McCarthy looking for experience

[Mick Tranter]

That's the headline on BBC Sport, after all this I've heard from Monxey alls ummer stating the dersire to sign 'younger, hungrier' players (which is a statement I don't totally agree with myself) I am surprised the first thing McCarthy says is basically the opposite of the vibes from supporters and indeed Moxey all summer.

[Wivey Wolf]

New Wolves manager Mick McCarthy is keen to bring in some experienced players to balance out his largely inexperienced squad at Molineux.
McCarthy, who arrived at Molineux on Monday, told the club website: "We need some more senior players.
"With youngsters you get hunger and ambition, but you also get inexperience and a lack of physical presence. "So what we need to do is bring in some more players because the Championship is a difficult division."

Sounds sensible to me - and in line with what Jez has said (about needing youth and experience)

No surprise, just common sense

[Bunny Wolf]

Clapham will be pleased. Personally I think he'd be a good signing he's only 30 and far more solid than Naylor IMHO. The competition alone would improve Naylors game/focus,

[Mick Tranter]

New Wolves manager Mick McCarthy is keen to bring in some experienced players to balance out his largely inexperienced squad at Molineux.
McCarthy, who arrived at Molineux on Monday, told the club website: "We need some more senior players.
"With youngsters you get hunger and ambition, but you also get inexperience and a lack of physical presence. "So what we need to do is bring in some more players because the Championship is a difficult division."

Sounds sensible to me - and in line with what Jez has said (about needing youth and experience)

No surprise, just common sense

I tend to agree with you Wivey, it's just that Moxey has stated he wanted a change of culture at Wolves and he wanted the next manager to be scouring the lower leagues for young, promising players yet in McCarthys first press conference he says about the need for experience and jokes about being on the phone to Premier League managers this afternoon.

[AndyP]

Please not Kevin Kyle!!

[Wivey Wolf]

I tend to agree with you Wivey, it's just that Moxey has stated he wanted a change of culture at Wolves and he wanted the next manager to be scouring the lower leagues for young, promising players yet in McCarthys first press conference he says about the need for experience and jokes about being on the phone to Premier League managers this afternoon.

Jez has stated the need for a mix of youth and experience. It's just that on here, certain posters have taken it on themselves to pick out just the "youth" part and, by constant repetition, the myth arises that he only ever said that.

[yammer]

It makes perfect sense. What leaders do we have at the club at the moment once Ince (hopefully) retires? Breen and he's only just signed. The younger players need experienced leaders around and i fully agree with this.

[PREM.L.L]

Totally sensible imo. As long as they're not tooooooooo experienced.

[stuj4z]

a few players aged between 29-33 would be ok by me. we already have a very young squad and the addition of these older players would be a good move.

as long as they are not over 33 and are only offered 2 year contracts then i dont see the problem.

i would like us to still sign a few younger players, the 'young and hungry' type of players to compliment the elder statesmen.

[Florida Wolfey]

http://www.televisionheaven.co.uk/magicroundabout1.jpg

[Exile Wolf]

Therefore we could well see Matt Holland arrive latter this week.

[shaygriff]

I liked this part: "But at the moment we've only got 16 first-team players and my initials stand for Mick McCarthy, not Merlin the Magician."
Pity, I think we could do with a Merlin

[Nashie]

Has McCarthy worked with younger players before?

Youth and experience is exactly what we need.

[fenella]

I think McCarthy has learnt the hard way that the words 'commitment', 'youth'. 'hunger' and 'from the lower leagues' mean bugger all when you're in the Premiership (where he intends to be in 12 months time).

[Telford Wolf]

He wants to get the recruitment drive on the go, he said: "I'll be phoning managers up and down the country to try and get some players in.

"If my number comes up on their mobiles they shouldn't be surprised.

"At the moment we've only got 16 first-team players and my initials stand for Mick McCarthy, not Merlin the Magician." (classic)

[Axle]

Maybe we could have Colin Cameron or Alex Rae come in?

Do they constitute the type of players Merlin the Magician is targetting?

[robbeec]

I tend to agree with you Wivey, it's just that Moxey has stated he wanted a change of culture at Wolves and he wanted the next manager to be scouring the lower leagues for young, promising players yet in McCarthys first press conference he says about the need for experience and jokes about being on the phone to Premier League managers this afternoon.

He didnt actually mention what league he would be going for did he?

[Kenny-11]

He didnt actually mention what league he would be going for did he?

This is a strong pointer.......

Premier League managers

[Madtom]

Maybe we could have Colin Cameron or Alex Rae come in?

Do they constitute the type of players Merlin the Magician is targetting?


