achieved that.
I understand the frustration with MM, I truly do. I've felt it myself when hearing his team formations / picks but I really think we have to let this team build for a while longer rather than jumping on the managers and the players backs.
I do understand the frustration of those who go seeing players perform badly or a manager play players out of place but that's football. That's what we sign up for when we go to games or listen to them via whatever means available. I would also add that I've been there with you in the McGhee / Taylor etc days and its hard during the 90 mins to contain yourself when you see utter dross but the difference to me this time is we are building like we have never done before.
In the past we spent money on 28 year + players but this time its different and I had hoped that some people would have allowed for that. It seems not.
Florida Wolfey
17-04-2008, 17:35
Having 4 home games is by no means an advantage for them, what with their thoroughly unpleasant fans ready to turn on them at a moment's notice.
As the Palace fan said. http://forums.cpfc.org/showthread.php?threadid=168260&perpage=20&highlight=&pagenumber=1
He is not wrong. When Sir Alex Ferguson said there is something fundamentally wrong with this club that has stopped this club achieving, he was right and I could tell him its the supporters without a doubt.
Wolves have proved time and time again that they are bottlers. Looking at those fixtures I'd lay money on them slipping up at some point.
Agree with everything said.
Hatch End Wolf
17-04-2008, 17:38
Thanks Kenny.
If I could see some pattern of play or an obvious policy regarding the type of players Mick wants ( other than the ability to put in the famous shift ) I could accept this season's dross as a step on the road to a better team. However, players have been bought in, left out, frozen out, played out of position and others given first team places when they are barely first division quality.
Dispite the money spent the average skill level of the team has not improved this season. There is no doubt that Mick has the ability to produce a team of hard workers and for that he should be praised, but he shows no sign of wanting to encourage skillful play.
Del Woppio
17-04-2008, 17:41
You're wrong.
A fair crack of the whip is 5 or 6 games in a row starting with a settled team around you so you can learn how to play with them.
He has NOT been given a fair crack of the whip, just been expected to come in cold and score or he's dropped.
He needs to find himself a good club, with a decent manager and he could well get over 20 goals a season in the ccc.
He will be an asset to somone in this division, probably as they outperform us in a McIndoe style.
As well as the start of the season, he also started 5 (maybe 6) successive games in November/December, if I recall correctly.
northnorfolkwolf
17-04-2008, 17:46
Had Gera's shot been saved and we'd gone up the other end and SEB scored the winner I doubt these negative threads would appear and the site would have been full of 'when we get promoted ' threads!
Hatch End Wolf
17-04-2008, 17:59
Lot of "ifs" there Norfolk.
Face it we were outplayed by better players using better tactics and in my opinion they would have stepped up a gear if we'd scored.
The Boggies weren't quite as good as we made them appear, but like the rest of the teams at the top end of the league this season they've shown us up when it mattered. We are where we are through hard labour, bluff and bluster, but we lack essential ability in most positions and tactically we're generally poor.
Munro Munro
17-04-2008, 18:40
All clubs are moving and trying to improve their side, it seems to me that over the years the improvements we make are only keeping pace and cementing our usual six position in this div. We need a bit of a quantum leap to kick start us into a side that will win the div and be capable of staying up.
Atlas 1951
17-04-2008, 19:00
Amazing to think that in all the years since we got back into this division we've only challenged for top spot once! And that wasn't even the year we went up!:eek:
As well as the start of the season, he also started 5 (maybe 6) successive games in November/December, if I recall correctly.
Nah Del, you're wrong.
27 oct Ipswich, started
3 nov Bristol, bench
6 nov southampton, started
10 nov barnsley, started
25 nov wba, bench
28 nov colchester, started
1 dec preston, started
4 dec barnsley, bench
8 dec burnley, bench
15 dec qpr, bench
22 dec leicester, bench
26 dec hull, started
29 dec norwich, bench
He's been in and out the starting line up. He hasn't been given a fair crack of the whip. Whether or not you think he should have been, only a fool would suggest he had.
Florida Wolfey
17-04-2008, 20:36
John,
Surely this comes down to one simple question:
Has he performed when given the chance?
OK, he scored a couple of goals earlier in the season and established himself as a fans favourite but has he really contributed to the overall team play? A lot of our fans seem to think not.