Merlin? i think more like this guy

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B0000DG5UE.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg

[yammer]

Premier League managers

How long till that usernames snapped up?!

[Kenny-11]

How long till that usernames snapped up?!

Damn the sock puppet rule :mad:

[EasternWolf]

Jez has stated the need for a mix of youth and experience. It's just that on here, certain posters have taken it on themselves to pick out just the "youth" part and, by constant repetition, the myth arises that he only ever said that.

what a wise man you are Wivey Wolf ...this week you have been mainly talking a great deal of sense...

[goldeneyed]

Of course you need youth and experience but we do not want another bunch of 30 years plus players, on highish salaries and two or three year contracts narrowing down the opportunities for the youngsters.

Don't mind the odd Bosman or free like Breen but if he starts spending hundreds of thousands (or basically what's left in the pot) on these kinds of players I will despair.

Above all in midfield and attack we badly need pace and energy, that normally means players in their early to mid twenties. Fine if he brings in experienced players around 25/26 but if they are all around Breen's age or older we are in for a dour time imv. Dublin (37), Campbell (36) Horsfield (33) are these the kind of players he will be looking to. If so why not keep Cameron, Kennedy and co? What with Breen and probably Clapham we will already have two added to the squad in their thirties. McNamara is 32 and Craddock 30, Oakes 32, Franko 32 ,Cort 28 . All very experienced so how many thirty plusses do we need to be lumbered with now? And don't forget 38/39 year old Ince who may still come on board.

A youth policy implies allowing the youngsters a chance to get a run in the team and also, when spending serious money, making sure it is on younger players and not has beens. But noone will be surprised if Moxey's conversion to an empahsis on youth is overturned within 24 hours of McCarthy's arrival.

Anyhow we will see. But I fear our club will never learn.

[fenella]

Above all in midfield and attack we badly need pace and energy, that means players in their early to mid twenties.

Agreed with the first half of your sentance. Disagree with the latter. There was plenty of pace and energy in Jones' early forward line-up of Newton/Cameron/Rae/Kennedy/Blake/Sturridge yet all of them fell into the "experienced" category and none of them were under 25. Compare them with the pace of youngsters like Leon Clarke, Carl Robinson, Keith Andrews or Simon Osborn and I don't see that there is always a link between pace and energy and age.

[wolf of sedgley]

If we end up signing a bunch of 32 year olds, i for one will not be very happy!

[goldeneyed]

Agreed with the first half of your sentance. Disagree with the latter. There was plenty of pace and energy in Jones' early forward line-up of Newton/Cameron/Rae/Kennedy/Blake/Sturridge yet all of them fell into the "experienced" category and none of them were under 25. Compare them with the pace of youngsters like Leon Clarke, Carl Robinson, Keith Andrews or Simon Osborn and I don't see that there is always a link between pace and energy and age.

Newton had pace and was 26 I think when we signed him. None of the others did particularly although Sturridge was nippy over six or seven yards in that one great season he had with us. Over 30 all players begin to slow down. Clarke is not a slouch - if only he could actually control the ball occasionally and shoot straight.

We definitely need extra zip in the Lennon mould. McCleod has that at least.

[Stuart Smith]

ummmmmm in light of recent events, may we assume that Newts pace was not entirely of his own making>??

[Wivey Wolf]

ummmmmm in light of recent events, may we assume that Newts pace was not entirely of his own making>??

I don't think coke is performance enhancing - it may explain his lethargy though...

[I.D.]

Jez has stated the need for a mix of youth and experience. It's just that on here, certain posters have taken it on themselves to pick out just the "youth" part and, by constant repetition, the myth arises that he only ever said that.

Where did he state that Wivey? I remember him saying something on those lines, but I can't find an article on WOW where he states it. The only one that I could find was one about the scouting system having to unearth gems from the lower leagues. It may have been on the E&S site, but they don't archive their stories.

[SaleWolf]

Problem is theres experience and then theres experience.

The first option is obviously the 28-31 year old bracket of players still in their prime looking for a big challenge (This is the road we need to go down)

The second option is 32 years old and over. Players past their best, with little else to offer and generally journeymen who would not improve the squad. I'd personally prefer the kids to them...

[Florida Wolfey]

Of course you need youth and experience but we do not want another bunch of 30 years plus players, on highish salaries and two or three year contracts narrowing down the opportunities for the youngsters.

Don't mind the odd Bosman or free like Breen but if he starts spending hundreds of thousands (or basically what's left in the pot) on these kinds of players I will despair.

I completely agree. It would also point to the fact that once again our priorities are all short term and that McCarthy has been told to get results within a year or two at most.

Experienced players on a free are OK providing they have something to offer. Transfer funds should be spent on young players with potential to improve and increase in value.

We have a great opportunity to build our team slowly but surely. Like you Goldeneyed, I rather fear we're going to end up lumbered with last pay check merchants on 2/3 year contracts instead.

[goldeneyed]

Problem is theres experience and then theres experience.

The first option is obviously the 28-31 year old bracket of players still in their prime looking for a big challenge (This is the road we need to go down)

The second option is 32 years old and over. Players past their best, with little else to offer and generally journeymen who would not improve the squad. I'd personally prefer the kids to them...

True. Depends if we are paying transfer fees or not. The player brought in at 29/30 for say 500k/600k on a three year contract has no sell on value. Of course it depends on whether players allow their contracts to run down etc but would'nt it be great to have a few players in their early twenties who actually go up in value for a change and which other clubs covet? Look at Curtis Davies. West Brom have already turned down a potential £5.5m profit on him within a year. And what about Nugent,Kitson, Lennon etc?

[Wivey Wolf]

I completely agree. It would also point to the fact that once again our priorities are all short term and that McCarthy has been told to get results within a year or two at most.

Experienced players on a free are OK providing they have something to offer. Transfer funds should be spent on young players with potential to improve and increase in value.

We have a great opportunity to build our team slowly but surely. Like you Goldeneyed, I rather fear we're going to end up lumbered with last pay check merchants on 2/3 year contracts instead.

If "short term" means consolidating our position in this division and preparing the youngsters with a view to a promotion bid in a couple of years, then I'm all for it. As long as we are paying reasonable wages, then I see nothing wrong with 2/3 year contracts.

[Deutsch Wolf]

would'nt it be great to have a few players in their early twenties who actually go up in value for a change and which other clubs covet?

Like say, Kenny Miller?

[Wivey Wolf]

Where did he state that Wivey? I remember him saying something on those lines, but I can't find an article on WOW where he states it. The only one that I could find was one about the scouting system having to unearth gems from the lower leagues. It may have been on the E&S site, but they don't archive their stories.

I'll have a look later - it's nearly going home time.:D

[Florida Wolfey]

Like say, Kenny Miller?

You can't account for stupid management. We had our chance to get money back on him and blew it. Let's just hope that next time a decision like this has to be made we decide to replace the player.

[Bunny Wolf]

It's just maintaining a balance and explaining to the younger players than any older players being brought to the club will be there to help them where possible.

Hopefully McCarthy will explain to all the players that regardless of age/experience you'll be picked on ability and that the youngsters can hold down a place in the team if they perform.

To keep our academdy strong we have to prove that we're a club that will play you when you're ready.

[goldeneyed]

If "short term" means consolidating our position in this division and preparing the youngsters with a view to a promotion bid in a couple of years, then I'm all for it. As long as we are paying reasonable wages, then I see nothing wrong with 2/3 year contracts.

Trouble is Wivey take someone like Riley who is 20 I think and very promising. With Breen, Craddock, Edwards (other signings?) and eventually Gyepes, never mind Clyde and Lowe, when is he actually going to get a run in the team?

These kinds of players need to start getting sub appearances and then full matches sooner rather than later. Otherwise they start getting loaned out to Darlington and at 23 or whatever they disappear on frees like Clingan, Melligan and co. This has just got to stop happening if we are going to move forward as a club.

It does take a bit of courage from the manager's point of view and obviously youngsters make mistakes, but then so do oldies. It seems to me that in Riley, Little, Jones, Davies, Hennessey and yes even Cornes we have a fine bunch of youngsters who need to be given every chance to progress....sooner rather than later or never at all.

[Florida Wolfey]

I don't see any talk about consolidating our position. Seems to me we're raising expectations again with McCarthy's talk of going for promotion.

We have half a team of 30 year olds, let's not add too many more please.

[goldeneyed]

Like say, Kenny Miller?

Gosh how clever DW.

You know perfectly well that the club has failed miserably over the years to improve players we have brought in and make a profit on them. We could at least have got some money back on Miller at various times if we had chosen to and Moxey turned down Sunderland's £1.25m in the last few months of his contract. How much will we get back on a 32 year old Franko? And yes, yawn yawn we all know players can let their contracts run down....

[TheDarkside]

what a wise man you are Wivey Wolf ...this week you have been mainly talking a great deal of sense to me ...

...

[wolfie smith]

lets give mick the magician a chance eh! younger players with potential can be scouted and bought in due time, i dont think any other manager has brought in a "gem" on his 1st day before, i think mick thinks were lightweight in midfield not in numbers but strong players.