John,
Surely this comes down to one simple question:
Has he performed when given the chance?
OK, he scored a couple of goals earlier in the season and established himself as a fans favourite but has he really contributed to the overall team play? A lot of our fans seem to think not.
No he hasn't made an instant impact.
I thought we were in the process on buying young players. Whats the point if we through them aside if they don't perform like seasoned pros?
Florida Wolfey
17-04-2008, 20:48
Eastwood is a funny case. I'm glad we have him and although I agree we haven't used him to his strengths, I tend to agree with most of our supporters who say he's not offered the team much.
Maybe MM should try changing the formation at times to encompass FE behind the front two from time to time?
Eastwood is a funny case. I'm glad we have him and although I agree we haven't used him to his strengths, I tend to agree with most of our supporters who say he's not offered the team much.
Maybe MM should try changing the formation at times to encompass FE behind the front two from time to time?
We have other players who haven't offered the team much this season.
S Ward, D Ward, S Elliot.
Young players will take time to establish themselves, if we want to buy young, we've got to give them that time, otherwise it's a flawed policy.
Eastwood is a funny case. I'm glad we have him and although I agree we haven't used him to his strengths, I tend to agree with most of our supporters who say he's not offered the team much.
Maybe MM should try changing the formation at times to encompass FE behind the front two from time to time?
Maybe Mick McCarthy should have researched the lad before he bought him. Surely If he'd done his homework he would have known before he bought him that he just Isn't a Mick player.
I just don't understand why Eastwood was bought In the first place. Maybe Mick thought he could coach him to his liking.
Atlas 1951
17-04-2008, 21:02
When Sir Alex Ferguson said there is something fundamentally wrong with this club that has stopped this club achieving, he was right and I could tell him its the supporters without a doubt.
I believe it was Graham Taylor that said that. Ferguson (who did turn us down in the early eighties, btw, because he could see the financial writing on the wall) recommended the club to Darron Gibson because of the atmosphere at Molineux, and also congratulated fans and team for their commitment when we beat them in the Prem season.
Florida Wolfey
17-04-2008, 21:07
Maybe Mick McCarthy should have researched the lad before he bought him. Surely If he'd done his homework he would have known before he bought him that he just Isn't a Mick player.
I just don't understand why Eastwood was bought In the first place. Maybe Mick thought he could coach him to his liking.
I think we bought him because he was available and we needed a striker. I think MM's preferred option ended up going to Sheff Utd.
I think we bought him because he was available and we needed a striker. I think MM's preferred option ended up going to Sheff Utd.
We wanted them both.
IIRC Elliot was the replacement for not landing Sharp.
Hatch End Wolf
17-04-2008, 22:07
It could be just one of things and Mick bought Freddie by acccident, when his first choice ( Sharpe ) went to Sheff. Utd.
On the other hand Mick's policy regarding players doesn't make much sense most of the time. So maybe he had the money and thought he should buy a well-known striker to cheer up the punters!
Good Yorkshire logic HEW!!! I believe you're right. (Or should that be "reet"?)
Hatch End Wolf
17-04-2008, 22:20
Right or Reet Kenny, either way it's been a waste of money, having Freddie on the books when Mick obviously doesn't rate him.
I still think he will go if Mick keeps his job at the end of the season, and I
Hatch End Wolf
17-04-2008, 22:21
................think another Championship manager will get 15-20 goals a season out of him!
i dont think its good enough to have a team full of ' ok squad players '. Average players are the reason we arent really gunning for promotion. We need a team of good players who perform consistently, not players who play 3 good games out of 10.
Edgmond Wolf
18-04-2008, 14:40
I don't know why so much effort is spent on talking about Eastwood.
I wanted him here, but admit I was wrong. Nothing personal and wish him well somewhere else in the future.
He has no future here whatsoever and the sooner hes gone the better it will be for us all.
I am beginning to feel this way too.
I really liked Freddie when he arrived however as time as gone on it is clear he is not a team player. He has a chip on his shoulder and frankly when he comes on he keeps hold of the ball and runs into trouble.
Whenever Freddie Freddie is sung in the South Bank I always start off the Keogh Keogh chants, at least he plays his heart out for the team
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