[Ashley]

Like say, Kenny Miller?
you what???? he came for 3 million and if you think he was worth that a few months ago then you've had too much sun!! He came a 3 million pound player and IMO left valued at half that at best!

[Florida Wolfey]

you what???? he came for 3 million and if you think he was worth that a few months ago then you've had too much sun!! He came a 3 million pound player and IMO left valued at half that at best!

In fairness, the whole transfer market devalued from the time we signed Miller.

[Black Suit]

Jez has stated the need for a mix of youth and experience. It's just that on here, certain posters have taken it on themselves to pick out just the "youth" part and, by constant repetition, the myth arises that he only ever said that.

What the hell does Jez know anyway? :mad:

[Bevan]

Possible "experienced" signings mentioned so far:

Kevin Campbell
Matt Holland
Geoff Horsfield

Any more?

[Ashley]

In fairness, the whole transfer market devalued from the time we signed Miller.
but if anything he left a worse player not better! At the end of the day he came from one club in glasgow and has ended up at another so that shows how well he done here! I agree the market has dropped but a club wouldn't have offered us more than 2 million for him during his time here.

[Florida Wolfey]

but if anything he left a worse player not better! At the end of the day he came from one club in glasgow and has ended up at another so that shows how well he done here! I agree the market has dropped but a club wouldn't have offered us more than 2 million for him during his time here.
Miller did well for us. He was an integral part of the promotion side and I dare say that if we had stayed up, his value would have at least been what we paid for him.

It's really pointless arguing about wasted money in the past....we need to look forward and ensure we don't repeat the same mistakes IMO.

[TheDarkside]

Possible "rubbish" signings mentioned so far:

Kevin Campbell
Matt Holland
Geoff Horsfield

Any more?

...

[Wivey Wolf]

Trouble is Wivey take someone like Riley who is 20 I think and very promising. With Breen, Craddock, Edwards (other signings?) and eventually Gyepes, never mind Clyde and Lowe, when is he actually going to get a run in the team?

These kinds of players need to start getting sub appearances and then full matches sooner rather than later. Otherwise they start getting loaned out to Darlington and at 23 or whatever they disappear on frees like Clingan, Melligan and co. This has just got to stop happening if we are going to move forward as a club.

It does take a bit of courage from the manager's point of view and obviously youngsters make mistakes, but then so do oldies. It seems to me that in Riley, Little, Jones, Davies, Hennessey and yes even Cornes we have a fine bunch of youngsters who need to be given every chance to progress....sooner rather than later or never at all.

Quite right - and a balance needs to be struck. That's where Mick starts to earn his salary.

[Wivey Wolf]

I don't see any talk about consolidating our position. Seems to me we're raising expectations again with McCarthy's talk of going for promotion.

We have half a team of 30 year olds, let's not add too many more please.

Is he? I thought he was studiously avoiding mentioning the "P" word, so as not to raise expectations. A sort of "let's see what happens" approach.

[Florida Wolfey]

Is he? I thought he was studiously avoiding mentioning the "P" word, so as not to raise expectations. A sort of "let's see what happens" approach.
Look at the E&S web site.....probably crap journalism again but it stirs the fans up.

[stuj4z]

he said why not aim for promotion and you dont know what you are capable of until you try.

aim as high as possible is the attitude that we need now, and its refreshing to hear.

we cant think of the long term at the moment, we need to get a few experienced pro's in to replace the ones that have left, then we can think about developing the kids.

otherwise we will struggle.

[nimrod]

but if anything he left a worse player not better! At the end of the day he came from one club in glasgow and has ended up at another so that shows how well he done here! I agree the market has dropped but a club wouldn't have offered us more than 2 million for him during his time here.

I'd agree. I don't think any club would have offered us more than 2 mill for Miller at any time during his time with us...and that includes the day after we bought him for 3 mill.

I think the idea is to have a scouting network capable of finding young players who we think will improve rather than identifying someone "too good to be missed" who we end up overpaying for as a result.

Miller is however a good example of a player who contributed something to us for the whole of his contract - we bought him at a good age, maybe not at the right price.

[Wivey Wolf]

Look at the E&S web site.....probably crap journalism again but it stirs the fans up.

Can't find any direct quote from him on there - just the usual "buy your 35p copy" and Mr Tucker's on Wivey High Street doesn't stock it!

he said why not aim for promotion and you dont know what you are capable of until you try.

My interpretation of that is as I've already stated "let's see what happens"

[Cosmo Kramer]

if hes after experience surely bullys run out on saturday might see him given the nod for the coming season ?

[HazelGroveWolf]

My recollection of Jez Moxey's comments is as Wivey's. I'm not sure those comments were important, a lot has changed since Glenn Hoddle realised he wasn't up to the job. Jez was obviously reflecting the mood of the supporters at the time, in an honest way.
Merlin the Magician clearly needs time to create the right potion. Dogma on the lines of emphasis on youth will fail, pragmatism of finding the right blend might succeed. Surely that is the essence of football management? MM has a couple of seasons to demonstrate his worth, I'm hopeful that he will succeed.

[SOA Wolf]

My recollection was of talk of up-nad coming players from the lower leagues mixed with players from our youth academy....the only thing that has bothered me is that the first two signings since that comment and Hoddle left appear to be a couple of 'past their best' oldies from the PL, which is what we have been guilty of for years....and this time no manager to blame for it (so only managers are responsible for making purchases are they?)

Regardless of this, I am finding it amusing that people are talking about Moxey saying 'a mix of youth and experience' as though they are great words of wisdom......a mix of youth AND experience...no $$$$$ Sherlock...what sort of player does that leave that we cannot go for then?

Next they'll be saying he has great knowledge of literature because all the best book have been either fact or fiction.

)Just so some know ....because I know I have to explain it to them...clearly after some of the above comments.....I am not actually having a go at Moxey, but pointing out how pathetic some of the justifications and *rse licking comments about him are....that most of his comments are not great insight but merely soundbites with very little content)

[Devil's Slide Wolf]

I really hope we don't opt for another 'last gamble' kind of season and squander another opportunity to develop a more robust (and long term) vision for getting out this division....

[Wivey Wolf]

Regardless of this, I am finding it amusing that people are talking about Moxey saying 'a mix of youth and experience' as though they are great words of wisdom......a mix of youth AND experience...no $$$$$ Sherlock...what sort of player does that leave that we cannot go for then?

Next they'll be saying he has great knowledge of literature because all the best book have been either fact or fiction.

)Just so some know ....because I know I have to explain it to them...clearly after some of the above comments.....I am not actually having a go at Moxey, but pointing out how pathetic some of the justifications and *rse licking comments about him are....that most of his comments are not great insight but merely soundbites with very little content)

I obviously can't speak for everyone - but when I point out what Moxey has said, it's in the interest of attempting to present a balanced view, rather than "spinning", which appears to me to be hypocrisy of the highest order, as it's one of the criticisms regularly levelled at Jez and the club.

[I.D.]

I wish I could find that article again! I think the gist of it was that we would have to find the right blend of youth and experience, as opposed to buying a ready made team. It wasn't about spin, but more about economic reality. We will have to make use of younger players and cheaper, more experienced players, rather than trying to buy a complete team like Jones nearly did.

[axlerod]

I think that Breen is quite an astute signing and if we could we could get hold of a midfield enforcer and a forward capable of holding up the ball of a similar standard then we would have the framework to develop a decent side.
Hoddle extinguished a lot of hope last year by his tactics and the biggest challenge to Mick McCarthy is to recreate a team ethos and that will need strong characters.

[caradon wolf]

A very good friend is a Sunderland supporter who rates McCarthy very highly. He reckons Breen is still very good when dealing with play in front of him but has lost pace and quick forwards who play it on the deck run rings around him. He wondered whether Wolves would go in for Whitley - the sort of player MM likes a lot. They also have a young striker on the books that Mick rates.

[Wivey Wolf]

I wish I could find that article again! I think the gist of it was that we would have to find the right blend of youth and experience, as opposed to buying a ready made team. It wasn't about spin, but more about economic reality. We will have to make use of younger players and cheaper, more experienced players, rather than trying to buy a complete team like Jones nearly did.

There's this article on WOW: http://www.wolves.premiumtv.co.uk/page/News/NewsDetail/0,,10307~825208,00.html

[The manager] will rebuild with younger players and develop a healthy, hungry culture that we can all relate to.

The situation now is that we will have to play less experienced players, acquire Bosmans and use the loan system more.

We realise that the competitive advantage we have tried to buy in the past has not delivered the success we all wanted. Now I want to see the manager build a team that will overachieve.

I'm sure I read it elsewhere as well, setting it out even more clearly.

[I.D.]

Cheers Wivey, I think that was a little earlier than the one I found. It does say what I suggested it did, maybe people don't read it fully and just get the "sound bites" from it. There still seems to be a mis-apprehension that we need to spend millions to assemble a competetive side, Reading, Sheff Utd and Watford all didn't spend big.